Gandhi mock draft

[iLLmatiC]

I would love to see your results over the past few years and compare them to Monti's, Gandhi.

 

[Stout]

Well, I disagree. There is none other than Freeling, though. The only other that would be "a Big John", as you call it, at #3 is Reese, and he got drafted at #2.

Then why isn't Freeling at or near the top of any draft boards?

 

[Stout]

No offense, I know why Freeling is being elevated in the first round but it is not to do the quality of his play. His tape is very up and down, and he is a huge work in progress. He is being elevated due to his combine, his potential, and the fact that neither Mauigoa nor Fano are deemed LTs.

Oh, a combine riser? Even more no thanks at 3.

 

[dreamcastrocks]

First round

In the game we are only allowed to use picks from this year to trade, so it would have cost a potential buyer most of their entire draft to buy my pick. Not surprisingly, nobody wanted to do that.

With the #3 pick the Arizona Cardinals select

Monroe Freeling, offensive tackle, Georgia

So, also not surprisingly, I chose the top ranked player. My biggest worry with Freeling is that he has played on the left for all his games at Georgia, while players like Blake Miller and Iheanachor are naturally right sided. However, Freeling is the most talented, with the biggest developmental potential, and the only OT who meets the value of the #3 overall pick.

No matter if it is Brissett, or if I draft a QB later, he must be better protected than last season. It was embarrassing to see Jonah Williams – or anyone else playing RT – get beaten over and over and over again. It’s fine that they have brought in multiple offensive linemen, but none of them are even close to the talent Freeling is.

There are few picks I'd like less at 3.

 

[Chopper0080]

I guess you haven't watched the tape I have. And you can also watch the Senior Bowl practices.

Further, the draft is about the future. I wrote in the beginning of the original post how my approach would reflect that.

Yeah...I watched the tape of him being on the ground, a lot. Sr Bowl practices were good for the most part. He has improved...that is undeniable but you watch his tape and it is very inconsistent.

He has started 18 games in his college career. He has a lean frame and did not display great power in college. He is young, but the NFL can be a tough place to learn fundamentals and can really abuse young linemen with power.

 

[Chopper0080]

Oh, a combine riser? Even more no thanks at 3.

Gandhi pointed out that he showed well at the Senior Bowl. He is very raw so if you are into him, you are believing in potential and that you can coach him up more than other, more experienced prospects. He is a combine riser in that he is very athletic and fits that profile for a LT. His physical gifts are a reason why he was able to hold up so well despite being raw. If it was a better LT draft class, I don't think he would have declared.

 

[Stout]

Yeah...I watched the tape of him being on the ground, a lot. Sr Bowl practices were good for the most part. He has improved...that is undeniable but you watch his tape and it is very inconsistent.

He has started 18 games in his college career. He has a lean frame and did not display great power in college. He is young, but the NFL can be a tough place to learn fundamentals and can really abuse young linemen with power.

Only 18 games? Yeesh!

 

[dreamcastrocks]

Gandhi pointed out that he showed well at the Senior Bowl. He is very raw so if you are into him, you are believing in potential and that you can coach him up more than other, more experienced prospects. He is a combine riser in that he is very athletic and fits that profile for a LT. His physical gifts are a reason why he was able to hold up so well despite being raw. If it was a better LT draft class, I don't think he would have declared.

He's a candidate in a trade down scenario. At 3, someone would have to talk me off of a ledge.

 

[oaken1]

A lot of conversation here about the value of a LT versus a RT. I think what needs to be realized is a lot of defenses move their best pass rusher around to both the left and right side so I see value of having a solid RT just as much as a LT. Gone are the days where a pass rusher stays on the same side of the line.

you need a solid pass protector on both sides no doubt. But protecting your QB from hits he never sees coming is paramount...you cant risk the investment you have in him.

 

[schutd]

you need a solid pass protector on both sides no doubt. But protecting your QB from hits he never sees coming is paramount...you cant risk the investment you have in him.

I don't think anyone is arguing this. They're arguing that its old school linear thinking, and you need to look at your entire offensive line more fluidly, and less about assigning value to individual positions.

 

[Gandhi]

I would love to see your results over the past few years and compare them to Monti's, Gandhi.

Me too, LLC. I spent a lot of time and energy on these mock games by studying team systems, Ossenfort’s tendencies, the players, etc., so it is very interesting to me to check how I did. Last season I was completely off with Nolen, while I hit with Burch and Burke. The year before it was Isaiah Adams and Xavier Thomas, while I whiffed completely on Melton and especially Elijah Jones, and so on each year (also under Keim’s tenure). It is very fun for me to “evaluate” myself like that.

 

[Gandhi]

Then why isn't Freeling at or near the top of any draft boards?

Well, he is. I just picked him. Anyway, as far as I know, the public opinion is changing toward Freeling being the top tackle? I don’t know, but I don’t just follow the media analyst’s boards.

 

[Gandhi]

Yeah...I watched the tape of him being on the ground, a lot. Sr Bowl practices were good for the most part. He has improved...that is undeniable but you watch his tape and it is very inconsistent.

He has started 18 games in his college career. He has a lean frame and did not display great power in college. He is young, but the NFL can be a tough place to learn fundamentals and can really abuse young linemen with power.

Well, there are a lot of factors going into a draft selection. It is not only about what Mel Kiper and Daniel Jeremiah say. I wish it was. You should read about my draft strategy in the original post.

 

[Stout]

Well, he is. I just picked him. Anyway, as far as I know, the public opinion is changing toward Freeling being the top tackle? I don’t know, but I don’t just follow the media analyst’s boards.

So I should call you Walter?

 

[Gandhi]

So I should call you Walter?

Why?

 

[Stout]

Why?

Because you think you're an expert and are crediting your knowledge over pretty much all of the pro draft talk.

 

[Gandhi]

Because you think you're an expert and are crediting your knowledge over pretty much all of the pro draft talk.

What? No, I am not. I am doing my best, but I am absolutely no expert. I do think, though, that it is strange how you and others believe that an overall, general board like Mel Kiper and Daniel Jeremiah creates apply for each team. It makes zero sense to me to think that everyone has the same board. I have a Cardinals focus, and whether you like it or not, I am not going to think that whoever the Ravens, Colts, Eagles or 28 other teams are targeting is necessarily the same that the Cardinals need. I do think that schemes matter in drafting, and I do think that general managers are different from each other. It’s cool that you believe that Mel Kiper can draft for all 32 teams, but I see it a little bit more nuanced. That doesn’t make me consider myself an expert. It just shows that I don't blindly believe what the media are telling me.

 

[Krangodnzr]

What? No, I am not. I am doing my best, but I am absolutely no expert. I do think, though, that it is strange how you and others believe that an overall, general board like Mel Kiper and Daniel Jeremiah creates apply for each team. It makes zero sense to me to think that everyone has the same board. I have a Cardinals focus, and whether you like it or not, I am not going to think that whoever the Ravens, Colts, Eagles or 28 other teams are targeting is necessarily the same that the Cardinals need. I do think that schemes matter in drafting, and I do think that general managers are different from each other. It’s cool that you believe that Mel Kiper can draft for all 32 teams, but I see it a little bit more nuanced. That doesn’t make me consider myself an expert. It just shows that I don't blindly believe what the media are telling me.

Yep it's the Kiperization of how fans view the draft. How each team values specific positions and what kind of talents they want from a specific position is very different.

The seventh ranked safety on the Cardinals board might be the 2nd ranked safety on the Seahawks board, and might be the 12th best on Kiper's board.

So we never really know how the Cardinals or any team is going to view the players we are looking at. And sometimes the player is either hella dumb or is a total jerk and the team doesn't think he's manageable, so they won't draft him. Fan boys will rag on the team, but they don't really know the full story.

 

[Krangodnzr]

Because you think you're an expert and are crediting your knowledge over pretty much all of the pro draft talk.

I'm going to say that while I don't agree with taking Freeling so high, I do like to see DIFFERENT, unique opinions outside of the group think that you see everywhere else. It's much more stimulating than seeing people take the same players over and over again.

 

[Krangodnzr]

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Here is a mock where the Cardinals move down multiple times adding picks along the way and get Freeling. Also getting Simpson a bit early to ensure you get him, while adding Christen Miller, Cashius Howell, and Caleb Banks to the front seven for depth and competition/talent infusion.

Brian Parker could be the center of the future or plug in at guard. He provides good positional flexibility all across the OL.

Even with the addition of Allgeier, I still wouldn't mind adding another back later in the draft and some WRs to fill out the backend of the roster.

 

[Stout]

What? No, I am not. I am doing my best, but I am absolutely no expert. I do think, though, that it is strange how you and others believe that an overall, general board like Mel Kiper and Daniel Jeremiah creates apply for each team. It makes zero sense to me to think that everyone has the same board. I have a Cardinals focus, and whether you like it or not, I am not going to think that whoever the Ravens, Colts, Eagles or 28 other teams are targeting is necessarily the same that the Cardinals need. I do think that schemes matter in drafting, and I do think that general managers are different from each other. It’s cool that you believe that Mel Kiper can draft for all 32 teams, but I see it a little bit more nuanced. That doesn’t make me consider myself an expert. It just shows that I don't blindly believe what the media are telling me.

I don't either. You're moving the goalposts here, though. You think Freeling is our best pick. You're not just saying you think it's what the Cards will do. I agree, the Cards will reach in the 1st round, or take a trade down. I don't think Freeling is worth the #3 pick in the draft. I'm not alone in that and you're rather alone in thinking he is. If your opinion was merely that it's something the Cards think would make sense, we're in accord. That's not what you've been saying, though.

 

[Stout]

I'm going to say that while I don't agree with taking Freeling so high, I do like to see DIFFERENT, unique opinions outside of the group think that you see everywhere else. It's much more stimulating than seeing people take the same players over and over again.

I agree. It's giving us this healthy debate. I love the content @Gandhi brings. I don't always agree with it--see this thread--but I love it.

 

[Stout]

You must be registered for see images attach

Here is a mock where the Cardinals move down multiple times adding picks along the way and get Freeling. Also getting Simpson a bit early to ensure you get him, while adding Christen Miller, Cashius Howell, and Caleb Banks to the front seven for depth and competition/talent infusion.

Brian Parker could be the center of the future or plug in at guard. He provides good positional flexibility all across the OL.

Even with the addition of Allgeier, I still wouldn't mind adding another back later in the draft and some WRs to fill out the backend of the roster.

I like some of the later picks--we aren't getting Banks that low, though--but would not like the top of this draft.

 

[Cardiac]

I thought I would start by showing you a quote from former offensive lineman Ross Tucker:

"How do you know someone doesn’t really know what they’re talking about when it comes to the NFL these days?

When they talk about the difference between left tackles and right tackles or describe an offensive lineman as a “right tackle only,” that’s how.

The truth is, anybody who has been paying close attention to the league the last few years realizes (or at least should) that there is no longer a distinction between the two positions on the edges of a team’s offensive line."
(https://www.nytimes.com/athletic/10...ction-between-left-tackles-and-right-tackles/)

I am sure you will argue that you know a lot more about the NFL and offensive line-play than Ross Tucker, but then you should take a really quick Google search, just to find many other statements to confirm that you are wrong.

Also, I guess you didn’t look at the list of the highest paid offensive tackles, so I will tell you about it. Of the 10 highest paid, four of them are right tackles. Since 2023, five OT have been drafted in the top 10 to play right tackle.

I mean, it’s cool to think that LT is the more important, but it is not what the NFL tells us.

Couple of thoughts.
I don't mind drafting a RT at #3, especially in this draft.
I think the franchise tag supports what you are saying, in fact oline tag $# is the same for all oline positions. Which might explain your stats on LT and RT pays being close.
I remember the oline the Cardinals had in the 70s, they had awesome talent all along the line. Bob young (OG) and Dan Dierdorf (RT) were the best in the league and the Cards offense was incredible.
I understand Oakens point about the LT being more important than RT because of the blind side. I would rank oline importance as LT, RT, C, RG, LG.
Bottom line for me is the oline unit is the most important aspect of a team after your QB. Build it and invest in it all the time.

 

[Chopper0080]

Well, there are a lot of factors going into a draft selection. It is not only about what Mel Kiper and Daniel Jeremiah say. I wish it was. You should read about my draft strategy in the original post.

Where did I reference what they said? I am telling you what I think and have seen.