Warriors @ Suns Saturday game thread 2-29-20

AzStevenCal

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Most of those bounce passes into the interior are bad passes that are forced in. I have been pretty impressed by Ayton's hands. He catches passes that many others could not.

Yeah I haven't jumped onto the "bounce pass" explanation for Ayton's hands either. Most of the time he has great hands and no problem handling good bounce passes. Except, sometimes his hands just stop working (or his brain or his eyesight?) and for a few minutes he fumbles away everything and it doesn't matter whether it's a bounce pass, a lob pass or a rebound. I can't remember ever seeing a player with such great hands have this kind of problem before and I have no explanation. But it's not new, I've been commenting about it since well before we drafted him.
 

Ouchie-Z-Clown

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Most of those bounce passes into the interior are bad passes that are forced in. I have been pretty impressed by Ayton's hands. He catches passes that many others could not.
I’ll give you some, but not most. Ayton doesn’t try hard enough to corral those.
 

BC867

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I appreciate how Jerry Colangelo put the Suns on the map, although not with his not outgrowing
the 50-and-fade concept over the decades.

But Sarver is a banker who is evidently in it only for the money. And his ego. With no regard for
Phoenix or for Suns fans. Should we be shocked? He's a banker! Jerry should have researched
that aspect more than he evidently did.

And now, we are stuck . . . for as long as Sarver can get away with it. I almost wish at this point
that we hit rock bottom with some sort of scandal to cause the League to turn on him, so we
can start again. But there is no sign of that.

And we will all continue to be frustrated. Especially when the day comes that Devin Booker gives
up on the Suns. And Deandre Ayton follows. Could that be rock bottom?
 
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Mainstreet

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This is the most hopeless I've ever been after a loss. At this point I have no idea if we'll ever make the playoffs again, I kind of doubt it as long as Sarver owns the team. I've followed the team some 1980 and multiple playoff losses to the Lakers hurt. The drug scandal years hurt but nowhere as long as this. The Houston Rockets hurt badly coming back 3-1 two years in a row, but we were at least contenders. I know it's the frustration talking but I wish I could quit caring.

Agree. It's the hopelessness. We all knew the Suns were going to bounce back under Jerry Colangelo.

Now I'm not sure how the Suns think in regard to free agency, trades, the draft or even if they know a good player when they see one. Maybe the Oubre trade was mostly luck after all. Too much quiet in the Suns front office for my liking.
 

GatorAZ

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I appreciate how Jerry Colangelo put the Suns on the map, although not with his not outgrowing
the 50-and-fade concept over the decades.

But Sarver is a banker who is evidently in it only for the money. And his ego. With no regard for
Phoenix or for Suns fans. Should we be shocked? He's a banker!
Jerry should have researched
that aspect more than he evidently did.

And now, we are stuck . . . for as long as Sarver can get away with it. I almost wish at this point
that we hit rock bottom with some sort of scandal to cause the League to turn on him, so we
can start again. But there is no sign of that.

And we will all continue to be frustrated. Especially when the day comes that Devin Booker gives
up on the Suns. And Deandre Ayton follows. Could that be rock bottom?

This was evident when they pinched pennies during SSOL. What kind of jackass owner doesn’t want to do everything to win a title at the beginning of his tenure to become a Valley legend?
 

BC867

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This was evident when they pinched pennies during SSOL. What kind of jackass owner doesn’t want to do everything to win a title at the beginning of his tenure to become a Valley legend?
Because he thought he could pick up where Jerry left off, which Sarver, of course, did not earn.

Calling attention to himself by waving a foam finger in the stands and counting his profits were evidently
his top priorities. I don't think he considered himself a jackass. Even now, despite an embarrassing decade.
He lucked into a billion dollar windfall. The banker has the last laugh.

Apparently, from his point of view, that took priority over putting together a winning team by hiring
experienced basketball management and letting them do their jobs for the sake of the fans.

Being a narcissist is a personality disorder. Far more serious than being a jackass. A jackass sees how
people react to him. A narcissist does not. As the saying goes, he's laughing all the way to the bank.
 

Phrazbit

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I’ll give you some, but not most. Ayton doesn’t try hard enough to corral those.

I think the problem is that his first instinct is to gather and control, rather than just grab the ball and attack. The effort is there, but in the lane surrounded by defenders there is a fraction of a second to decide what to do, on those low passes his "grab and take a dribble" plan is the wrong choice.

It's like he is too worried about being called for traveling. This is the NBA, in the paint you're more likely to draw a foul on the other team by leaping straight into a defender while only having marginal control of the ball than you are to draw a travel after taking 5 steps.
 

Bufalay

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This is definitely my low point as a fan even considering the postseason disappointments. I was pretty disappointed from many of the playoff losses such as when Cotton's KC team upset us and I was angry as hell when the refs cheated us (and there is no other way to say it) in a loss at New York during the Nash days. We dominated the game but thanks to maybe 50 horrible calls/non-calls the Knicks managed to stay close and ultimately beat us in triple OT. All those losses hurt but they didn't suck the hope out of me. These two have.
Tim Donaghy officiated that game.
 

ArizonaSportsFan

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yup... Booker and Ayton as foundational players is basically building castles made of sand. It's why coming out of last year's worst season in Suns history with only Cam Johnson to show for it was so devastating. Neither of our two "stars" are a) leaders and b) the total package of talent, physical ability and beast attitude. Missing out on Ja and Zion... two bona-fide number 1 players that could have knocked Book and Ayton down to very very good #2/#3s was what we needed. But the lotto gods screwed us and the rest, I fear, will be history.

we're stuck in a terrible position... much like I think the T-Wolves have been stuck in. There's no doubt Booker and Ayton are our best players, but they just aren't superstars and have done nothing to elevate this team out of being awful. Is there a talent void in the rest of the squad? Yeah... but if any team has what they believe are two superstars or at least a superstar and a budding one (which is what most people here believed, especially when Booker got "snubbed"), then those two guys should be able to elevate much more than what's going on. And they don't. They just simply don't.
I think we are being a bit heavy-handed here. Besides LeBron and Giannis, who are these bona-fide leaders we are talking about? LeBron has had gravity forever, and it took Giannis awhile to become who he is. You list Ja and Zion as two bona-fide #1 players and neither have done anything yet. Ja runs his mouth and is fun to watch (at times) but let's pump the brakes a little. Ja is Fox from last year, basically. Is Fox a bona-fide #1 too? Don't get me wrong, I would LOVE to have either on the Suns. The NBA has crowned Zion, so we will have to see if he can stay healthy.
That being said, we have seen this team play really well - just a week ago, in fact. And we have seen this team play miserably. No, I don't think that Booker is a certified superstar, but he certainly can become better than what he is today.
 
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Cheesebeef

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I think we are being a bit heavy-handed here. Besides LeBron and Giannis, who are these bona-fide leaders we are talking about? LeBron has had gravity forever, and it took Giannis awhile to become who he is. You list Ja and Zion as two bona-fide #1 players and neither have done anything yet. Ja runs his mouth and is fun to watch (at times) but let's pump the brakes a little. Ja is Fox from last year, basically.


my bad... i should have said potential number 1s. Guys who don't just put up stats but actually make an impact, moving the needle in the win column as well. And you and I have had this conversation before on who are the leader/superstars in the game. I'm not gonna rehash it again.

my biggest problem with Booker is that he's talked for a couple years now about wanting to get to the playoffs... well... guess what... the West isn't nearly as good as it has been and getting the 8 seed is within reach and now in Booker's first actually meaningful games in the second half of the season, he hasn't elevated his game and the team... just the opposite. that's incredibly disappointing. If we took care of Detroit and GS, we'd be 3 games back of the 8 seed. Instead we broke 7 and 8 game losing streaks for two of the worst teams in the league... at home.
 

82CardsGrad

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my bad... i should have said potential number 1s. Guys who don't just put up stats but actually make an impact, moving the needle in the win column as well. And you and I have had this conversation before on who are the leader/superstars in the game. I'm not gonna rehash it again.

my biggest problem with Booker is that he's talked for a couple years now about wanting to get to the playoffs... well... guess what... the West isn't nearly as good as it has been and getting the 8 seed is within reach and now in Booker's first actually meaningful games in the second half of the season, he hasn't elevated his game and the team... just the opposite. that's incredibly disappointing. If we took care of Detroit and GS, we'd be 3 games back of the 8 seed. Instead we broke 7 and 8 game losing streaks for two of the worst teams in the league... at home.

I know Booker has now provided a ton of ammo to shoot this perspective down... but... He is still only 23 years old. And I know many other young guys have shown themselves to be able to raise themselves and their teams to higher levels. So with Book, it remains SO DAMN Frustrating... I mean, look at what Zion is doing, right???
Jut gotta hope Book continues to mature physically and mentally... And that one day, SOONER rather than later, he is able to become the leader his talent suggest he should be!
 

GatorAZ

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I know Booker has now provided a ton of ammo to shoot this perspective down... but... He is still only 23 years old. And I know many other young guys have shown themselves to be able to raise themselves and their teams to higher levels. So with Book, it remains SO DAMN Frustrating... I mean, look at what Zion is doing, right???
Jut gotta hope Book continues to mature physically and mentally... And that one day, SOONER rather than later, he is able to become the leader his talent suggest he should be!

Yeah but 23 isn’t THAT young if you’ve been in the league for five years. As for maturing physically idk how much his body has changed from his 2nd/3rd year and I don’t really know what to expect it to look like at 26-27. Maybe Allan Houston?

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ArizonaSportsFan

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my bad... i should have said potential number 1s. Guys who don't just put up stats but actually make an impact, moving the needle in the win column as well. And you and I have had this conversation before on who are the leader/superstars in the game. I'm not gonna rehash it again.

my biggest problem with Booker is that he's talked for a couple years now about wanting to get to the playoffs... well... guess what... the West isn't nearly as good as it has been and getting the 8 seed is within reach and now in Booker's first actually meaningful games in the second half of the season, he hasn't elevated his game and the team... just the opposite. that's incredibly disappointing. If we took care of Detroit and GS, we'd be 3 games back of the 8 seed. Instead we broke 7 and 8 game losing streaks for two of the worst teams in the league... at home.
Completely agree with your second paragraph here. I am disappointed, and a little surprised, myself.
 

devilalum

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Hey Suns!

You give us your worst players and we’ll work with them for a few weeks and come back here and beat the best squad you can put on the floor.

In your house.

That’s how pathetic your franchise has become.


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