Suns trade for Beal

Phrazbit

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It wouldn’t have. The Blazers are going to wants picks AND a young rising star.

Anyone thinking we could have just added to our core for a generational type talent to get us back to legit title contention without actually breaking that core up is lying to themselves.

And we would have become desperate to make a deal after another playoff failure with the knowledge that CP3 was completely washed.

They are not going to get it.

Miami has all the leverage, they are going to get Lillard for a pittance of his value.

They are holding the blazers feet to the flame, just as we should have with Brooklyn.
 

JCSunsfan

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They are not going to get it.

Miami has all the leverage, they are going to get Lillard for a pittance of his value.

They are holding the blazers feet to the flame, just as we should have with Brooklyn.
We could have held Brooklyn's feet to the flame and they could have just said no. The trade deadline would have passed and then by the summer, KD could have been thinking about something completely different. We also had a shot in this year's playoffs, especially if KD had not gotten injured in warmups right after he started to play for the Suns. We would have lost a half year of KD or maybe KD altogether while we argued over a pick or two.
 

Mainstreet

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I have no desire to revisit the topic, but the differences among posters about the Durant trade was much more than about a draft pick or two.
 

Yuma

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I am just waiting to see these guys get together this off season, with social media posts floating out there. I know Beal has mentioned in interviews he's ready to chop it up with Book and KD. It seems like he is going to bring some energy to the trio mix! Bring on the work out videos and summer session videos.
 

Cheesebeef

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So as bad as some people feel we overpaid for KD, then they have to be honest and admit we underpaid for Beal.
Here’s the thing… when you trade for KD, you have to take into consideration more than him as a player. He also brings star magnetization pull to the franchise which can’t be ignored.

And when you add that to Booker, it makes for a super powerful gravitational pull we wouldn’t have otherwise.
 

Yuma

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Here’s the thing… when you trade for KD, you have to take into consideration more than him as a player. He also brings star magnetization pull to the franchise which can’t be ignored.

And when you add that to Booker, it makes for a super powerful gravitational pull we wouldn’t have otherwise.
Just like CP3, got the gravity raised by joining Booker. It could be argued he helped Book reach a higher level of play, which then attracted Book's friend KD to want to come to Phoenix. KD comes to Phoenix, then Beal uses his no trade clause to force his way to Phoenix. By then, free agency hit, and a lot of guys wanted to be here. If all goes as planned, and a championship results next season, how much more will the gravity get?
 

Covert Rain

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Each season in the playoffs being 1 playoff trip. The Finals run was the first experience anyone other Paul and Crowder had. Yes, they disappointed against Dallas after starting the series hot but that happens. Nothing says the door was slammed shut at that point.

People said the Warriors window was closed when KD left, when Klay couldn't get healthy, and they won last last year after spending time in the lottery. They'd won before, so knew what it took to get back there but without a major acquisition they were counted out by a lot of people. It takes luck as well as talent to win championships and the team we had was talented, regardless of Paul regressing. We saw he could also be dealt for something of value as he was moved twice, for Beal and for Poole.

There's far too many variables to say the window was closed on a team with 4 of its 5 best players 25 or younger.
I didn't say slammed shut. I said regressed since getting to the finals. The team needed some major moves to stop regressing and that wasn't going to happen with Sarver for reasons we have gone over again and again. My rebuttal was on the idea that it was hard to argue they were not going to win a title. Again..no it's not.
 

clyde2tw

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Hindsight is 20/20. I'm quite happy with the Suns roster as is.
That being said, I believe the major bottleneck why the Suns of the past 3 years had no chance to win it all was Monty, who is unable to make adjustments to fully exploit the talent within the roster. In the current loss to Denver, CP3's injury was much less crucial than Book's game 5 injury via JeffG's malicious foul. More time to integrate KD may also have helped more, whose off. efficiency was less than expected.
FWIW, missing out on Crowder for Hachimura trade was a bigger issue than whether we overpaid a bit for KD. Imagine a DA/KD/Hachimura/Book/Beal starting 5, with the same bench maybe sans Diop.
 

Ouchie-Z-Clown

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There is no question the Suns underpaid for Beal.

Of course, there are the usual caveats about injury, but this trade greatly reduced the combined cost of assets in both trades.

It's almost like the second trade balanced the Durant trade.

Without the trade for Beal, the Suns would have been in a very precarious position going forward. It helped lead to a landslide of free agency success.
I would argue that it more than balanced the trade for Durant. Let’s assume that the Durant was an overpay. Even if it was, it was only by some factor. The entirety of the package paid for Durant wasn’t an overpay. If we removed bridges from the deal I think most here would be happy with the deal. So four firsts, swaps, cam Johnson and crowder was value for KD. The beal was completely different. Not only did we give up little of value, we rid ourselves of two burdensome contracts and also netted a young player of promise. In essence it was nothing but a win for us.

So I look at it like this:

KD > picks, swaps, cam, crowder

Beal, Goodwin, rid of Paul contract, rid of shamet contract > bridges, Paul, shamet, swap, 2nd round picks
 

Phrazbit

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I would argue that it more than balanced the trade for Durant. Let’s assume that the Durant was an overpay. Even if it was, it was only by some factor. The entirety of the package paid for Durant wasn’t an overpay. If we removed bridges from the deal I think most here would be happy with the deal. So four firsts, swaps, cam Johnson and crowder was value for KD. The beal was completely different. Not only did we give up little of value, we rid ourselves of two burdensome contracts and also netted a young player of promise. In essence it was nothing but a win for us.

So I look at it like this:

KD > picks, swaps, cam, crowder

Beal, Goodwin, rid of Paul contract, rid of shamet contract > bridges, Paul, shamet, swap, 2nd round picks

I don’t think the Beal and KD trades go hand in hand. The primary reasons we got Beal were because Ishbia don’t give a rat’s butt about the financials and Paul’s extremely team friendly option contract.

KD could never have come here and Paul’s deal would still make us the most appealing team for a Beal trade.

I love the Beal trade, I also know his contact sucks… but it doesn’t matter to us because we’re blowing the lid off the cap anyway.

In the Beal trade we used our leverage to advantage, in the KD trade we failed to do so to a maximum degree.
 

JCSunsfan

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I don’t think the Beal and KD trades go hand in hand. The primary reasons we got Beal were because Ishbia don’t give a rat’s butt about the financials and Paul’s extremely team friendly option contract.

KD could never have come here and Paul’s deal would still make us the most appealing team for a Beal trade.

I love the Beal trade, I also know his contact sucks… but it doesn’t matter to us because we’re blowing the lid off the cap anyway.

In the Beal trade we used our leverage to advantage, in the KD trade we failed to do so to a maximum degree.
Your assumption that we could have gotten a better deal for Durant is just not provable by any means.
 

AzStevenCal

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Your assumption that we could have gotten a better deal for Durant is just not provable by any means.
Of course it's not. But that would apply to most of the topics discussed on this forum. We know we didn't get a better deal and that's all we really know, everything else is conjecture including the claim that we couldn't have gotten a better deal.

For me, there are plenty of reasons to believe that had we been patient for a few more hours we would have gotten a better deal but that means very little to anyone on the other side of the argument. And we all know it's a waste of time to argue one way or the other on this subject. We have two very decided opinions on this matter, but again, that's the way this board works.
 

Yuma

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There's a third argument. Pragmatism. What happened happened. There's no use arguing either way since you can't change the outcome. You can just go forward with the team's moves as is. That's been my position. Who care's? We weren't in the room and really don't know what was said. Maybe they wanted MORE and we said no. Who here knows? It is what it is, and just move forward.
 

ASUCHRIS

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I don’t think the Beal and KD trades go hand in hand. The primary reasons we got Beal were because Ishbia don’t give a rat’s butt about the financials and Paul’s extremely team friendly option contract.
Wrong - the primary reason we got Beal was because Beal was the ONLY player in the NBA with a full no trade clause. The Wizards had no leverage, and once Beal decided he wanted to come to the Suns, it was fait accompli.
 

AzStevenCal

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There's a third argument. Pragmatism. What happened happened. There's no use arguing either way since you can't change the outcome. You can just go forward with the team's moves as is. That's been my position. Who care's? We weren't in the room and really don't know what was said. Maybe they wanted MORE and we said no. Who here knows? It is what it is, and just move forward.
I don't know if that's really a third argument but that's basically where I'm at with this. I have no desire to argue the specifics, what's done is done. My opinion hasn't changed and isn't going to change unless new facts come out but none of it matters. We ended up with a roster that on paper, can win it all. Maybe it will be a huge fail but I can't argue with the effort from this front office to put us into contention. They spent aggressively and potentially improved this team far more than I would have thought was possible.
 

CardsSunsDbacks

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I don’t think the Beal and KD trades go hand in hand. The primary reasons we got Beal were because Ishbia don’t give a rat’s butt about the financials and Paul’s extremely team friendly option contract.

KD could never have come here and Paul’s deal would still make us the most appealing team for a Beal trade.

I love the Beal trade, I also know his contact sucks… but it doesn’t matter to us because we’re blowing the lid off the cap anyway.

In the Beal trade we used our leverage to advantage, in the KD trade we failed to do so to a maximum degree.
I think they do because we don’t get Beal without getting Durant first. Beal does not force his way to us otherwise and that is the only reason he was so cheap.
 

Cheesebeef

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I think they do because we don’t get Beal without getting Durant first. Beal does not force his way to us otherwise and that is the only reason he was so cheap.
I just can’t believe people refuse to acknowledge this reality. The KD/Booker combo is what drew Beal. They’re the sexiest/marquee duo in the league. A 3rd star looks at that combo and says to themselves we are winning titles together. That doesn’t happen with Booker/Bridges, especially since Bridges wouldn’t have had the 25 game explosion he did carrying the offense for the Nets.

We also probably would have seen Bridges totally ish the bed in the playoffs like he always does… and did even with the Nets, which would have made the Booker/Bridges an even more dubious title contending bet.
 

Yuma

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I just can’t believe people refuse to acknowledge this reality. The KD/Booker combo is what drew Beal. They’re the sexiest/marquee duo in the league. A 3rd star looks at that combo and says to themselves we are winning titles together. That doesn’t happen with Booker/Bridges, especially since Bridges wouldn’t have had the 25 game explosion he did carrying the offense for the Nets.

We also probably would have seen Bridges totally ish the bed in the playoffs like he always does… and did even with the Nets, which would have made the Booker/Bridges an even more dubious title contending bet.
I read a good Nets piece on how they say they expect Bridges to struggle this next season. He is now going to get the Booker double team treatment by other teams. Even as good as Book is offensively, it took him a while to learn to play through that. Plus Book passes out of it, and with KD and Beal, that's not so much a problem. It will be a problem with the Nets, and Bridges and his team will have to adapt to that.
 

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It was serendipitous the Wizards decided to rebuild and parted ways with Bradley Beal this summer.

If the Wizards didn't blow it up, the Durant-Beal trade wouldn't have happened.
 

Yuma

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It was serendipitous the Wizards decided to rebuild and parted ways with Bradley Beal this summer.

If the Wizards didn't blow it up, the Durant-Beal trade wouldn't have happened.
serendipitous, or a response to your best player saying he wants out? Chicken and egg argument coming! :)
 

Mainstreet

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serendipitous, or a response to your best player saying he wants out? Chicken and egg argument coming! :)

The chicken and egg argument didn't occur until after the trade for Kevin Durant. The Wizards didn't blow it up until this summer.
 

Mainstreet

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There's a third argument. Pragmatism. What happened happened. There's no use arguing either way since you can't change the outcome. You can just go forward with the team's moves as is. That's been my position. Who care's? We weren't in the room and really don't know what was said. Maybe they wanted MORE and we said no. Who here knows? It is what it is, and just move forward.

I can buy the pragmatic argument. The Suns paid the asking price for Kevin Durant no matter how we view it.

However, Phoenix was really fortunate the Bradley Beal situation came along. Otherwise, it's hard to see the Suns putting a roster together that could contend and the wave of good fortune that followed.

No matter what one thinks about Deandre Ayton, I find it amazing they still have a trade chip left.

Also, the Wizards came out of the situation much better than I could have dreamed.
 
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