David Peralta is the real deal

[Weenus O'Baggins]

Yes, I do mean the 23 yr old SP who has been worth about 2 more wins this season than the guy he was traded for, but also the CF who is worth another 2 wins this year both costing around $4M less total. We will not turn Trumbo into 4+ wins at $4M less a year in any trade we can get for him.

A whole 2 wins? Wow that an impact....that is exactly the edge we have been looking for.

The center fielder got traded for our crappy closer. Get that part right

AND...we have two guys better than Spanky already.

Hmm..Reed is under a 4 ERA. I am actually shocked.

 

[DWKB]

I would say both are small sample sizes. The truth is going to be somewhere in the middle. Likely more in line with his career average of around .250

In the last two seasons worth of PAs (1118) going back to July of 2012 Trumbo has put up a batting line of .228/.282/.406 for an OPS less than 700.

I wouldn't bet on him finishing the season with an avg as high as .250.

 

[DWKB]

A whole 2 wins? Wow that an impact....that is exactly the edge we have been looking for.

The center fielder got traded for our crappy closer. Get that part right

AND...we have two guys better than Spanky already.

Hmm..Reed is under a 4 ERA. I am actually shocked.

4 wins and Davidson was traded for Reed. Your ignorance seems only to be surpassed by your arrogance. :-/

 

[Weenus O'Baggins]

In the last two seasons worth of PAs (1118) going back to July of 2012 Trumbo has put up a batting line of .228/.282/.406 for an OPS less than 700.

I wouldn't bet on him finishing the season with an avg as high as .250.

That is pure cherry picking. If you take all of 2012 his average is .246, which is right in line with his career averages.

Try again...

 

[Weenus O'Baggins]

4 wins and Davidson was traded for Reed. Your ignorance seems only to be surpassed by your arrogance. :-/

Basically the same deal in separate transactions that occurred concurrently.

You specifically mentioned the center fielder, which is why I said we had better players ready to take that spot.

Lamb versus Davidson should be interesting to watch in the future.

Nothing says "I have lost this discussion and have nowhere to go" like name calling. Wouldn't expect anything else from you.

However, I would love you to continue. Please give me the reason to give you a long and well deserved break.

 

[82CardsGrad]

In the last two seasons worth of PAs (1118) going back to July of 2012 Trumbo has put up a batting line of .228/.282/.406 for an OPS less than 700.

I wouldn't bet on him finishing the season with an avg as high as .250.

The ONLY value I would possible ascribe to Trumbo would be his homerun hitting ability. I wouldn't care so much about his other stats (avg, OB% or OPS), if he were hitting 30 HR's or more a season. However, given that he doesn't seem able to even do that, though he's playing in a much more homerun friendly ballpark, I think it's quite simple to suggest that he has been a HUGE disappointment and that KT got beat - again - in this trade...

 

[82CardsGrad]

Basically the same deal in separate transactions that occurred concurrently.

You specifically mentioned the center fielder, which is why I said we had better players ready to take that spot.

Lamb versus Davidson should be interesting to watch in the future.

Nothing says "I have lost this discussion and have nowhere to go" like name calling. Wouldn't expect anything else from you.

However, I would love you to continue. Please give me the reason to give you a long and well deserved break.

I fully anticipate Lamb to not just beat Davidson in terms of production over the next 3-5 years, but destroy Davidson...
So now that I fully jinxed Lamb, I'll disappear from this thread!

 

[DWKB]

Basically the same deal in separate transactions that occurred concurrently.

You specifically mentioned the center fielder, which is why I said we had better players ready to take that spot.

Lamb versus Davidson should be interesting to watch in the future.

Nothing says "I have lost this discussion and have nowhere to go" like name calling. Wouldn't expect anything else from you.

However, I would love you to continue. Please give me the reason to give you a long and well deserved break.

This debate started with the question of value received vs value given. Having an option to replace that value doesn't make it worth less, it makes it expendable. Which makes the point useless.

Saying Reed was traded for Eaton is ignorant. Telling me I got it wrong is arrogant. Threatening a ban for being called out on your ignorant statement is I would hope an abuse of power and something that should get your power removed IMO.

I am just observing the traits your displaying.

 

[Weenus O'Baggins]

This debate started with the question of value received vs value given. Having an option to replace that value doesn't make it worth less, it makes it expendable. Which makes the point useless.

Saying Reed was traded for Eaton is ignorant. Threatening a ban for being called out on your ignorant statement is arrogant and I would hope an abuse of power.

I am just observing the traits your displaying.

I clarified that Eaton and Davidson were part of a set of concurrent trades to the white sox that netted Reed.

Really the trades were ultimately:

Eaton
Skaggs
Davidson

for

Trumbo
Reed

I don't particularly care for Trumbo and Reed but I would say that it isn't this one sided craziness that people claim, especially with Skaggs being the same middling starter who is now out for two seasons.

And you called me arrogant before I threated to ban you. Here is the deal, the rules are no personal attacks.

So you can either:

A) Knock it off and have a conversation without getting personal, which are the standards of this board.

or


B) Go away until I feel like letting you post here again.

That isn't an abuse of power. That is enforcing the standards of the board that you repeatedly have broken and been banned for in the past. You are one of the 3 posters that I get consistent complaints about. You don't have any leeway with me.

The fact that you insulted me is actually the only reason you aren't a month plus banned right now. If it was anyone else I wouldn't bother with the warning.

 

[DWKB]

I clarified that Eaton and Davidson were part of a set of concurrent trades to the white sox that netted Reed.

Really the trades were ultimately:

Eaton
Skaggs
Davidson

for

Trumbo
Reed

I don't particularly care for Trumbo and Reed but I would say that it isn't this one sided craziness that people claim, especially with Skaggs being the same middling starter who is now out for two seasons.

And you called me arrogant before I threated to ban you. Here is the deal, the rules are no personal attacks.

So you can either:

A) Knock it off and have a conversation without getting personal, which are the standards of this board.

or


B) Go away until I feel like letting you post here again.

That isn't an abuse of power. That is enforcing the standards of the board that you repeatedly have broken and been banned for in the past. You are one of the 3 posters that I get consistent complaints about. You don't have any leeway with me.

The fact that you insulted me is actually the only reason you aren't a month plus banned right now. If it was anyone else I wouldn't bother with the warning.

I called you arrogant because you mocked my point and took visual glee in me being incorrect and getting to correct me even when I wasn't wrong because you personally don't like me. Before the mocking and glee at my supposed mistake, I made nothing but benign comments about the team.


The standards of the board shouldn't let that happen, especially by a moderator.


As to the trades in question, I don't see how they are "linked" because getting a closer or trading a 3B MiB has nothing to do with a CF/SP for a LF. The conflation of the two just makes the Trumbo trade look better by borrowing the value gained in the Reed trade. You could have gotten Reed without Trumbo, so they don't need to be linked.

Losing 4 wins in one year for $4M more in salary is a bad trade. Make enough of those and you get a bad team. We will not win a trade of Trumbo for that kind of value gained salary saved regardless of when we trade him.

 

[Weenus O'Baggins]

I don't believe we will be trading Trumbo unless we are similarly poor next year. He is our left fielder for the near future.

Will that bring more value than Skaggs? Going to be hard to say with Skaggs injury. I can say with confidence that both are sub par players.

 

[Weenus O'Baggins]

I called you arrogant because you mocked my point and took visual glee in me being incorrect and getting to correct me even when I wasn't wrong because you personally don't like me. Before the mocking and glee at my supposed mistake, I made nothing but benign comments about the team.


The standards of the board shouldn't let that happen, especially by a moderator.

As far as this....

You were in the wrong to make it personal. Until there is a Moderator next to your name on this board...You don't set standards, you don't judge standards, and you don't question standards (at least publicly. You can say whatever you want to me via PM)

But you already know all this from the myriad of similar confrontations you have had in the past in multiple areas of this board.

And this does mean this particular part of this topic is done. As I said, you are welcome to insult me privately all you like. I have never banned anyone for that.

 

[BC867]

Thank you, Chris, for reacting to this kind of comment.

Your ignorance seems only to be surpassed by your arrogance. :-/

I support you calling out those few posters who are more intent on winning a debate at all costs by attacking the poster rather than discussing opposing opinions.

How 'bout you deputize all of us who have been the victim of comments like that?

 

[Weenus O'Baggins]

BC if you want to moderate send me a PM and what board you are interested in. I will see what the admins say. You would have my vote in the Suns board.

 

[Weenus O'Baggins]

As always, posts questioning moderation on this board will be trashed. You are welcome to address them in PM.

 

[Lefty]

I don't believe we will be trading Trumbo unless we are similarly poor next year. He is our left fielder for the near future.

Will that bring more value than Skaggs? Going to be hard to say with Skaggs injury. I can say with confidence that both are sub par players.

I think there are teams that need a power hitter for the stretch run will inquire about Trumbo.

 

[ActingWild]

 

[Diamondback Jay]

The ONLY value I would possible ascribe to Trumbo would be his homerun hitting ability. I wouldn't care so much about his other stats (avg, OB% or OPS), if he were hitting 30 HR's or more a season. However, given that he doesn't seem able to even do that, though he's playing in a much more homerun friendly ballpark, I think it's quite simple to suggest that he has been a HUGE disappointment and that KT got beat - again - in this trade...

Joe, not to disagree with you; but Trumbo has proven capability of doing just that in the not to distant past. His OBP has always been lousy and his OPS has been middle of the pack. The one thing he has always brought to the table is ability to hit for power. In his first three full seasons as a starter, he hit 29, 32 and 34 and drove in over 85 RBI each season. I can't say he wouldn't have done it this year because he was on his way to it prior to getting hurt.

 

[82CardsGrad]

Joe, not to disagree with you; but Trumbo has proven capability of doing just that in the not to distant past. His OBP has always been lousy and his OPS has been middle of the pack. The one thing he has always brought to the table is ability to hit for power. In his first three full seasons as a starter, he hit 29, 32 and 34 and drove in over 85 RBI each season. I can't say he wouldn't have done it this year because he was on his way to it prior to getting hurt.

Yea... That's my point really. If he were at least hitting hr's like he has done in the past, I think most of us could find a way to get on board with him on the team... And who knows, maybe the injury messed him up for the season. But since he's been back, he has consistently said he is 100%. And yet he can't find his HR mojo...

 

[Phrazbit]

Even if he were on a decent home run clip he still would not have a place on this team. He has too many deficiencies, IMO you cant consistently play someone who cant field his position AND cant get on base. It would be one thing if he was pulling an Adam Dunn routine, where he hits for power but sucks in the field, and cant hit for average... but still draws a ton of walks. Trumbo's career on base percentage is below .300... thats 30 points lower than Mark Reynolds. You combine that with his abysmal defense... its an ugly picture. And I'm talking based on his career, not just this year.

As an outfielder he is an unserviceable player and it should have been obvious before he ever got here.

 

[BC867]

As an outfielder he is an unserviceable player and it should have been obvious before he ever got here.

But since Goldy went down, Trumbo has been serviceable, playing his natural position of 1B and giving us a cleanup hitter (whom they have been pitching around, just as they did with Goldy when he hit in front of Miggy).

Not ideal, but I'm glad that he's here for the rest of the season.