EVT: Suns' Attempt to Move Up in Draft Continues to be Fruitless Venture

[Evil Ash]

http://www.eastvalleytribune.com/story/92272

Suns’ attempt to move up in draft continues to be fruitless venture
Jerry Brown, Tribune

As Ringling Bros. moved into US Airways Center on Tuesday for its annual performance run, rumors continued to swirl around the Suns and Thursday’s much-anticipated NBA draft — which could have a circus-like atmosphere.

Phoenix first watched projected lottery picks Corey Brewer, Jeff Green and Joakim Noah work out Tuesday. No one in the trio played themselves out of consideration, all producing impressive performances.

“All three guys can play right away for any team in the NBA. That’s why they’re in the position they’re in,” Suns general manager Steve Kerr said. “I don’t know if they could start for us, but they are all gamers and tough competitors.”

Then Phoenix resumed attempts to swing a trade that might put them in a position to draft one. The Suns are still offering a package of exclusively draft picks (the 24th and 29th pick this year and two first-round picks next year) or a combination of picks and bench players.

But NBA sources said while the Suns were still talking to Charlotte (eighth overall) and at least one other team about their picks, as few as one team in the top 10 may ultimately end up trading out, severely limiting Phoenix’s chances.

Even that deal, however, could be contingent on Phoenix’s trading partner not getting the lottery player they have targeted.

That would have the Suns falling back to other options, such as dangling a draft pick to shave salary and slip back toward the league’s luxury tax threshold.

Sources confirm one possible deal on the table would ship the 24th overall pick and Kurt Thomas to the Bobcats — who are under the salary cap and therefore could absorb the $8.1 million player option Thomas will exercise Sunday — for future considerations.

“We have a chance (to move up),” Kerr said Tuesday afternoon. “Whether it’s a great chance or not, I don’t know. I can’t give you any percentage.

“Everybody’s talking, but you don’t know what to believe and what not to believe.”

Here is a good example:

The Suns believe they are still a player in the increasingly curious Kevin Garnett derby after a day of intense talks between Minnesota and the Los Angeles Lakers apparently went nowhere. Now pressed to make a deal for the reportedly disillusioned Garnett, the Timberwolves may revisit previous negotiating partners.

But several league sources flatly denied a report Tuesday by ESPN’s Jim Gray that Phoenix was close to a three-way deal with Minnesota and Boston that would bring Garnett to Phoenix, send Marion to the Celtics and Thomas and draft picks to Minnesota.

Gray said the deal was contingent upon Marion signing an extension with the Celtics. Last weekend, Marion let it be known through his agent that he had no desire to go to Boston.

Bonus shots

Even on the eve of the draft, the Suns are still not done scouting.

North Carolina forward Brandan Wright — who has reportedly slipped out of the top five on many draft boards — and Florida State forward Al Thornton were supposed to be in New York this morning for a predraft media session. Instead, they will be here for a closed-to-the-media workout.

The NBA player Thornton is most closely associated with? Marion. Ultra-athletic and a strong perimeter defender who can score in a non-conventional offense, he averaged 19.7 points and 7.2 rebounds for the Seminoles and his stock has been climbing on many draft boards...

Phoenix’s second workout Tuesday featured a pair of point guards — 6-5 Petteri Koponen from Finland and speedy Aaron Brooks. Both players remain in Phoenix’s plans, along with Italian Marco Belinelli, if Phoenix ends up keeping either the 24th or 29th pick...

Team USA managing director Jerry Colangelo, who was honored at a US Airways Center luncheon Tuesday, said Dwyane Wade indicates he will be healthy enough to play in the FIBA Americas Tournament in Las Vegas beginning Aug. 22. Wade underwent shoulder surgery in May.

Colangelo said LeBron James also confirmed that he intends to play in the tournament

 

[SunsTzu]

Trading KT and a pick for nothing would tell me the Suns are not serious about winning a championship.

 

[Gaddabout]

But NBA sources said while the Suns were still talking to Charlotte (eighth overall) and at least one other team about their picks, as few as one team in the top 10 may ultimately end up trading out, severely limiting Phoenix’s chances.

Even that deal, however, could be contingent on Phoenix’s trading partner not getting the lottery player they have targeted.

Ha! Jerry and I have the same source. (This is actually true)

 

[Evil Ash]

Ha! Jerry and I have the same source. (This is actually true)

Did the source give you any info on who the Bobcats are targeting @ 8?

 

[Weenus O'Baggins]

Did the source give you any info on who the Bobcats are targeting @ 8?

Someone to replace Adam Morrison.

 

[Gaddabout]

Did the source give you any info on who the Bobcats are targeting @ 8?

Nope, but everything points to a draft day deal. Let's say Boston does something stupid and takes Nick Young with the No. 5 pick (a possibility). This is the kind of ripple effect that could trigger the trade.

Edit: But I should say the Suns may still deal with Charlotte regardless of the draft, but that's already been widely reported.

 

[slinslin]

Thornton is comapred to Marion because of what and by who?

He is as athletic or more athletic than Marion but defense is supposed to be his weakness while offense is said to be his strength, most people saying he might be the best offensive player in the draft with the exception of Durant.

 

[HooverDam]

If the Suns KT and a pick for nothing I'm going to be enraged. You give up a first to get him, then give up another to move him? Thats insane! The Suns need 24 for depth, and to finally start developing a future, and they need KT against teams like SA, Utah and Miami.

Please Kerr/Sarver, don't do anything rash. If you can't move into the lottery, just keep 24 & 29, and go sign Hill.

 

[SunsTzu]

If the Suns KT and a pick for nothing I'm going to be enraged. You give up a first to get him, then give up another to move him? Thats insane!

The Bobcats must love dealing with the Suns. They get valuable picks and the salary needed so the stay above the minimum while they build their team with young players.

I will not be too upset if they pulled that crap with Banks(who they just signed last year) but if they do it with a key contributor like KT I may lose it.

 

[HooverDam]

^Oh agreed, I understand that getting rid of Banks is going to cost the Suns a pick, I'd be fine w/ that.

 

[hcsilla]

Thornton is comapred to Marion because of what and by who?

He is as athletic or more athletic than Marion but defense is supposed to be his weakness while offense is said to be his strength, most people saying he might be the best offensive player in the draft with the exception of Durant.

Thornton can easily improve to a Marion-type excellent help defender. He has the long arms, athleticism and willingness to be like that.

As scorers they have similarities too. Both use their athleticism first and mostly while Thornton has more go-to/post-up moves and doesn't have Marion's incredible leaping ability but is still a world-class athlete.

 

[YouJustGotSUNSD]

We should move banks and the 29th to ATL for their second round pick and cash money.

 

[newfan101]

Sources confirm one possible deal on the table would ship the 24th overall pick and Kurt Thomas to the Bobcats — who are under the salary cap and therefore could absorb the $8.1 million player option Thomas will exercise Sunday — for future considerations.

After weeks of bogus rumors, this is the first one I believe. I think fans should prepare themselves for another year of 1st round picks being used to move players, this year being either Thomas or Banks. Also, at least one pick will be sold for cash.

It will be interesting to see this board go from the euphoria of wishful thinking to the depression of reality. I hope I'm wrong.

 

[carey]

It will be interesting to see this board go from the euphoria of wishful thinking to the depression of reality. I hope I'm wrong.

I don't think you are. This is exactly the type of thing Suns management has done for the past 3 years. I don't see why this year should be any different. Especially with a new GM that doesn't want to rock the boat in his first month. Though not having any first round draftees in 4 years will suck.

 

[ArizonaSportsFan]

Trading KT and a pick for nothing would tell me the Suns are not serious about winning a championship.

The hyperbole starts early today I see.

It would mean that they are interested in remaining in business. I too would love for Sarver to hang on to KT and add the three selections. But it is not my money. I am glad that you are okay with Sarver paying $15 million dollars or so to the league, but he probably isn't. Are you going to be equally upset with Amare for requesting/demanding an expensive player like KT who's overall productivity (injuries, style, etc) amounts to one great game against the Spurs that allowed the Suns to win game 2 (the Spurs adjusted after that and then it didn't really matter)? The FO is still atoning for the JJ fiasco, it's true, but they have to do what they feel is right.

 

[Folster]

I read that Charlotte might not want the #24 or #29 this year because they already have the #22. There is a good chance that a KT salary dump would include the Suns first rounder next year(not the Atlanta pick). I'd be more open to that scenario because we have Atlanta's pick guaranteed next year.

Here it is.

On eve of draft, Suns fans looking for blockbuster are now finding scenarios
Jerry Brown, Tribune


The eve of the NBA draft produced another long day of whispers, rumors and outright categorical denials — but left the Suns standing in place with today’s 24th and 29th overall picks and few remaining opportunities to improve that stance.

The Suns are still intrigued by the prospect of acquiring the Minnesota Timberwolves’ Kevin Garnett but will not deal Amaré Stoudemire to make it happen. They are still interested in securing a top-10 pick in today’s draft but have all but exhausted the list of possible dance partners. They are still anxious to reduce the looming luxury-tax penalty the NBA charges teams with high payrolls, but there are other cards to play before the draft begins at 4:30 p.m.

Despite working out two more lottery hopefuls — North Carolina’s Brandan Wright and Florida State’s Al Thornton — Wednesday morning, a Suns source said that chances of getting into the top 10 were “dwindling,” reduced to long-shot status.

The most likely move isn’t very sexy — moving center Kurt Thomas to the Charlotte Bobcats along with a draft pick. But it would erase Thomas’ $8.1 million player option from the books and get the Suns within shouting distance of wiggling under the league’s dollar-for-dollar luxury-tax threshold.

If Charlotte retains the No. 8 pick (the Bobcats also pick 22nd), it would likely be more interested in a future first-round pick in any Thomas deal than a third selection today. The Suns wouldn’t be willing to part with Atlanta’s 2008 first-round pick, which they own, but have their own pick to dangle.

That would leave Phoenix with two picks today and a chance at a scorer (Marco Belinelli, Morris Almond, Alando Tucker) or point guard (Petteri Koponen, Aaron Brooks), although the possibility of one pick being dealt remains distinct.

Most of the Wednesday gossip swirled around scenarios that would ship Garnett and his massive salary ($22 million plus as much as $6.75 million in trade kickers) to Arizona — with Stoudemire’s name circulating the rumor mill.

While new Suns general manager Steve Kerr said last week that no one on his roster is untradeable, sources say their stance that Stoudemire would not be moved in any Garnett trade has never wavered — be it Boston, Minnesota or Atlanta. That didn’t keep ESPN and other media outlets, however, from reporting that a three-way trade with the Timberwolves, Hawks and Suns — one that would put Garnett in Phoenix, Stoudemire in Atlanta and draft picks and expiring contracts in Minnesota — was on the fast track toward completion.

Sources confirm that the rumors were strong enough to induce Stoudemire to place a phone call to his former Suns teammate, Atlanta guard Joe Johnson, to talk about a possible reunion with the Hawks.

Late Tuesday evening in New York, site of today’s draft, the Hawks were telling members of the national and Atlanta media that the framework for a Stoudemire deal was vetoed by management because it would put the Hawks over the salary cap.

Blame landed on a name familiar to Suns fans: former Hawks majority owner Steve Belkin. Still embroiled in a lawsuit to regain control from his former business partners that dates back to the controversial Johnson trade in the summer of 2005, Belkin retains the right to halt any deal that exceeds the cap.

Kerr said he had a grand total of one conversation with the Hawks about a trade, and Stoudemire was never part of the conversation.

“All of these reports of blockbuster trades involving us are so far-fetched; I’ve chosen not to comment on them,” Kerr said. “Most of them are complete nonsense, and those with a kernel of accuracy aren’t even close.

“But when you hear that we were taking about trading Amaré … wherever that came from, it’s totally wrong.”

2007 NBA Draft
—
ESPN coverage begins at 4 p.m. today

 

[ArizonaSportsFan]

If that happens, KT and the Suns 08 for cap relief, then that is a good deal. Until we need KT for that one game.

 

[Chaplin]

The hyperbole starts early today I see.

It would mean that they are interested in remaining in business. I too would love for Sarver to hang on to KT and add the three selections. But it is not my money. I am glad that you are okay with Sarver paying $15 million dollars or so to the league, but he probably isn't. Are you going to be equally upset with Amare for requesting/demanding an expensive player like KT who's overall productivity (injuries, style, etc) amounts to one great game against the Spurs that allowed the Suns to win game 2 (the Spurs adjusted after that and then it didn't really matter)? The FO is still atoning for the JJ fiasco, it's true, but they have to do what they feel is right.

So? You may be in total support of being fiscally responsible, but this sacrifices the chance to win a title. Do you even want a title?

 

[ArizonaSportsFan]

Of course I want the Suns to win a title. But I also don't think that the two are mutually exclusive.

And frankly, it doesn't matter anyways. My feelings, or yours, or anyone else's on this board wouldn't sway the FO either way. It is the sad truth. They will do what makes them the most money, and if that means going over the cap to win a championship, then that is what they will do. If they think that the bottom line won't support the luxury tax, then they won't do it, championship or not. I would much rather have the team to root for than not, so while it may be frustrating to lose draft picks year after year while they get out of their own mess, so be it. It won't make me hate the team or stop thinking that they can win.

 

[slinslin]

Kurt Thomas and our own 2008 pick for nothing is a good deal.

If we can sign Grant Hill for the veteran minimum and PJ Brown or 2yrs/4M$ or so plus our 2 draftpicks we would still save roughly 4M$ and maybe we could ship Piatkowski, James Jones or Marcus Banks as well.

PJ Brown could replace everything KT does.

 

[HooverDam]

This may be kind of abstract, but if the Suns pay the tax (keep KT) and win the title this year, it will make Sarver more money in the long run. Sarver is still trying to get the W hotel built next to the USAC, and I think a Suns title would go a long way to creating momentum and more interest/demand for that project.

 

[ArizonaSportsFan]

This may be kind of abstract, but if the Suns pay the tax (keep KT) and win the title this year, it will make Sarver more money in the long run. Sarver is still trying to get the W hotel built next to the USAC, and I think a Suns title would go a long way to creating momentum and more interest/demand for that project.

But keeping KT in no way "guarantees" (of course, there are no guarantees) a title and it would probably be just as likely either way given the dynamics of a season. And yes, winning a title will make Sarver some more money, but not the kind of money you are thinking, I would bet. I would be interested to know if any teams/analysts have put an estimate together on what a title is worth (ticket revenue, lodging, travel, merchandise, etc). If teams could make $25 million off of a title, then more teams would be over the luxury tax (with good players/contracts, not like NY!) looking for the payday. We need to remember that this is entertainment business. No title does not equal no entertainment. Sucky teams equal no entertainment, but that is not the case here. That should rile up the die-hards, but it is true.

 

[SunsTzu]

So? You may be in total support of being fiscally responsible, but this sacrifices the chance to win a title. Do you even want a title?

Exactly. What about the financial support the team has gotten the last 3 years? It was no secret that this year was going to be the year the Suns get hit with LT. Trading 2st round picks for 1.5 season and 1 postseason of KT suiting up with the Suns seems irresponsible to me.

And PJ Brown may be similar to KT, but he isn't as good so even that move weakens the team(not to mention the future by continuously trading picks to obtian then move the same player).

 

[F-Dog]

And PJ Brown may be similar to KT, but he isn't as good so even that move weakens the team(not to mention the future by continuously trading picks to obtian then move the same player).

Look at it this way--if they move KT this summer, they're finally done with Q's contract for good. After that, they can finally start using their picks to try and dump Marcus Banks.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Exactly. What about the financial support the team has gotten the last 3 years? It was no secret that this year was going to be the year the Suns get hit with LT. Trading 2st round picks for 1.5 season and 1 postseason of KT suiting up with the Suns seems irresponsible to me.

And PJ Brown may be similar to KT, but he isn't as good so even that move weakens the team(not to mention the future by continuously trading picks to obtian then move the same player).

if you can turn KT into Hill/Brown for the half the money COMBINED it's an overall upgrade.