Sorting Through This Mess

Mitch

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The Cardinals are a mess right now. There's no sense denying it.

I have been "all in" on Bruce Arians and Steve Keim from the get-go because Arians is an aggressive coach who demands accountability and commitment from his players and Keim has put on a clinic as far as I am concerned about how to make an unprecedented flurry (for the Cardinals in recent decades) of moves to improve the quality and depth of the football team. The wizard behind the curtain is Mike Disner who has found creative and reasonable ways to manage the salary cap while Keim went on his shopping spree, reining in quality free agents at discount prices.

For any fan to expect that things wouldn't be a little messy at this point would be completely naive. Whenever a new coaching staff is turning over the roster while putting in new systems, you are going to encounter a significant amount of flux.

The question is---is the Cardinals current situation messier than what you would normally expect?

I think it is---and it bothers me to say this because of my affinity for the triad of Michael Bidwill, Bruce Arians and Steve Keim.

Arians' Offense:

What jumps out is how the current personnel doesn't quite fit the system. This is an offense that thrives on a vertical passing attack---which requires a strong armed pocket passer, a well functioning offensive line and a cadre of fast and capable wide receivers.

In Carson Palmer the team has the QB it needs---although, because Palmer is highly immobile, defenses will be able to load up on sticky man-to-man coverages without the fear of getting burned via the QB scramble.

This wouldn't be as much of an issue if the Cardinals had WRs who can quickly attain separation versus sticky man (alas in a division that excels in sticky man-to-man coverages). However, not one of the current WRs on the Cardinals' roster could be considered a legitimate deep threat....which is one of the reasons why Carson Palmer keeps talking about "50/50 balls"...as in throw the ball up to a covered Fitzgerald or Floyd and hope that he comes down with it.

This is the reason too why BA has put in a WR package for CB Patrick Peterson. Peterson has the speed and athleticism that BA covets at the WR position. The problem is---he is taking the best athlete from the defense and therefore may be weakening the defense if Peterson tires or has to sit out some plays. When one considers how poor the other CBs on the roster have been in man coverage this pre-season, it makes you worry even more about the defense, especially if Peterson is out of the game at times.

What we do not know, either, is how Peterson is going to embrace the role as a WR specialist. It will be interesting to see how Peterson responds after the first time he gets clocked. That will test his resolve big-time. Right now Peterson appears to be game---but right now his role on offense is a romantic phantasm in BA's and PP's minds. Wait until a hard charging strong safety tries to take the romance out of that notion. Then we will see just how resolute Peterson is.

The next issue is BA calling his 5 RBs his "strongest unit." That would be fine and dandy if for one BA's offense was predicated on a full-tilt power running game, and for two if the offensive line was skilled at run blocking. The Denver Broncos' second team offensive line looked much more skilled at run blocking than any point for the Cardinals' starting offensive line this pre-season, even with Jonathan Cooper in the lineup.

The fact of the matter is---Bruce Arians runs the ball to keep the defense honest and to sucker the safeties up toward the box so that it's easier to throw deep. Arians is a run when they least expect it offensive coach. He's not going to pound the ball unless he's running out the clock.

What's the number one criterion for an Arians RB?

He has to be able to pass protect.

That tells you everything you need to know about Arians' offense.

Sure it's good that the Cardinals have 5 good RBs---don't get me wrong.

But---it's not so good that the line is not adept at run blocking, that the WR unit is slow and that the TEs are below average run blockers and pass receivers.

This---for a personnel standpoint---is a mess.

Compounded by losing the best offensive lineman, Jonathan Cooper---man was that an egregious and cruel twist of fate once again for the Cardinals.

Even worse, in my opinion, is yesterday's decision to place Cooper on the season-ending IR list...for a number of salient reasons:

1. Cooper's injury, thank goodness, did not involve ligament damage and thus he is going to have an easier time getting back on the football field than say David DeCastro last year with the Steelers.

2. Cooper's eventual return provided the team and all of us with hope---as in hang in there because help is on its way. That hope has been eliminated.

3. The reason the decision was made, according to BA&SK is that they may need to use the part-time IR on another player---but---how many players on the current roster could be more important than Cooper? Plus, if one of the better players gets hurt and needs a few weeks, you can still keep him on the roster.

4. Waiting a whole year to come back can actually make things more difficult for Cooper...or any player for that matter. The sooner the player can return to the field the better because the sooner the player learns to conquer his fears about the injury, the better. Waiting a whole year gives the player too much time to think and wonder. Too much time to think is often the worst thing that can happen to a football player.

it does not bode well for the Cardinals either that 2012 5th round pick Senio Kelemete couldn't be a factor where the need is so great, Daryn Colledge is fighting off injuries and a horrible 2012 performance. Paul Fanaika didn't even play football last year, but has won the RG job somehow---can he play when the lights go on? At least 4th round pick Earl Watford put on a show this past Thursday night that was the best guard play I saw all PS.

Meanwhile, one of the Cardinals three most talented offensive lineman, Bobbie Massey can't even find a spot on this makeshift line. Go figure.

The best block I've seen all PS came Thursday night from TE/FB Richard Quinn---but for some reason, he was cut. Again, is this a power running scheme?

As for the defense---the mess there is just as worrisome, if not more.

For one, is anyone really clear about what Todd Bowles system really is?

We were told from the get-go in celebratory fashion by Darnell Dockett and Calais Campbell that they have been unfettered and are now free to shoot gaps and be ultra aggressive.

Did anyone see this happen even once during the entire pre-season?

Not just from DD or CC---but from any Cardinal interior defensive lineman?

The best interior lineman in the PS has been Ronald Talley---but Talley hasn't been penetrating---he's been standing up his man at the POA and flowing horizontally to the ball. Fine.

The defense in the last two PS games couldn't come close to stopping the run. The NT position is practically non-existant, the DEs are slow, don't penetrate to disrupt the timing of plays and other than Talley or occasionally rookie Padric Scott, they don't tackle.

The best inside linebacker by far, imo, has been Kevin Minter, but he isn't even going to start. Brinkley has been more athletic than advertised, but he doesn't have Minter's nose for the ball. Karlos Dansby looks rusty, but is moving well, if not finsishing tackles the way he or any ILB should.

Even worse is what's happening on the edge. The OLBers are slow, slow, slow and are easy prey for an OC who like to throw swing and flat passes to the RBs.

The best OLB play I saw this PS was from Kenny Rowe. He might get cut today---not sure.

The best edge rush by far is from John Abraham, thank goodness. But he should just play RDE in the 4 man rush.

But who rushes from the other side?

Matt Shaughnessy is a better interior rusher. Sam Acho has looked slow---save the one time he was unblocked. Okafor too. No real quickness or burst in his pass rush. At this point I would say Rowe.

Then there are the coverage issues. The technique has been piss poor---the effort suspect (save Arenas who is pesky, but not as gifted physcially)---they are playing what I call a "lazy man's corner." Hold and grab as much as you can---instead of using their feet to establish position.

The best coverage I've seen this PS beyond Patrick Peterson has come from Justin Bethel. His motor is non-stop, he plays good angles and he is physical when he needs to be. Powers and Cason have been brutal. Just brutal.

The safety play has been pretty good, thanks to Tyrann Mathieu and Tony Jefferson. Rashad Johnson has been injured---but played well early in PS. Yeremiah Bell has been solid.

The big question, however, is who is going to cover the very good TEs in the NFC West and other opponents. If the SD game is a harbinger of what's to come the Cardinal defense is in deep trouble. The Chargers' TEs were wide open all game. It reminded me of Bill Davis' defense---assignment confusions, wide open receivers, poor coverage techniques.

My hope is that Bowles hasn't shown what the real defense is, because if he has this PS, the Cardinals have no chance.

The STs thus far have been decent---there's lots of talent to choose from. Hopefully the STs will help dictate field position.

When I look at the Rams, I feel envious. They are stronger up front on both sides of the ball---they signed a prize LT in the off-season---they can run the ball---they have significantly faster WRs---they have a franchise QB---their secondary may be the best in the NFC---and they have very good young talent in the front seven...and they can rush the edge in a flurry.

All this said---I hope that BA was right when he said he will work on team chemistry after the 53 man roster is settled---it will be very interesting to see what happens in one week.

The best hope may be Patrick Peterson---he's burned the Rams before.

Has any player in one game ever scored a TD as a WR, a pick-six TD as a CB and a home run TD as a return man?

Can you imagine that?
 
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BW52

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Mitch you don`t really think that BA is done tinkering with this roster do you? I think many changes are still coming personel wise.Too many decent players will be caught up in numbers games and cut loose by other teams.Very few guys should feel 100% comfortable now.
 

RugbyMuffin

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Like you said.

It was to be expected.

Sent from my intergalactic transmorgapher
 

juza76

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mìitch u were wrong in all your prediction about cuts and roster))) dont worry ,u will get better
 
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Vermont Maverick

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Mitch you don`t really think that BA is done tinkering with this roster do you? I think many changes are still coming personel wise.Too many decent players will be caught up in numbers games and cut loose by other teams.Very few guys should feel 100% comfortable now.

BW- You don't really think there are players out there on the street who will make difference, do you?
 

Duckjake

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Has any player in one game ever scored a TD as a WR, a pick-six TD as a CB and a home run TD as a return man?

Can you imagine that?

Not exactly the same or in one game but in 1959 Bobby Joe Conrad scored 2 TDs rushing, 3TDs receiving, 1 TD on a punt return, threw a TD pass, kicked 6 FGs and 30 extra points! :koolaid:
 

AzStevenCal

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Excellent post. You're right, some messiness is to be expected but this seems to be a little messier than necessary. Watching this preseason it's hard to find the strength of this team. It would be scary to think it's the special teams group especially since they left so much to be desired last season.

I'm not too surprised by the decision on Cooper given that he's a rookie. If he were a seasoned vet Arians might have played it differently but Cooper still has a learning curve and this let's him focus on getting healthy and preparing for next season.

We have a QB whose strength is the long ball and we have an offensive line incapable of giving the QB enough time to throw deep. We lack speed at the wide receiver position and they are paired with perhaps the worst tight end group in the league. Although they're a bit injury prone, we have probably our best group of running backs in a while but we're a passing team by design. And since we're likely to be playing catch-up more often than not, we're going to spend as much time in the air this season as we have the past several years.

I'm not ready to give up on the D just yet. There's simply too much talent there to play as poorly as we've looked this preseason. Watching Dockett and Campbell it almost looks like they've been told not to cross the line of scrimmage. So hopefully they are either confused or holding back for a reason.

Steve
 

BW52

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BW- You don't really think there are players out there on the street who will make difference, do you?

VM I don` know if any difference makers are out there.BA and the Coaches might think so.I know if I had my druthers I would be thinking seriously about seeing if several older veteran players like Dansby,Colledge,Rucker,Dockett have any trade value right now.If you are going to have a rough year you might as well do it with players who have upsides instead of older guys starting to trend down.That`s just my opinion.
 
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Mitch

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mìitch u were wrong in all your prediction about cuts and roster))) dont worry ,u will get better

I certainly was wrong thus far about:

1. TE Quinn. I stil think he's a better blocker than any TE on the roster.
2. WRs Thomas & Hawkins---the two fastest WRs of the bunch from a coach who preaches speed. It proves that i do not know BA as well as I thought I did.

I was right about:

1. Gs Rachal & Kelemete. That wasn't too hard to figure out based on their PS play. The question was what kind of depth it left the team with beyond Watford. My answer was keeping C/G Gibson (not sure if he will make it either).
2. NT Carter---I said he would be gone if they found a replacement.
3. Ss Amaya & Taylor. Neither were good in coverage.
4. LB Walker---if reports are accurate. Didn't have a good PS.

I am more than a little confused right now, Juza, no doubt. Perhaps there will be greater clarity over the weekend.
 

Cardiac

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Mitch is placed on IR, broke his ankles jumping off the BASK bandwagon. The controversial season ending IR designation instead of the part time IR has many posters calling for BASK's head.

When asked why the IR decision was made BA stated he needed to start forming the team chemistry and Mitch simply was no longer on the same page. His obsession over tiny speedy WR's just doesn't mesh with BA's vision of what is needed at the position.
 
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Mitch

Mitch

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Mitch you don`t really think that BA is done tinkering with this roster do you? I think many changes are still coming personel wise.Too many decent players will be caught up in numbers games and cut loose by other teams.Very few guys should feel 100% comfortable now.

You're right, BW. BA&SK are aggressive---but waivers acquisitions are tricky---you have to have all the teams ahead of you pass on the player in order to get the plater or players you want.

The best acquisitions would likely come from trades and the Cardinals do have a couple potential trade chips. So we will see.

The problem too is---it would be unlikely for any new player to play versus the Rams, because it will take time for the player to adapt to the new system, and for the players around him to work him into the chemistry.
 

juza76

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I certainly was wrong thus far about:

1. TE Quinn. I stil think he's a better blocker than any TE on the roster.
2. WRs Thomas & Hawkins---the two fastest WRs of the bunch from a coach who preaches speed. It proves that i do not know BA as well as I thought I did.

I was right about:

1. Gs Rachal & Kelemete. That wasn't too hard to figure out based on their PS play. The question was what kind of depth it left the team with beyond Watford. My answer was keeping C/G Gibson (not sure if he will make it either).
2. NT Carter---I said he would be gone if they found a replacement.
3. Ss Amaya & Taylor. Neither were good in coverage.
4. LB Walker---if reports are accurate. Didn't have a good PS.

I am more than a little confused right now, Juza, no doubt. Perhaps there will be greater clarity over the weekend.
mitch u considered also cutting okeafor..and i told u that urban recently said he did aspect all the draft picks make the roster
 

kerouac9

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So true.

Mitch, jilted again.

My neck hurts.

To be fair, I thought it would be sooner--when Robert Gill got cut. But it's pretty funny for him to be posing like he never liked Chilo Rachal when he posted a thread eight weeks ago crowing about how he was Chicago's most physical lineman and how excited he was to have him around.
 

Chaz

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Thanks Mitch, A cautionary tale to be sure.

Coaches make their money developing game plans for their personnel each week. Hopefully the coaches can maximize what they have because you can't completely remake a team on one off-season.
 

moosehead

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Well, at least Mitch can be thoughtful while posting negative concerns about the team. Snarky one-liners and ultra-predictable predisposition against saying anything positive aren't anything to be proud of, really.
 

AzStevenCal

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Well, at least Mitch can be thoughtful while posting negative concerns about the team. Snarky one-liners and ultra-predictable predisposition against saying anything positive aren't anything to be proud of, really.

I could care less whether a person chooses to be negative or not (and it is a choice) but I don't understand why some try to take others down. Mitch puts his opinions out there and occasionally they change over time. When did that start being a bad thing?

Steve
 
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Mitch

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mitch u considered also cutting okeafor..and i told u that urban recently said he did aspect all the draft picks make the roster

I never EVER considered cutting Okafor. He's a 2013 4th round pick. Way too early to judge him. I think he played pretty well Thursday. I do not think, however, he will be one of BA's 45 on game days just yet. But cutting him now would be ludicrous.
 
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Mitch

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Thanks Mitch, A cautionary tale to be sure.

Coaches make their money developing game plans for their personnel each week. Hopefully the coaches can maximize what they have because you can't completely remake a team on one off-season.

Perfectly said, Chaz.

I think game planning is one of BA's greatest strengths.
 

moosehead

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I could care less whether a person chooses to be negative or not (and it is a choice) but I don't understand why some try to take others down. Mitch puts his opinions out there and occasionally they change over time. When did that start being a bad thing

That's my point. There is a ton of football knowledge on this board and I enjoy differing opinions. The slams, digs and negativity get old though. Opposite opinions when expressed with clarity and in the spirit of respectful debate are what make sites like this interesting. Just my opinion...
 

az jam

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Mitch, good analysis. I would really prefer that Patrick Peterson doesn't play on the offense at all. He is a shut down corner back maybe the best in the game. Leave him there.
 

AzStevenCal

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That's my point. There is a ton of football knowledge on this board and I enjoy differing opinions. The slams, digs and negativity get old though. Opposite opinions when expressed with clarity and in the spirit of respectful debate are what make sites like this interesting. Just my opinion...

Agreed.

Steve
 

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