Kyler and Kliff’s Offseason Mission

[kerouac9]

Huh. I think this shows an incredibly poor opinion of kyler if you think he’s that far beyond being capable of being coached hard. Due his high school accolades.

I have a pretty low opinion of Kyler Murray the dude, yeah.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

I have a pretty low opinion of Kyler Murray the dude, yeah.

Fair enough

 

[dreamcastrocks]

Wait, you think kk is getting the best outta kyler . . . unless two other coaches had him. Doesn’t that mean that kk is NOT getting the best outta kyler?

That is not what I mean at all. I am not sure there is another coach out there (that would reasonably be available) that can get more out of him. Both KK and KM are learning.

This isn't black and white.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

That is not what I mean at all. I am not sure there is another coach out there (that would reasonably be available) that can get more out of him. Both KK and KM are learning.

This isn't black and white.

Okay. Your wording confused me

 

[BigCardsFan]

BA will make a man out of Kyler when he returns as GM

 

[Harry]

That is an oversimplification. All of the players you mentioned, including Kyler himself missed significant time or wasn't on the team.

Tons of QBs missed games. My point was they essentially made the playoffs by winning when they had everyone. They were good enough to win 2 of 3 without Murray. They actually did worse when they got him back.

 

[AustrianCardFan]

Tons of QBs missed games. My point was they essentially made the playoffs by winning when they had everyone. They were good enough to win 2 of 3 without Murray. They actually did worse when they got him back.

So you are using the fact against KK that he won every game with all starters healthy and 2 of 3 with a backup QB? I think especially the 2 games we won with McCoy showed that KK can be an excellent coach, coming up with almost perfect game plans.

 

[Crimson Warrior]

So you are using the fact against KK that he won every game with all starters healthy and 2 of 3 with a backup QB? I think especially the 2 games we won with McCoy showed that KK can be an excellent coach, coming up with almost perfect game plans.

It certainly dispels the myth that Murray is carrying the offense.

What I would love to know is how good is the working relationship between K1 and K2. I'm not aware of any evidence that it's poor, but neither does there seem to be any evidence that it's great. Maybe they collaborate a lot in meetings and everything, but I'm a little concerned about this critical relationship.

 

[Cards_Campos]

I'm absolutely mystified that after 3 years, people still think Kliff should stick around. How many late season collapses will prove that when things get tough, Kliff's teams fold?

The same problems creep up again and again. Pre snap penalties, confusion, missed assignments, total lack of continuity on both offense and defense. They are all the symptoms of the same problem - a total lack of leadership. Guys like him because he doesn't pressure them, but that's the problem! You can get away with half assed effort against bad teams, but once games start to matter, THE DETAILS MATTER!!!

This entire show is predicated on Kyler performing at an MVP level, which doesn't happen unless he's in mint condition. Any appearance of progress from Kyler at the beginning of the season appears to be a mirage - he's looking totally lost out there, and like a guy who doesn't study film.

There is no chance this team is winning anything of significance with Kliff at the helm, he's not good enough strategically or as a motivator. Any more years with Kliff in charge are a complete waste.

Lol. Because what you bring in doesn’t guarantee anything!!! Who you going to get?? No one out there proven. So you say roll the dice again?? This is why I think you guys are comical. Have you not learned from the past it isn’t easy. And even if you catch lightening in a bottle it disappears fast. Whiz and Arians. I don’t care about Kliff’s melt
Downs because we have improved every year. And we made the playoffs. You don’t get rid of coach who made the playoffs especially with our history.
We have a solid roster and if healthy probably wins 14 games. I mean his late season losses have been because of injuries in Arizona. I could care less about Texas Tech. They have never won anything so why should his record there be used. Playing Texas and Oklahoma near the end of the season will cause that. Until we fall back to 5-12 7-10. The. Let’s start rumblings.

 

[Cards_Campos]

Doesn’t everyone remember Steve Wilkes. Everytime a poster wants to complain about any player or coach. There should be a forum rule to go google the Wilkes era in Arizona. Lol

 

[dreamcastrocks]

Tons of QBs missed games. My point was they essentially made the playoffs by winning when they had everyone. They were good enough to win 2 of 3 without Murray. They actually did worse when they got him back.

I mean, if you are using that logic to justify, I don't know what else to say and I will just move on.

 

[Chopper0080]

Tons of QBs missed games. My point was they essentially made the playoffs by winning when they had everyone. They were good enough to win 2 of 3 without Murray. They actually did worse when they got him back.

Which I feel is more of an indictment on Murray than Kliff.

in fact, I would argue that Colt's performance and success indicates that if anyone is holding our offense from running at it's optimal potential, it is Kyler.

Not saying Colt is a better player, but maybe this offense requires less superstar plays and just more boring and routine ones to be at it's best.

 

[Chopper0080]

It certainly dispels the myth that Murray is carrying the offense.

What I would love to know is how good is the working relationship between K1 and K2. I'm not aware of any evidence that it's poor, but neither does there seem to be any evidence that it's great. Maybe they collaborate a lot in meetings and everything, but I'm a little concerned about this critical relationship.

Personally, I think Kyler has a VERY high opinion of himself. I don't believe that Kyler takes ownership of the offenses struggles. I think he says "we" but he means "you". Unfortunately, the false starts and the dropped passes support this to a degree and has hurt his own personal accountability. He has always said that HE is a winner. HE hates to lose and guys need to step up and get on his level.

He is Willie Beamen IMO.

 

[GatorAZ]

Personally, I think Kyler has a VERY high opinion of himself. I don't believe that Kyler takes ownership of the offenses struggles. I think he says "we" but he means "you". Unfortunately, the false starts and the dropped passes support this to a degree and has hurt his own personal accountability. He has always said that HE is a winner. HE hates to lose and guys need to step up and get on his level.

He is Willie Beamen IMO.

That’s disrespectful to Beamen who led his team to the Pantheon Cup. Kyler hasn’t won anything.

 

[Harry]

So you are using the fact against KK that he won every game with all starters healthy and 2 of 3 with a backup QB? I think especially the 2 games we won with McCoy showed that KK can be an excellent coach, coming up with almost perfect game plans.

I think Kingsbury is capable of building a decent game plan. It’s just not what he wants to do. He’s like the habitual gambler whom always bets the long odds. He can’t help it. Frog/scorpion Seems to apply.

 

[Crimson Warrior]

Personally, I think Kyler has a VERY high opinion of himself. I don't believe that Kyler takes ownership of the offenses struggles. I think he says "we" but he means "you". Unfortunately, the false starts and the dropped passes support this to a degree and has hurt his own personal accountability. He has always said that HE is a winner. HE hates to lose and guys need to step up and get on his level.

He is Willie Beamen IMO.

Too harsh by half at least.

None of us have very much information about what's going in either inside the facility, or K1s brain for that matter, and I don't remember any quotes from him putting his teammates in a poor light.

Also,

Confidence = I believe I'm good.

Arrogance = I believe I'm better than you.

Haven't heard K1 saying he's better than others. If you want to get on his @ss, fine, but let's be fair about it.

 

[dreamcastrocks]

Okay. Your wording confused me

My wording confuses me quite often, so no surprise there...

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Too harsh by half at least.

None of us have very much information about what's going in either inside the facility, or K1s brain for that matter, and I don't remember any quotes from him putting his teammates in a poor light.

Also,

Confidence = I believe I'm good.

Arrogance = I believe I'm better than you.

Haven't heard K1 saying he's better than others. If you want to get on his @ss, fine, but let's be fair about it.

I think him saying he doesn’t kill himself in the film room is essentially saying I’m better than the guys who do so which is a type of arrogance.

 

[Crimson Warrior]

I think him saying he doesn’t kill himself in the film room is essentially saying I’m better than the guys who do so which is a type of arrogance.

That is a stretch at best counselor.

Do you yourself work as hard as the hardest working guys in your profession? If you don't, is it because you think that you're better than they are?

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

That is a stretch at best counselor.

Do you yourself work as hard as the hardest working guys in your profession? If you don't, is it because you think that you're better than they are?

Actually I believe I do. I recognize I’m not the smartest in my role and I need to do whatever I can to give me an edge.

And that’s not a stretch at all. In fact, I think that’s exactly what the previous posters meant. If you don’t think you need to do what those adjudged to be the best at your position do, but you’re not matching their success . . . that’s arrogance.

 

[slanidrac16]

BA will make a man out of Kyler when he returns as GM

What are you drinking?

 

[kerouac9]

That is a stretch at best counselor.

Do you yourself work as hard as the hardest working guys in your profession? If you don't, is it because you think that you're better than they are?

I think that bragging about it to the New York Times is the important detail, not so much whether or not he studies as much as the median QB.

 

[Crimson Warrior]

Actually I believe I do. I recognize I’m not the smartest in my role and I need to do whatever I can to give me an edge.

And that’s not a stretch at all. In fact, I think that’s exactly what the previous posters meant. If you don’t think you need to do what those adjudged to be the best at your position do, but you’re not matching their success . . . that’s arrogance.

Your conclusion is still flawed. So every person that does not work as hard as the other persons in their profession is automatically "arrogant"? That's just silly.

Not working as hard as the next guy only means there's something else that they'd rather do with their time. It doesn't mean that they think they are better than the next guy.

I work a lot. About 2,600 or 2,700 hours a year. But there are plenty of CPAs that work more than that. Many get up to around 3,000 a year (or more, bless their souls). But of course I don't think I'm "better" than the people working 3,000. I just want to spend time with my family.

Kyler not working as hard as the other guys in his profession does not automatically make him "arrogant".

Look at the quote from the article. Which does it most resemble?

Confidence = I'm not a film junkie because I'm already great.

Arrogance = I'm not a film junkie because I'm already better than Stafford, Wilson and Garappolo.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Your conclusion is still flawed. So every person that does not work as hard as the other persons in their profession is automatically "arrogant"? That's just silly.

Not working as hard as the next guy only means there's something else that they'd rather do with their time. It doesn't mean that they think they are better than the next guy.

I work a lot. About 2,600 or 2,700 hours a year. But there are plenty of CPAs that work more than that. Many get up to around 3,000 a year (or more, bless their souls). But of course I don't think I'm "better" than the people working 3,000. I just want to spend time with family.

Kyler not working as hard as the other guys in his profession does not automatically make him "arrogant".

Look at the quote from the article. Which does it most resemble?

Confidence = I'm not a film junkie because I'm already great.

Arrogance = I'm not a film junkie because I'm already better than Stafford, Wilson and Garappolo.

Your conclusion is still flawed. So every person that does not work as hard as the other persons in their profession is automatically "arrogant"? That's just silly.

Not working as hard as the next guy only means there's something else that they'd rather do with their time. It doesn't mean that they think they are better than the next guy.

I work a lot. About 2,600 or 2,700 hours a year. But there are plenty of CPAs that work more than that. Many get up to around 3,000 a year (or more, bless their souls). But of course I don't think I'm "better" than the people working 3,000. I just want to spend time with family.

Kyler not working as hard as the other guys in his profession does not automatically make him "arrogant".

Look at the quote from the article. Which does it most resemble?

Confidence = I'm not a film junkie because I'm already great.

Arrogance = I'm not a film junkie because I'm already better than Stafford, Wilson and Garappolo.

Well you’re defining “arrogance” incorrectly. It needn’t be a comparison. Here’s the definition:

“having or revealing an exaggerated sense of one's own importance or abilities”

I mean, kyler’s quote seems to fall squarely within that definition. If he was accurate in his statement that he sees things before they happen without the use of all the film study everyone would be on the same page lauding him, wouldn’t we be? But you know he’s far from perfecting his craft and he’s not really seeing everything develop before it happens, is he?

 

[Crimson Warrior]

I think him saying he doesn’t kill himself in the film room is essentially saying I’m better than the guys who do so which is a type of arrogance.

I'm refuting your original quote, but if I'm being intellectually honest, you're correct that I was using a flawed definition of arrogance (damn).

Whether or not K1 is arrogant based only on the quote in question is further debatable, but I'm not really interested in pursing that any further unless you are. I've had enough sparing with my arch-nemesis for this day. haha.