Snakester…Harry… HELP!

Totally_Red

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you won’t be getting as much from me going forward. The connections were close to Keim and that FO.

Even without Payton I guarantee Monti plugs a lot of leaks.
That is good news. It always bugged me that Peter Schrager always knew our first round pick days in advance. That is a huge tactical disadvantage that well-run organizations don't have.
 

Goldfield

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100% agree. Also SP has all the decision making ability. He won't coach somewhere he doesn't want to.

If anything, the Saints become more desperate because if there's only one team left, and the Cards don't like the deal, SP can sit and the Saints get nothing.

If there are several other teams available, the Saints will just wait for other team's offers.
This 100% imo
 

Cardinal88

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That’s not how this works especially since there’s still a good relationship between Payton and the Saints. They know it’s time to move on so ownership is not going to nickel and dime a partner. They’ll get fair value based on past deals and everyone will go on with their lives.
I’ve said all along, a 3rd rounder this year and something next year. I even said if we need to give up our 2nd this year is good value for both teams. A lot of fans trying to say Saints are gaining leverage is hogwash. Like you said relationship, fair value is where this will land.
 

Totally_Red

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I’ve said all along, a 3rd rounder this year and something next year. I even said if we need to give up our 2nd this year is good value for both teams. A lot of fans trying to say Saints are gaining leverage is hogwash. Like you said relationship, fair value is where this will land.
I think this year's 2 will be part of the compensation with maybe a 3 or 4 next year. It will take 2 picks IMO
 

JeffGollin

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Both MI and Sears carry a NE vibe. Is this the direction M Bidwill wants to take the team, and does Sean carry a NE angle that would make him more attractive to the Cards?
 
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FB94

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The silence and lack of others for second interviews still lends hope for Payton. Plus the fact Fangio is still out there as early whispers they were tied together. Something needs to give by Sunday
 

Harry

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Thanks for that update Harry. I actually meant what are the odds on him actually being our coach.
I’d put that at 3/2 with the 2 being Fox. Those are the only real choices on the table in my opinion.
 

Totally_Red

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I’d put that at 3/2 with the 2 being Fox. Those are the only real choices on the table in my opinion.
To me the Fox gig doesn't seem that great other than the money. I mean he is on the pre-pre game show with equal billing with two ex-jocks. If he goes back to Fox, he should negotiate getting to the real pre game show.
 

Zalixar

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Still interested in the Fangio development. He's been linked to Miami and Carolina. Perhaps still waiting for Payton.

Isn't it a bit late in the cycle to fire VJ, as other positions already interviewed/will be closed so he will completely miss a window? Not sure how that will all work out. Fangio and Payton would have this a perennial playoff team in 2 years.
 

don7031

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I'm having a hard time envisioning the Cardinals signing Payton and giving him full control. You have to assume that Keim and Kingsbury had partially guaranteed contracts so they are on the books for four more years. That is a lot of money coming out of Mike's pocket. And on the control side they are going from the head coach has no say to the head coach controls everything.
 
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slanidrac16

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Still interested in the Fangio development. He's been linked to Miami and Carolina. Perhaps still waiting for Payton.

Isn't it a bit late in the cycle to fire VJ, as other positions already interviewed/will be closed so he will completely miss a window? Not sure how that will all work out. Fangio and Payton would have this a perennial playoff team in 2 years.
Well nobody else has requested permission to talk to VJ for their head coaching job, so there’s that.
VJ could still be let go and collect his salary.
On the other hand if Payton comes here and turns this offense into a top 10 offense in scoring, a VJ defense might be good enough.
I said going into this season our offense would have to score 28th a game to have a chance at winning. The onus was on the offense and it came up way short.
 

Minski

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I'm having a hard time envisioning the Cardinals signing Payton and giving him full control. You have to assume that Keim and Kingsbury had partially guaranteed contracts so they are on the books for four more years. That is a lot of money coming out of Mike's pocket. And on the control side they are going from the head coach has no say to the head coach controls everything.

Yes, but you would be going from a 1st time NFL HC to a Superbowl winning HC with a 1st time GM. It should be a collaborative thing and always struck me as odd that the HC wouldn’t have final say on players. GM should be lining them up for the coach to decide and if they get a thumbs up the GM gets them and does contract stuff etc. Thats what I think anyway
 

Minski

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Well nobody else has requested permission to talk to VJ for their head coaching job, so there’s that.
VJ could still be let go and collect his salary.
On the other hand if Payton comes here and turns this offense into a top 10 offense in scoring, a VJ defense might be good enough.
I said going into this season our offense would have to score 28th a game to have a chance at winning. The onus was on the offense and it came up way short.

VJs defenses are bad. Although my knock on him has been his inability to develop young players. He only seems to put them into meaningful snaps if forced by an injury to the washed up journeyman he has top of his depth chart… oh and the run D and 3rd and long D makes me want to smash the TV most the time… so I need him to go as it’s costing me a fortune in TV repairs
 
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slanidrac16

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VJs defenses are bad. Although my knock on him has been his inability to develop young players. He only seems to put them into meaningful snaps if forced by an injury to the washed up journeyman he has top of his depth chart… oh and the run D and 3rd and long D makes me want to smash the TV most the time… so I need him to go as it’s costing me a fortune in TV repairs
I get that. But on the other hand the personnel today and going into this season is/was below average. And when you don’t have the horses to get to the Qb you are forced to come up with assinine blitz packages. Also weren’t we down to our 3rd and 4th cb’s starting?
I’m not endorsing VJ to stay and certainly not as our head coach. I’m simply trying to analyze how this organization might look at things.
All that being said I doubt very much if Payton is hired he’d be talked into keeping VJ as his DC. I would not be surprised if VJ is retained in another capacity IF he would accept that.
 

oaken1

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I get that. But on the other hand the personnel today and going into this season is/was below average. And when you don’t have the horses to get to the Qb you are forced to come up with assinine blitz packages. Also weren’t we down to our 3rd and 4th cb’s starting?
I’m not endorsing VJ to stay and certainly not as our head coach. I’m simply trying to analyze how this organization might look at things.
All that being said I doubt very much if Payton is hired he’d be talked into keeping VJ as his DC. I would not be surprised if VJ is retained in another capacity IF he would accept that.
Pretty sure Payton would secure a position for Fangio in his discussions.
But if VJ stays on i aint real concerned. The dynamic will be totally different.
VJ was hired as DC because we wanted a guy with HC experience to help kk adjust to the nfl... due to that, imo, there was basically zero oversight on the defense. Kliff ran the offense and let Vance run the defense.
That wont be the case with Sean Payton as HC... if he doesnt like what Vance is running, it will change.

That being said. Mike seems to like VJ so even if we hire Fangio i could see Vance staying on as a defensive assistant, just to keep him active until the next round of coaching hires next january.
 

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