Whatever happened to Supporting Your Whole Team no Matter What?

[MrYeahBut]

@SissyBoyFloyd @oaken1 @cardpa @slanidrac16 @Brian in Mesa

Thanks for those great posts!!

As Sissy said, my friends and I dissected every Stones, Beatles, Dylan song they wrote back in the day... still trying to figure out 'Lucy In The Sky With Diamonds" lol

I don't need to give a litany of my fandom and blind loyalty to the Cards. My granddaughter who's 19 is a rabid Suns fan. She watches every game shown here, texts me during them, keeps up with them on the web and Instagram... she's always sending me stuff about D Book. She was thrilled when I took her to a game at Christmas... btw freaking Ja Morant is a baaad man, Suns lost to Grizzles at the buzzer. Not all young people are instant gratification. She pores over the game stats etc just like we used to read box scores in the newspaper way back when. She can recite from memory players stats, assists-rebounds-ppg etc. She dumped Facebook because of cyber bullying so other than keeping up with some friends and family she's not on social media. There is a younger generation of fans being built out there that may not be obvious to us. btw she loves the Cards too, she's been to about 10 games with me.

As far as criticizing the Cards goes, personally I go from foaming at the mouth at idiots, Kiem, Murray, Bidwill, Joseph, Hicks, Hump etc to thinking these guys have got the team heading upward and it's all good. I used to know every player down to the water boy but I'm too lazy to do that anymore. Totally bummed at the gawd awful playoff game, but I'll get over it. I'm pushing 60 years of supporting these meatheads and I'm ready to win the big one fer crissakes!

.

 

[phillycard]

Interesting topic. A lot to unpack. So let’s dive in . . .

First, what happened to that era? Nothing. Because it didn’t exist. The idyllic picture you paint is a figment of your nostalgia. The phrase “get rid of that bum!” certainly didn’t originate with today’s generation. That harkens back to a much earlier age. And the word “boo” was certainly created, and used extensively, going back decades, of not centuries. People have always known and recognized a bad product and made themselves vocal about it. I mean, here’s a story of how the Brooklyn Dodgers became known as “Dem Bums” in 1939.

Why were the Brooklyn Dodgers called the Brooklyn Bums? – Easierwithpractice.com

easierwithpractice.com

But it became a quaint story. But it wasn’t to that cabbie at that time. But it’s the same thing. Fans are going to be happy or angry depending on the product their given.

and if you really want to say that fans way back when supported their teams, players, coaches, etc without condition how about when black players first came into the league? Right. I don’t even need to go down this path because it not only counters the sentiment, it absolutely obliterates it.

In addition the actual make up of teams were different. The players rarely changed because there wasn’t free agency. So you didn’t have a choice. You got who you got. It made no sense to talk about “what if we could replace so-and-so” because it just wasn’t happening. It didn’t start in baseball until 1976, and even then it wasn’t the free for all it is today. We should all know when it began in the nba as it was Tom Chambers breaking the seal in 1988. It didn’t start in the NFL until plan B in 1989, and even that wasn’t the unfettered free agency we see today that began in 1992. So prior to all that we were stuck with what we had. When players became more mercenary and the names changed so did the level of support for them individually by fans.

And none of that even takes into consideration the proliferation of the press, Social media, internet, more information, more sophisticated consumers, etc. It wasn’t unusual for fans to not even know who the GM was eons ago, but now they are in press conferences, they’re regular interviewed throughout the season, etc. we also know more about what they do, more about the salary cap. Same can be said for coaches and players. We just know more now than at other time in the history of sports. As a result the consumer (and sports are a product) possesses more information about how the ingredients and how the meal is prepared than at earlier ages. And due to social media they have a stage from which to convey their opinion. Going back decades the only stage was at the game, talking to friends, or around the water cooler. So we were all also exposed to fewer opinions and perspectives.

Ouchie, don't take this the wrong way.....but you can write your a** off. LMAO!!! Jeez dude, you need to get the to a typewriter asap and pen a book.

 

[Brian in Mesa]

Ouchie, don't take this the wrong way.....but you can write your a** off. LMAO!!! Jeez dude, you need to get the to a typewriter asap and pen a book.

He's now Cool Writer Bro #1.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Ouchie, don't take this the wrong way.....but you can write your a** off. LMAO!!! Jeez dude, you need to get the to a typewriter asap and pen a book.

I’m a lawyer. I can’t help it.

 

[cheesebeef]

He's now Cool Writer Bro #1.

Hehe...

 

[oaken1]

Interesting topic. A lot to unpack. So let’s dive in . . .

First, what happened to that era? Nothing. Because it didn’t exist. The idyllic picture you paint is a figment of your nostalgia. The phrase “get rid of that bum!” certainly didn’t originate with today’s generation. That harkens back to a much earlier age. And the word “boo” was certainly created, and used extensively, going back decades, of not centuries. People have always known and recognized a bad product and made themselves vocal about it. I mean, here’s a story of how the Brooklyn Dodgers became known as “Dem Bums” in 1939.

Why were the Brooklyn Dodgers called the Brooklyn Bums? – Easierwithpractice.com

easierwithpractice.com

But it became a quaint story. But it wasn’t to that cabbie at that time. But it’s the same thing. Fans are going to be happy or angry depending on the product their given.

and if you really want to say that fans way back when supported their teams, players, coaches, etc without condition how about when black players first came into the league? Right. I don’t even need to go down this path because it not only counters the sentiment, it absolutely obliterates it.

In addition the actual make up of teams were different. The players rarely changed because there wasn’t free agency. So you didn’t have a choice. You got who you got. It made no sense to talk about “what if we could replace so-and-so” because it just wasn’t happening. It didn’t start in baseball until 1976, and even then it wasn’t the free for all it is today. We should all know when it began in the nba as it was Tom Chambers breaking the seal in 1988. It didn’t start in the NFL until plan B in 1989, and even that wasn’t the unfettered free agency we see today that began in 1992. So prior to all that we were stuck with what we had. When players became more mercenary and the names changed so did the level of support for them individually by fans.

And none of that even takes into consideration the proliferation of the press, Social media, internet, more information, more sophisticated consumers, etc. It wasn’t unusual for fans to not even know who the GM was eons ago, but now they are in press conferences, they’re regular interviewed throughout the season, etc. we also know more about what they do, more about the salary cap. Same can be said for coaches and players. We just know more now than at other time in the history of sports. As a result the consumer (and sports are a product) possesses more information about how the ingredients and how the meal is prepared than at earlier ages. And due to social media they have a stage from which to convey their opinion. Going back decades the only stage was at the game, talking to friends, or around the water cooler. So we were all also exposed to fewer opinions and perspectives.

I wanna say, oh **** you.... but I can't. Ya know I totally forgot about pre free agency when teams owned their guys . FA certainly had a huge impact on fans calling for rapid changes. Seeing teams go worst to first every couple years has an impact as well. Building a winning team isn't so much a process like it used to be....it's an action? Free agency made it so most players don't play their entire career with one team.

 

[oaken1]

I’m a lawyer. I can’t help it.

Yeah.... we try not to hold that against ya.




As long as you ain't a family law attorney

 

[yagetonemoreyear]

....... snippity-snip
........

What it has done is exposed the real number of people in this country that are so gullible and easily swayed as well as those who have agendas. ..... ....

That, a million times, that.

 

[SissyBoyFloyd]

I wanna say, oh **** you.... but I can't. Ya know I totally forgot about pre free agency when teams owned their guys . FA certainly had a huge impact on fans calling for rapid changes. Seeing teams go worst to first every couple years has an impact as well. Building a winning team isn't so much a process like it used to be....it's an action? Free agency made it so most players don't play their entire career with one team.

Another example of how darn old I have gotten. When I wrote the beginning epitaph, I had forgotten all about pre-FA. That was certainly a main factor of why your team's players seemed more like 'your guys.' Thx for reminding me of such an obvious variable.

And thanks to everyone who felt like joining this discussion. I wasn't sure my thread would get any response or looked upon as having any interest or merit. Sometimes I just start thinking about something and feel the need to start writing it down and see where it takes me. Often when re-read it, it is like I hadn't written it and was 'hearing it for the first time. Not to mention the desire to answer or respond to my own post as if it was written by someone else.

Gotta run, they lock the doors of the institution at 5pm. Don't want to miss out on dinner .... it's pizza night for those still capable of chewing.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Yeah.... we try not to hold that against ya.




As long as you ain't a family law attorney

No. God no. I’m not even a litigator.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Another example of how darn old I have gotten. When I wrote the beginning epitaph, I had forgotten all about pre-FA. That was certainly a main factor of why your team's players seemed more like 'your guys.' Thx for reminding me of such an obvious variable.

And thanks to everyone who felt like joining this discussion. I wasn't sure my thread would get any response or looked upon as having any interest or merit. Sometimes I just start thinking about something and feel the need to start writing it down and see where it takes me. Often when re-read it, it is like I hadn't written it and was 'hearing it for the first time. Not to mention the desire to answer or respond to my own post as if it was written by someone else.

Gotta run, they lock the doors of the institution at 5pm. Don't want to miss out on dinner .... it's pizza night for those still capable of chewing.

Lol. This is a great post.

Honestly it was a really thought provoking thread imo. It obviously took me down a few different paths. I enjoyed the thought exercise. And frankly, I’ve been a bit surprised it didn’t attract more discussion.

 

[THESMEL]

I’m not accepting this guilt trip, no way - I fanned the browns before the cards came to Arizona. The drive, the fumble, going all the way back to Leroy Kelly and the perfect dolphins barely beating browns in the playoffs.

this team has the talent to compete for this championship, it doesn’t because it did not run the ball against the best pass rush in the NFL, against all time great sackers in Donald and Miller. It’s not my fault, I have a clear conscience, I’ve been belting full bore fir 15 years, even got me kicked off the cards main site, with clear conscienc! I broke no rules, just disagreed with popular members.

it’s just plain stupid, that Conner is the back up 2nd stringer, that made the pro bowl. Somebody else address it? Drake had 1000 yards from scrimmage for cards last year and is a back up to jacobs In Vegas. but Drake was our starter and chase was the back up!

so we try to pass every stupid down against the rams in the playoffs and get our as wiped, has happen so many time in the last 15 years, you ain’t blaming me or my fan hood for such ignorance, fundamentally flawed football philosophy, strategy, gameplan or play calling.

you ain’t blaming, Kyler, oline ot the defense that’s bull crap! AZ media doesn’t mention it like ever. Announcers noticed, Kurt Warner expunged on it, NFL shows vomited it over and over behind, during and after the game. But our coaches, players, gm don’t know what happened! Rams just played better with 17 passes and 38 freaking runs. Cards are losing me, Kingsbury, BA, Whis! QB whisperer my butt - it is the problem, passing to much, playing one dimensional.

I don’t care if we ever pass another down until we establish a run game, that can neutralize the rams pass rush, and open up our play action, rpo 3 dimensional game plan. Take constant pressure off our oline and rest our defense. ST might be able to compete in field position battle! That really really sucked , did not optimize our talent, but wasted it.

will see who us more valuable to others right now! James Conner or chase Edmonds? they both have talent, but only one starts for another team next year. And it ain’t the one cards started. They can kiss my grits.

 

[cardsfanmd]

I give this a 74 without the poll. There’s potential for an 82 with it.

 

[cardpa]

Interesting topic. A lot to unpack. So let’s dive in . . .

First, what happened to that era? Nothing. Because it didn’t exist. The idyllic picture you paint is a figment of your nostalgia. The phrase “get rid of that bum!” certainly didn’t originate with today’s generation. That harkens back to a much earlier age. And the word “boo” was certainly created, and used extensively, going back decades, of not centuries. People have always known and recognized a bad product and made themselves vocal about it. I mean, here’s a story of how the Brooklyn Dodgers became known as “Dem Bums” in 1939.

Why were the Brooklyn Dodgers called the Brooklyn Bums? – Easierwithpractice.com

easierwithpractice.com

But it became a quaint story. But it wasn’t to that cabbie at that time. But it’s the same thing. Fans are going to be happy or angry depending on the product their given.

and if you really want to say that fans way back when supported their teams, players, coaches, etc without condition how about when black players first came into the league? Right. I don’t even need to go down this path because it not only counters the sentiment, it absolutely obliterates it.

In addition the actual make up of teams were different. The players rarely changed because there wasn’t free agency. So you didn’t have a choice. You got who you got. It made no sense to talk about “what if we could replace so-and-so” because it just wasn’t happening. It didn’t start in baseball until 1976, and even then it wasn’t the free for all it is today. We should all know when it began in the nba as it was Tom Chambers breaking the seal in 1988. It didn’t start in the NFL until plan B in 1989, and even that wasn’t the unfettered free agency we see today that began in 1992. So prior to all that we were stuck with what we had. When players became more mercenary and the names changed so did the level of support for them individually by fans.

And none of that even takes into consideration the proliferation of the press, Social media, internet, more information, more sophisticated consumers, etc. It wasn’t unusual for fans to not even know who the GM was eons ago, but now they are in press conferences, they’re regular interviewed throughout the season, etc. we also know more about what they do, more about the salary cap. Same can be said for coaches and players. We just know more now than at other time in the history of sports. As a result the consumer (and sports are a product) possesses more information about how the ingredients and how the meal is prepared than at earlier ages. And due to social media they have a stage from which to convey their opinion. Going back decades the only stage was at the game, talking to friends, or around the water cooler. So we were all also exposed to fewer opinions and perspectives.

I think these two sentences say a lot. Loyalty or at least perceived loyalty to the team by players. Free agency goes back to Curt Flood St Louis Cardinals and his lawsuit against MLB. That is where it all started as I recall. I'm sure many a fan were dishearten when a favorite player left the team via FA to chase a better contract. I don't blame the player especially in football given the short life span of a football player's career. Then salary caps pushed the movement of players even more as they were meant to limit the ability of teams with deep pockets from dominating for extended periods of time.

 

[pemory09]

Can’t do this and here’s why: the current situation is just too dreadful, with no good end in sight. We have a GM who likely knows he won’t have the chance to hire another HC, despite the fact that his current HC is failing. And that failing HC is inextricably connected to our franchise QB who was drafted by the GM who selected said QB and is also a buddy of our owner. In other words, the four most important pieces of the franchise are the above mentioned owner, GM, HC, and QB who are all interconnected, so there’s really no chance of any objective accounting moving forward. This thing is likely headed for a complete meltdown unless…unless, this team (that has thus far shown no ability to win must win games) wins a championship. I have no faith whatsoever they can do so.