Thoughts on the O-line (pre pre-season game 2)

BACH

Superbowl, Homeboy!
Joined
May 14, 2002
Posts
5,664
Reaction score
797
Location
A rotten place...
There are several threads evaluating the first pre season game and couldn't decide which one to post in, so I started this thread instead.

I was very worried about the state of the O-line going into this season and the first action got me to relax a bit more. Not saying that I don't still see the Oline as the biggest weakness on the team, but at least I can see this working out now.

Run-Blocking
I'm very impressed with the run-blocking in this game. The starters looked very good and the back-up looked good as well.

Pass-Blocking
Not as impressive. As in.. Not very good. The starters looked decent in very limited play, but gave up a free runner on the 3rd play of the game. Pretty sure that Iupati missed on that one. The back-ups had issues all day and especially the back-up tackles didn't look good at all.

Veldheer, Iupati and Mathis - Didn't see a lot of these guys and have little to comment on. These guys are going to be good!

DJ Humphries - Much better than the comments on this forum suggset IMO. He looked really good in run-blocking, but had some issues in pass blocking. Forget JJ Watt. Forget Von Miller. Khalil Mack is the best pass rusher in the NFL and naturally Humphries struggled against him like all other OT in the NFL would. It looked to me that Humpries settled down during the game and maybe nerves got to him in the beginning. Hopefully that is the case and he will improve over the pre season. It's still not a perfect situation, but at least I think it's a manageble situation, where Humphries can start with some help from time to time. Run blocking - passed. Pass blocking - Neither pass nor fail.

AQ Shipley - He looked okay. Nothing more. It's obvious that his short arms are an issue but I like his play. He can start, but he's probably never going to be more that an average starter.

Evan Boehm - First off. Really annoyed that no one seem to be able to pronounce his name. No. He's not a Batman villain! OE does not equal an A! I did like his play, however. Actually very positively surprised after the stories of his development in camp. BA doesn't like playing rookies at skill positions until late in the season and given his performance in this game, I wonder if this is the case here. If his level of play continues I expect him to be pushing Shipley by mid-season. I would love to see him against #1 at some point in the pre-season.

Back-up Gs - Solid showing from both Toner and McClain. Toner stood out among the back-ups. I expected him to land on the PS, but he could be pushing for a spot among the final 53. Not sure about McClain as I believe he used up all his eligibility to land on the PS.

Back-up Ts - Rob Crisp has been talked up for two years. Didn't show it. Wetzel was hot and cold. Good on some plays, bad on others. Not a good showing by any of these guys.

Summary:
Not as concerned about the starters as I was before the game. Humphries is still incomplete so we have to see if he can work out. I'm staying positive and think that with some help he can settled into a solid starter during the season. I think Shipley will do okay as the short term answer at C and think Boehm showed enough promise to fit the role of the long term answer.
Very positive over Toner. If he continue to play like this, he will make the final 53 IMO.
I'm still concerned about the depth at tackle. Watford showed last year that he can back-up RT, but I don't like him practicing at three different position. Can he hold his focus if he's needed at RT again after taking most snaps at C and G? Who's the back-up LT if Humphries doesn't improve his pass-blocking fast? With the showing of the back-up OTs I would take a long talk with Jake Long. Remember, he didn't fail his physical, he wanted a garanteed contract.

Roster predictions:
Roster - Veldheer, Iupati, Shipley, Mathis, Humphries, Boehm, Watford and Toner (8)
PS - Wetzel and McClain (if eligible).

Only 8 Olinemen on the final roster. And that's WITH Toner. I didn't see anything from anyone else to make me think that they are one of the top 53 on this roster. We desperately need a swing tackle! Only issue is that Beatty and Long are the only options right now.

EDIT: Brainfart on my part. Was writing this offline on a plane based on mental notes. I messed up Left and Right. Of Course Wetzel replaced Veldheer and Crisp Humphries. Edited it my post. Meant what I wrote about the performance, however.
 
Last edited:

Shaggy

Site Owner Administrator
Administrator
Moderator
Joined
Sep 29, 2008
Posts
9,018
Reaction score
2,952
Location
Arizona
Hope Mclain hangs as he is a Cardinal that thought I was Palmer for a few seconds when I saw him. :)

I saw maybe 2 plays were Humphries was really in it. The one is where AQ helped out as I think Mack made a move and was just about to burn DJ and AQ came in to save the day.

What I was hoping to see is more of Chandler Jones. He didn't do much in his limited time, did he?
 

Garthshort

ASFN Addict
Joined
Aug 11, 2002
Posts
9,001
Reaction score
4,860
Location
Scarsdale, NY
I thought that Wetzel played LT and Crisp played RT. Seeing that, I was surprised because I thought that Crisp was a LT. Bach had it as Crisp LT and Wetzel RT. So which way was it?
 

Mitch

Crawled Through 5 FB Fields
Joined
Aug 10, 2005
Posts
13,405
Reaction score
2,982
Location
Wrentham, MA
I thought that Wetzel played LT and Crisp played RT. Seeing that, I was surprised because I thought that Crisp was a LT. Bach had it as Crisp LT and Wetzel RT. So which way was it?

When DJ got extended snaps at RT, Wetzel played LT. He is ahead of Crisp on the depth chart. Crisp did play RT. Wetzel stayed at LT. They might be testing whether Wetzel can fill Sowell's swing tackle role.
 

Cbus cardsfan

Back to Back ASFN FFL Champion
Joined
May 14, 2002
Posts
21,148
Reaction score
6,589
Shipley is awful and should not be a starter on any NFL team, much less a SB contending team. He's the weakest part of the OL by far. I wasn't a big Sendlein fan but he's much better than Shipley.

If you like small, slow C's that get bull rushed, then AQ is your guy. I hope Boehm gets the job but he'll likely have to win it camp because teams are pretty hesitant to switch centers mid-season and mess with continuity. Plus, I'm assuming Shipley is making all the line calls.
 

Mitch

Crawled Through 5 FB Fields
Joined
Aug 10, 2005
Posts
13,405
Reaction score
2,982
Location
Wrentham, MA
Too bad Watford is injured. He could make a push to start at center. I don't think Boehm is ready yet. Teams will see the center as the weak link and fire the A gaps left and right.
 

BurqueCardFan

Hall of Famer
Joined
Aug 17, 2006
Posts
1,742
Reaction score
1,682
Location
Albuquerque, NM
I'm also a little surprised that we are going to go into the season with such an inexperienced long snapper. That just seems like one of the small details on a super bowl contending team, that could be a problem at crunch time. I know the position is slim but I wonder if any veteran long snappers were available?
 

Mitch

Crawled Through 5 FB Fields
Joined
Aug 10, 2005
Posts
13,405
Reaction score
2,982
Location
Wrentham, MA
I'm also a little surprised that we are going to go into the season with such an inexperienced long snapper. That just seems like one of the small details on a super bowl contending team, that could be a problem at crunch time. I know the position is slim but I wonder if any veteran long snappers were available?

Excellent point, BCF. I think Kiem will definitely be combing the waiver wire, unless he and BA are convinced that Dillon or Canaday can do the job.
 

MadCardDisease

Moderator
Moderator
Supporting Member
Joined
May 13, 2002
Posts
19,824
Reaction score
11,761
Location
Chandler, Az
I pretty much agree with your take as I keyed on the following players.

DJ looked much better that I expected but he was also getting help against the 1st team defense of the raiders. There were times where he got beat by the pass rush. However I was really impressed with his run blocking. He was inconsistent but you can see the upside he has as he gets more experience. He calmed some of my fears at RT.

Shipley held up better than I expected. He played smart and was encouraged by his play.

I was very impressed with the play of Evan Boehm. I thought he looked really good out there compared to his play in camp. He seemed to thrive under the bright lights of UoP.

Toner also looked impressive for a rookie. I like his upside and think he is a bubble player right now and is guaranteed a spot on the practice squad as of today.
 

MadCardDisease

Moderator
Moderator
Supporting Member
Joined
May 13, 2002
Posts
19,824
Reaction score
11,761
Location
Chandler, Az
I'm also a little surprised that we are going to go into the season with such an inexperienced long snapper. That just seems like one of the small details on a super bowl contending team, that could be a problem at crunch time. I know the position is slim but I wonder if any veteran long snappers were available?

I didn't see any issues with the long snapping during the game or at the practices that I attended. Not sure we need to worry at this point.
 

Bodha

ASFN Addict
BANNED BY MODERATORS
Joined
Sep 3, 2011
Posts
5,710
Reaction score
754
Im very concerned about T depth.

Bunch of rookie no-names are our security if Veldheer or Hump go down? Makes me super nervous.
 

Cbus cardsfan

Back to Back ASFN FFL Champion
Joined
May 14, 2002
Posts
21,148
Reaction score
6,589
So if Shipley was any good, we would have run for 270 yards?
You're pulling out pre-season game stats as a counter? Defensive coordinators are going to expose Shipley and the A gap all year.

That said, I still think the Cards are the best team in the league. Center is the main point of concern on the offense though.
 

kerouac9

Klowned by Keim
Joined
Feb 14, 2003
Posts
36,522
Reaction score
25,969
Location
Gilbert, AZ
Im very concerned about T depth.

Bunch of rookie no-names are our security if Veldheer or Hump go down? Makes me super nervous.

Watford is going to be the backup at all five positions, I think. It's only the second injury on the OL that should make you nervous.

You're pulling out pre-season game stats as a counter? Defensive coordinators are going to expose Shipley and the A gap all year.

That said, I still think the Cards are the best team in the league. Center is the main point of concern on the offense though.

It'll depend what happens with Humphries. If Knee Deep needs help on both sides on passing downs, it's going to be a problem. If he can hang tight on an island at least some times, then we can use Mathis to help out in the middle.

Every team is always blitzing the A-gap these days, it feels like.
 

Proximo

ASFN Icon
Joined
Mar 8, 2015
Posts
11,763
Reaction score
9,356
Im very concerned about T depth.

Bunch of rookie no-names are our security if Veldheer or Hump go down? Makes me super nervous.

Me too, I would be trading up to a 4th rounder for a decent veteran T right about now if I was keim. Our window is now, our window is gone if Palmer gets hurt seriously again.
 

Proximo

ASFN Icon
Joined
Mar 8, 2015
Posts
11,763
Reaction score
9,356
Yeah, I thought bohem looked great. He did not get pushed around at all, so this doesn't surprise me.

Even so I doubt they put him into the lineup this year as long as Shipley is serviceable and doesn't get hurt.
 

Snakester

Draft Man
Joined
Sep 14, 2002
Posts
5,325
Reaction score
1,932
Location
North Carolina
There are several threads evaluating the first pre season game and couldn't decide which one to post in, so I started this thread instead.

I was very worried about the state of the O-line going into this season and the first action got me to relax a bit more. Not saying that I don't still see the Oline as the biggest weakness on the team, but at least I can see this working out now.

Run-Blocking
I'm very impressed with the run-blocking in this game. The starters looked very good and the back-up looked good as well.

Pass-Blocking
Not as impressive. As in.. Not very good. The starters looked decent in very limited play, but gave up a free runner on the 3rd play of the game. Pretty sure that Iupati missed on that one. The back-ups had issues all day and especially the back-up tackles didn't look good at all.

Veldheer, Iupati and Mathis - Didn't see a lot of these guys and have little to comment on. These guys are going to be good!

DJ Humphries - Much better than the comments on this forum suggset IMO. He looked really good in run-blocking, but had some issues in pass blocking. Forget JJ Watt. Forget Von Miller. Khalil Mack is the best pass rusher in the NFL and naturally Humphries struggled against him like all other OT in the NFL would. It looked to me that Humpries settled down during the game and maybe nerves got to him in the beginning. Hopefully that is the case and he will improve over the pre season. It's still not a perfect situation, but at least I think it's a manageble situation, where Humphries can start with some help from time to time. Run blocking - passed. Pass blocking - Neither pass nor fail.

AQ Shipley - He looked okay. Nothing more. It's obvious that his short arms are an issue but I like his play. He can start, but he's probably never going to be more that an average starter.

Evan Boehm - First off. Really annoyed that no one seem to be able to pronounce his name. No. He's not a Batman villain! OE does not equal an A! I did like his play, however. Actually very positively surprised after the stories of his development in camp. BA doesn't like playing rookies at skill positions until late in the season and given his performance in this game, I wonder if this is the case here. If his level of play continues I expect him to be pushing Shipley by mid-season. I would love to see him against #1 at some point in the pre-season.

Back-up Gs - Solid showing from both Toner and McClain. Toner stood out among the back-ups. I expected him to land on the PS, but he could be pushing for a spot among the final 53. Not sure about McClain as I believe he used up all his eligibility to land on the PS.

Back-up Ts - Rob Crisp has been talked up for two years. Didn't show it. Wetzel was hot and cold. Good on some plays, bad on others. Not a good showing by any of these guys.

Summary:
Not as concerned about the starters as I was before the game. Humphries is still incomplete so we have to see if he can work out. I'm staying positive and think that with some help he can settled into a solid starter during the season. I think Shipley will do okay as the short term answer at C and think Boehm showed enough promise to fit the role of the long term answer.
Very positive over Toner. If he continue to play like this, he will make the final 53 IMO.
I'm still concerned about the depth at tackle. Watford showed last year that he can back-up RT, but I don't like him practicing at three different position. Can he hold his focus if he's needed at RT again after taking most snaps at C and G? Who's the back-up LT if Humphries doesn't improve his pass-blocking fast? With the showing of the back-up OTs I would take a long talk with Jake Long. Remember, he didn't fail his physical, he wanted a garanteed contract.

Roster predictions:
Roster - Veldheer, Iupati, Shipley, Mathis, Humphries, Boehm, Watford and Toner (8)
PS - Wetzel and McClain (if eligible).

Only 8 Olinemen on the final roster. And that's WITH Toner. I didn't see anything from anyone else to make me think that they are one of the top 53 on this roster. We desperately need a swing tackle! Only issue is that Beatty and Long are the only options right now.

EDIT: Brainfart on my part. Was writing this offline on a plane based on mental notes. I messed up Left and Right. Of Course Wetzel replaced Veldheer and Crisp Humphries. Edited it my post. Meant what I wrote about the performance, however.
Very good write up. I agree with all of it. I think at some point we will have to bring in a vet tackle and like you said Jake Long would be a good one to talk to. Like you I was most impressed with Boehm and Toner out of the backups.
 
Top