Welcome back Markus Golden. 2 year deal

[football karma]

the transition tag is $13.

its not the $13mm -- its that with the tag, ALL $13 hits this years cap

i guarantee that for 99% of the 8 figure annual avg value contracts agreed to in the last 24 hours -- all of them are structured so that the cap hit is a low 7 figure number

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Dude, you need to chill out. I haven't memorized yours, ouchie's, and DVontel's positions on transition tags vs. franchise tags vs. long term contracts on an individual basis throughout threads. There's still only a very marginal difference between saying $13 million and $15 million. When I first mentioned $15 million in this thread, I was throwing a rough number out there, especially considering we have no idea what Reddick is going to net in a long term deal. The transition tag, either tag, at $12.7 million, is still too much money. You're picking nits.

I'm not going to go back and search every thread about Reddick right now at 2 AM, but I'm pretty darned sure you three weren't all "tag or no deal" on Reddick and would have re-signed him to a $10+ million per year deal.

This team can't keep throwing big money at players because we can't draft or coach. You're talking about spending starting money on 3 OLBs who can't be on the field at the same time. Gardeck is a bargain. Kennard could still see the axe if we want to sign another player. Free Agency hasn't even officially started yet, and all of the things you mentioned are still on the table.

Why am I not discussing "allocation of resources?" Because we literally gave it a shot signing the best lineman on the market today and you're having a tantrum because we swung and missed. You're pissed off that we don't "have a plan" because more than 24 hours before the start of free agency, we haven't signed anyone yet. It's not worth it to me to start wailing and gnashing teeth over losing a guy this board unanimously wanted off the team 12 months ago and a center who chose a different team for reasons we have no actual insight to.

Lol cmon solar we “swung and missed” over $2M, which you’re trying to argue in the same thread isn’t a big deal. That’s pretty funny.

know what else is funny? Planning for failure. That’s what this franchise has done so far.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

No one is saying it, but the market dictates it. It would make him a top 10 paid player at the position and likely his only big pay day because of his age and great season.

Well the market is the market. You can try to ignore it or be contrarian but that just has you buying from the bargain bin of defective, irregular, and broken pieces.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

I predict Reddick gets about 3 years/26-27 mill with about half that guaranteed. If he was an "in demand" edge player, he would have been signed yesterday like all the other top pass rushers. That's a contract the Cards should do to keep him and maybe they will, but I doubt it.

If it plays out that way and they resign him for that then they get all the credit in the world for understanding his market and acting accordingly.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

its not the $13mm -- its that with the tag, ALL $13 hits this years cap

i guarantee that for 99% of the 8 figure annual avg value contracts agreed to in the last 24 hours -- all of them are structured so that the cap hit is a low 7 figure number

That’s a valid point. But we’ve also had a lot of cap experts on here repeatedly telling us CJ will be restructured and if you’re creative the cap isn’t an impediment.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

At the end of the day I’m not actually an enormous Reddick fan. I just think most of the arguments, and the Cardinals action plan, are full of faults. It’s not like he’s the only ascending free agent who we’ve let walk without anything to show for it. Far better players have been allowed to leave this club over the years.

 

[BritCard]

Becoming a late fan, why did u chose the Cardinals?
U have the typical view of things of a long time fan not of a brand new fan

Well it's been 5-6 years now. That's more than long enough to become bitter and jaded.

It's like that planet in the movie Interstellar where time moves much slower than everywhere else. 5-6 years a Cards fan is like 40 years for other franchises.

 

[football karma]

That’s a valid point. But we’ve also had a lot of cap experts on here repeatedly telling us CJ will be restructured and if you’re creative the cap isn’t an impediment.

the CJ restructure means extension -- and that isnt 100% in the Cards hands.

the second half has some truth to it --as the Rams have proven (although we havent seen the downside of that from them). But creative simply means pushing $ into later years for guys like Budda, etc. -- and that means $ you cant spend then.

 

[Chopper0080]

At the end of the day I’m not actually an enormous Reddick fan. I just think most of the arguments, and the Cardinals action plan, are full of faults. It’s not like he’s the only ascending free agent who we’ve let walk without anything to show for it. Far better players have been allowed to leave this club over the years.

The issue is exacerbated by our inability to draft. Our list of quality players under 26 is like Murray, Simmons, Baker and Murphy. The rest have shown little to nothing. On offense, it is Murray, Humphries and Hopkins. Pugh isn't bad but overpaid. The rest are a bunch of unanswered question marks. And, as great as a bunch of one year prove it deals are, they don't solve anything long term.

 

[JohnnyCakes]

Some of you become oddly upset about the silliest things.

 

[Finito]

You are basing your opinion of what Reddick is going to do on 3 seasons prior to last year. I am basing my opinion of what keim is going to spend on free agents on all of his history. I love you guys who have such optimistic outlooks on keims plans.

no like I’ve told you over and over you are more than welcome to present his stats for the other 15 games that just finished and combined with the last 3 years to make your case for him getting 13-15 million a year

 

[Cheesebeef]

Dude, you need to chill out. I haven't memorized yours, ouchie's, and DVontel's positions on transition tags vs. franchise tags vs. long term contracts on an individual basis throughout threads. There's still only a very marginal difference between saying $13 million and $15 million. When I first mentioned $15 million in this thread, I was throwing a rough number out there, especially considering we have no idea what Reddick is going to net in a long term deal. The transition tag, either tag, at $12.7 million, is still too much money. You're picking nits.

I'm not going to go back and search every thread about Reddick right now at 2 AM, but I'm pretty darned sure you three weren't all "tag or no deal" on Reddick and would have re-signed him to a $10+ million per year deal.

This team can't keep throwing big money at players because we can't draft or coach. You're talking about spending starting money on 3 OLBs who can't be on the field at the same time. Gardeck is a bargain. Kennard could still see the axe if we want to sign another player. Free Agency hasn't even officially started yet, and all of the things you mentioned are still on the table.

Why am I not discussing "allocation of resources?" Because we literally gave it a shot signing the best lineman on the market today and you're having a tantrum because we swung and missed. You're pissed off that we don't "have a plan" because more than 24 hours before the start of free agency, we haven't signed anyone yet. It's not worth it to me to start wailing and gnashing teeth over losing a guy this board unanimously wanted off the team 12 months ago and a center who chose a different team for reasons we have no actual insight to.

again, you are LYING. I haven’t bitched and moaned about not signing Linsley because I never expected us to.

also, when you keep telling us that we want to franchise...

forget it. All you’re going to do is keep lying.

Carry on.

 

[Solar7]

again, you are LYING. I haven’t bitched and moaned about not signing Linsley because I never expected us to.

also, when you keep telling us that we want to franchise...

forget it. All you’re going to do is keep lying.

Carry on.

This LYING stuff is complete BS, and honestly, I expect better from you.

Reasonable enough. Probably would have happened in any other year, but with the cap the way it is, I think this team is better as a whole with Golden playing reasonably well and another player, vs. $15m tied up in waiting to see if Reddick was a mirage or not.

This is my first mention of $15 million in this thread, and as I explained, this was a rough number I threw out there. It wasn't claiming Ouchie ever said he wanted to pay $15 million. BUT... he then says this.

That’s why I wanted to tag him. Let’s see it another year.

Does he specify "Transition Tag" anywhere? No. Ouchie is not my brother, I don't have his previous stance on the player memorized. You keep pretending I'm harping on any of you for $15 million, but I'm not. $13 million is still completely ridiculous for this player in a down cap year. And Ouchie has been complaining for multiple posts here and in other threads that we didn't acquire Linsley and don't have an apparent plan. You need to realize I'm talking to different people with different viewpoints here, but with a common denominator - three of you are acting like the sky is falling because we haven't re-signed Reddick to as much as $13 million (or $12.7, whatever, we're rounding because we're just fans talking a sport) and signed Golden to a reasonable deal.

This lying **** is nonsense. I'm not lying about a single thing.

 

[Chopper0080]

Tough to see where the market is going to be for Reddick.

Lots of more traditional edge plays still on the market who are going to eat at his options.

Clowney.
Ingram.
Dunlap.
Vernon.
Houston.
Kerrigan.
Hyder.
Aldon Smith.

Designating Kennard as a post-june cut saves the Cardinals 6.6 mil and we definitely have the scratch to do that and pay Reddick the 1 or 2 mil difference for one year.

The Tyus Bowser and Ebukam contracts coming in at 6 mil and 5.5 mil per year respectively hurts Reddick's negotiating leverage. Both are similar age and size.

 

[Solar7]

You keep saying $15, the transition tag is $13. ONE PERSON said “at all costs” - the transition tag is obviously an available alternative.

I included the Transition Tag on purpose. You didn't specify originally that you meant the Transition Tag, for one. Two, it doesn't matter when $13 million in dedicated cap space this year is ridiculous like @football karma says.

Lol cmon solar we “swung and missed” over $2M, which you’re trying to argue in the same thread isn’t a big deal. That’s pretty funny.

know what else is funny? Planning for failure. That’s what this franchise has done so far.

I wrote that when I had no idea what we offered Linsley, and honestly, I still don't have any source for what we offered, since I just woke up. I've looked at a couple of threads and see a few mentions of $13 million, but I'll break down a couple of things...

1. It looks like Linsley is making $13 million per season and you're saying we offered $11? If that's the case, it's a difference of $10 million, not $2 million, since he got a 5 year contract, and you're talking about giving Reddick a one year tag.
2. Linsley also has a bonus and other things to offset paying him the full value of that contract in a down cap year.
3. Linsley is an All-Pro superstar of a player who has proven himself to be consistently good. Reddick is a player who for three years was terrible, and then in a contract year had a pretty good year, majorly lifted by one great game against the hapless Giants.

 

[Cheesebeef]

This LYING stuff is complete BS, and honestly, I expect better from you.

This is my first mention of $15 million in this thread, and as I explained, this was a rough number I threw out there. It wasn't claiming Ouchie ever said he wanted to pay $15 million. BUT... he then says this.

Does he specify "Transition Tag" anywhere? No. Ouchie is not my brother, I don't have his previous stance on the player memorized. You keep pretending I'm harping on any of you for $15 million, but I'm not. $13 million is still completely ridiculous for this player in a down cap year. And Ouchie has been complaining for multiple posts here and in other threads that we didn't acquire Linsley and don't have an apparent plan. You need to realize I'm talking to different people with different viewpoints here, but with a common denominator - three of you are acting like the sky is falling because we haven't re-signed Reddick to as much as $13 million (or $12.7, whatever, we're rounding because we're just fans talking a sport) and signed Golden to a reasonable deal.

This lying **** is nonsense. I'm not lying about a single thing.

ok. Like I said, I’m done discussing this with someone who builds their argument by distorting others. I mean... you say on the one hand that you DONT have Ouchie’s positions memorized and yet consistently bash whatever position you WANT it to be.

In an honest conversation you’d ASK for clarification if you didn’t know... not just project the worst case so that you’re POV would be stronger.

 

[Solar7]

ok. Like I said, I’m done discussing this with someone who builds their argument by distorting others. I mean... you say on the one hand that you DONT have Ouchie’s positions memorized and yet consistently bash whatever position you WANT it to be.

In an honest conversation you’d ASK for clarification if you didn’t know... not just project the worst case so that you’re POV would be stronger.

I'm using the evidence in this thread, and I'm not accusing anyone of wanting to spend $15 million. Once it was clarified, I stopped even using $15 million. So, you need to stop. $13 million is too much. I'm not distorting a thing. Both of you are in "sky is falling" mode right now all over the board.

 

[DVontel]

Is not the i dont like golden, he is a good dude, I very like his personality, on the field he is a high motor guy who give everything he has, unfortunately he is too slow and he is a liability in some circumstances
I do think our defense need a faster edge guy, i hope we can draft one so he can be a rotational guy, there some good athletic pass rusher in the draft

Same.

Love his mentality & personality, but watching him literally always bite on fake handoffs is the most annoying thing ever & he doesn’t even have the athleticism to recover from it. I can’t even say it’s a coaching matter too cause he has done it under multiple DCs.

 

[Cheesebeef]

I included the Transition Tag on purpose. You didn't specify originally that you meant the Transition Tag, for one. Two, it doesn't matter when $13 million in dedicated cap space this year is ridiculous like @football karma says.


I wrote that when I had no idea what we offered Linsley, and honestly, I still don't have any source for what we offered, since I just woke up. I've looked at a couple of threads and see a few mentions of $13 million, but I'll break down a couple of things...

1. It looks like Linsley is making $13 million per season and you're saying we offered $11? If that's the case, it's a difference of $10 million, not $2 million, since he got a 5 year contract, and you're talking about giving Reddick a one year tag.
2. Linsley also has a bonus and other things to offset paying him the full value of that contract in a down cap year.
3. Linsley is an All-Pro superstar of a player who has proven himself to be consistently good. Reddick is a player who for three years was terrible, and then in a contract year had a pretty good year, majorly lifted by one great game against the hapless Giants.

another lie. He was 2nd in the league in TFL and even taking away his best game, he STILL would have been in the top 6 in the league for TFL. That’s a great year for anyone, regardless of him being a bust for his previous three years, which he was.

see how easy it is to be honest in a conversation where people can admit Reddick was a bust for three years but also was a beast this year? It’s really not that hard to do.

 

[DVontel]

Really wish Reddick played EDGE since the moment he came in.

His career from folks on here would be looked at much differently.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

no like I’ve told you over and over you are more than welcome to present his stats for the other 15 games that just finished and combined with the last 3 years to make your case for him getting 13-15 million a year

Sigh, okay in the other 15 games (of which he only started 11) he had:
4 passes defensed
4 forced fumbles
7.5 sacks
58 tackles
15 tackles for loss
10 quarterback hits

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

This LYING stuff is complete BS, and honestly, I expect better from you.

This is my first mention of $15 million in this thread, and as I explained, this was a rough number I threw out there. It wasn't claiming Ouchie ever said he wanted to pay $15 million. BUT... he then says this.

Does he specify "Transition Tag" anywhere? No. Ouchie is not my brother, I don't have his previous stance on the player memorized. You keep pretending I'm harping on any of you for $15 million, but I'm not. $13 million is still completely ridiculous for this player in a down cap year. And Ouchie has been complaining for multiple posts here and in other threads that we didn't acquire Linsley and don't have an apparent plan. You need to realize I'm talking to different people with different viewpoints here, but with a common denominator - three of you are acting like the sky is falling because we haven't re-signed Reddick to as much as $13 million (or $12.7, whatever, we're rounding because we're just fans talking a sport) and signed Golden to a reasonable deal.

This lying **** is nonsense. I'm not lying about a single thing.

I’ve stated transition a number of times on this board. You’re failure to take note and keep reiterating the franchise number is a you issue and inaccurate portrayal of the argument.

 

[Cheesebeef]

I'm using the evidence in this thread, and I'm not accusing anyone of wanting to spend $15 million. Once it was clarified, I stopped even using $15 million. So, you need to stop. $13 million is too much. I'm not distorting a thing. Both of you are in "sky is falling" mode right now all over the board.

Another lie. I’ve definitely talked a lot about our multitude of decisions at OLB, but please find me a spot where I consistently say we are going to be terrible or we’re awful for not signing Linsley. Or that we’re going to be terrible or awful, period. You can’t because I haven’t.

im just banging the table because I see a chance for us to take a part of the team that should be decent and I want them to make it DOMINANT.

have I made that point A LOT? Sure. But wanting to move the needle from possibly good pass rush to dominant isn’t Sky Is Falling, so take that projection and shove it back where the rest of your lies have come from.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

I included the Transition Tag on purpose. You didn't specify originally that you meant the Transition Tag, for one. Two, it doesn't matter when $13 million in dedicated cap space this year is ridiculous like @football karma says.


I wrote that when I had no idea what we offered Linsley, and honestly, I still don't have any source for what we offered, since I just woke up. I've looked at a couple of threads and see a few mentions of $13 million, but I'll break down a couple of things...

1. It looks like Linsley is making $13 million per season and you're saying we offered $11? If that's the case, it's a difference of $10 million, not $2 million, since he got a 5 year contract, and you're talking about giving Reddick a one year tag.
2. Linsley also has a bonus and other things to offset paying him the full value of that contract in a down cap year.
3. Linsley is an All-Pro superstar of a player who has proven himself to be consistently good. Reddick is a player who for three years was terrible, and then in a contract year had a pretty good year, majorly lifted by one great game against the hapless Giants.

Jesus forget it. I’m not arguing with you about this anymore as you’re not even tracking the argument and misusing facts and moving the goalposts. Be happy, we didn’t sign Reddick. The team should be much better for it . . .

 

[Solar7]

another lie. He was 2nd in the league in TFL and even taking away his best game, he STILL would have been in the top 6 in the league for TFL. That’s a great year for anyone, regardless of him being a bust for his previous three years, which he was.

see how easy it is to be honest in a conversation where people can admit Reddick was a bust for three years but also was a beast this year? It’s really not that hard to do.

Another lie. I’ve definitely talked a lot about our multitude of decisions at OLB, but please find me a spot where I consistently say we are going to be terrible or we’re awful for not signing Linsley. Or that we’re going to be terrible or awful, period. You can’t because I haven’t.

im just banging the table because I see a chance for us to take a part of the team that should be decent and I want them to make it DOMINANT.

have I made that point A LOT? Sure. But wanting to move the needle from possibly good pass rush to dominant isn’t Sky Is Falling, so take that projection and shove it back where the rest of your lies have come from.

Whatever man, at this point, feel free to put my lying ass on ignore.