Miller once again does it again!

Discussion in 'University of Arizona' started by Lefty, Sep 13, 2012.

  1. GatorAZ

    GatorAZ Formerly known as GatorHater

    Posts:
    12,600
    Likes Received:
    3,485
    Joined:
    Oct 17, 2011
    Location:
    The Giant Toaster
    As TJ said it could be his knee which caused him to miss time last year plus his Sr season in HS. I remember his family going to great lengths to keep the specific injury from going public.

    Tbh I don’t remember being that high on Jordan Brown but you got to think one of Zeke or Brown pans out. People can say what they want about Miller but he really gets after it and probably embracing the villain role. It is probably getting to P12 coaches.
     
  2. Russ Smith

    Russ Smith The Original Whizzinator Contributor

    Age:
    53
    Posts:
    55,059
    Likes Received:
    3,727
    Joined:
    May 14, 2002
    CBS has a story up quoting VP of Regulatory Affairs for the NCAA, Stan Wilcox. He doesn't name teams but says 6 teams will be getting notices of allegations from the NCAA over the next few months, 2 of them in July. Based on how it's worded it would seem apparent one of the 6 is Arizona and 1 of the first 2 might be them too.

    he also says
    "Those top coaches that were mentioned in the trials where the information shows what was being said was a violation of NCAA rules, yes. They will be all part of these notices of allegations," Wilcox said.

    The NCAA had held off on investigations, he said, at the request of the government until the trials were concluded.

    "So now that's it over, we're going to be moving forward with a number of Level I cases that will help people realize that, 'Yeah, the enforcement staff was in a position to move forward,'" Wilcox said.

    Clearly one of those is Miller. Doesn't mean he's going to get a show cause as some are speculating but it does mean the NCAA is going to work the way they usually work, here are the allegations prove yourself innocent. The article implies the NCAA does NOT yet have access to info from the FBI that was not presented in the trials. Clear they want it.

    Scheer says the NCAA should get ready to get sued if they do this because they're using "unproven wiretaps."
     
  3. TJ

    TJ Suge White

    Posts:
    25,107
    Likes Received:
    6,271
    Joined:
    Apr 2, 2005
    Location:
    South Bay
    If the NCAA overreaches here, it’s getting sued. I think Arizona would accept a short suspension for Sean Miller without a fight. Anything beyond that and this thing is going to court
     
  4. Lefty

    Lefty Registered

    Posts:
    11,702
    Likes Received:
    101
    Joined:
    Jul 4, 2002
    The UofA did not have any eligibility issues. The NCAA cleared Ayton and Rawlie.
     
  5. Russ Smith

    Russ Smith The Original Whizzinator Contributor

    Age:
    53
    Posts:
    55,059
    Likes Received:
    3,727
    Joined:
    May 14, 2002

    They cleared Derrick Rose and OJ Mayo too. The information the NCAA had at the time they cleared them is not the information that was brought up in court later. The NCAA has very clear rules if we get new information later we reserve the right to rule players ineligible that were ruled eligible earlier.
     
  6. Russ Smith

    Russ Smith The Original Whizzinator Contributor

    Age:
    53
    Posts:
    55,059
    Likes Received:
    3,727
    Joined:
    May 14, 2002

    You have to define overreach though. The NCAA is a member institution, if you don't want to follow their rules you can leave the NCAA. They are not a court of law, they don't have the burden of proof in cases, the one being accused has the burden to prove they're not guilty. The NCAA has no subpoena power so they flip the burden of proof to cover that.

    the story also says there are several other schools the NCAA is lookign into based on other info.
     
  7. GatorAZ

    GatorAZ Formerly known as GatorHater

    Posts:
    12,600
    Likes Received:
    3,485
    Joined:
    Oct 17, 2011
    Location:
    The Giant Toaster
    Did they ever prove someone else took his SAT’s or did he just refuse to cooperate with the investigation? I wonder if his score was too high that tipped them off lol.
     
  8. TJ

    TJ Suge White

    Posts:
    25,107
    Likes Received:
    6,271
    Joined:
    Apr 2, 2005
    Location:
    South Bay
    So Arizona should just bend over and take whatever the NCAA gives them? They're not held hostage by the NCAA. And if what you say is true, then UCLA should be thoroughly investigated and sanctioned simply for Alford having a conversation with Dawkins.

    If Miller is able to prove compliance and that Book went rogue, there's no reason that the NCAA should levy substantial penalties against Arizona. The beauty of having this go through the courts and a thorough investigation is that most of the proof is already presented.

    The FBI and judges labeling Arizona as a "victim" carries weight here. The NCAA has enough motivation to act emotionally and overreach here based on how embarrassed they are, but the schools are pretty pissed by the negative publicity and will fight anything overly punitive
     
    Last edited: Jun 12, 2019
  9. Russ Smith

    Russ Smith The Original Whizzinator Contributor

    Age:
    53
    Posts:
    55,059
    Likes Received:
    3,727
    Joined:
    May 14, 2002
    The Rose case was fascinating. The ETS initially ruled he had issues with his test because he didn't take it locally, like Mayo he went somewhere else, it turned out lots of high profile athletes had done it and ETS got suspicious. They couldn't prove anything so ETS cleared Rose and the NCAA did too and notified Memphis. Then a few months later someone tipped off the NCAA that someone had hacked the grades at Simeon HS and changed the grades for Rose and other athletes to allow them to be NCAA eligible, and then changed them back. The tipster also told them Rose had not taken his test, a teammate had. The NCAA then sent Memphis and Rose letters of inquiry that required signatures(certified). His mom signed for the one at home, Memphis signed for the one that went to them. Memphis played him in the NCAA tourney of course got all the way to the final. Then later Memphis claimed they never got the letter and his mom claimed the same thing, even though both had signed for it. The letter had said if they didn't respond by a certain date he was ineligible, they didn't so he was. Then Rose refused to cooperate to try and clear himself, told the NCAA to talk to Calipari, and the NCAA went as far as telling one of his HS teammates if you don't tell us what happened we will rule you ineligible. To me THAT is overreach, but with Rose I don't think it was it was very clear he wasn't academically eligible and that people had helped him cheat to get into Memphis.

    In the Arizona case the assumption is they're talking about Ayton and or Alkins. The story says the NCAA can't use the allegations against Zion because they're hearsay they weren't entered as evidence they were just said by someone in court with nothing to support it. The Ayton stuff is entered as evidence, it's literally on wiretaps. So the NCAA won't consider it hearsay they will consider it an allegation Arizona has to defend. At this point I have no idea what happened before and what will happen now but based on the wording in the story my guess is the 2 schools that will get allegations by early July are Arizona and Louisville. Kansas would be my 3rd choice only because the NCAA said we can't use the Zion allegations.

    Obviously Arizona is going to appeal not accept so they won't go on probation in July, they will get a hearing etc and that's where the NCAA normally bogs down.
     
  10. Russ Smith

    Russ Smith The Original Whizzinator Contributor

    Age:
    53
    Posts:
    55,059
    Likes Received:
    3,727
    Joined:
    May 14, 2002

    No they will appeal it and get a hearing Arizona is not going to accept the penalties that are given to them initially. And yes I think if the NCAA decides that anybody who talked to Dawkins committed a violation they should cite them all. They won't because most of those conversations aren't on tape and they clearly said yesterday hearsay even that came up in court is not something they can use unless they get actual support of it(from the government).

    The victim thing is part of the legal case it has nothing to do with NCAA rules. You're literally saying Arizona will get off because they were victimized when one of their 3 coaches who violated NCAA rules, got caught violating NCAA rules and it cost them a recruiting class. For the legal case that worked, for the NCAA case they don't care if Arizona lost recruits due to Book's actions, they care did Book violate NCAA rules(it appears so) and should Miller have been aware what was going on.

    I don't think Miller is going to get a show cause(mentioned in the story as possible punishment) the only way he could is if the NCAA says Ayton and or Alkins were ineligible, they were because you were paying them as stated by Book Richardson. If the NCAA does that, then yes he'll get a show cause, my guess is the NCAA won't think they have enough proof to hammer him that hard. If they go down they were ineligible and you were involved angle then Miller, not Arizona, will sue them just like Tark did ages ago.
     
  11. Russ Smith

    Russ Smith The Original Whizzinator Contributor

    Age:
    53
    Posts:
    55,059
    Likes Received:
    3,727
    Joined:
    May 14, 2002
    I looked at the Bear Down site right now over and over people are saying well we don't have any eligibility issues so we're good right. Then someone posted a list of schools who did, USC and Melton, etc. Either I'm completely missing the point of that article or what they were saying is kids who MIGHT not have been eligible but were played. Melton is the exact opposite, as is Hernandez at Miami, preston at KU etc. Kansas suspended DeSousa as soon as his name came up the question is would they be liable for playing him before his name came up, that's not clear. But putting out a list of kids that other schools suspended is the exact opposite of what I think the NCAA means. They mean kids like Ayton and Alkins who were played AFTER it was made known they might have eligibility concerns. one guy actually said he thought Bowen was going to get Louisville in trouble over eligibilty, why, he never played for them as soon as the case broke they ruled him not eligible. They broke rules recruiting him yes but once that became clear they suspended him.

    I haven't read that board in awhile but my take is whoever is telling people we have no issues with that is missing the boat. That was my point all along by playing kids that might not be eligible Arizona was taking a risk that no other school was taking.

    FYI, CBS amended the original story and removed the part about only schools with eligibility concerns would be impacted, it says right at the bottom of the story now that was in the original story but has been removed.
     
    Last edited: Jun 13, 2019
  12. TJ

    TJ Suge White

    Posts:
    25,107
    Likes Received:
    6,271
    Joined:
    Apr 2, 2005
    Location:
    South Bay
    Terry just decommitted to play G-League or in the pros. Likely Wasnt going to qualify academically, per Gershon.
     
  13. Lefty

    Lefty Registered

    Posts:
    11,702
    Likes Received:
    101
    Joined:
    Jul 4, 2002
    Scheer is saying that Miller has already has begun to get someone to replace Terry. He even mentioned it could be a player who re-classifies. Jason said Miller will not wait long to offer.
     
  14. 1Sun

    1Sun Banned

    Posts:
    4,029
    Likes Received:
    476
    Joined:
    Sep 8, 2018
    Location:
    Chandler, AZ
    So someone else is still leaving?
     
  15. GatorAZ

    GatorAZ Formerly known as GatorHater

    Posts:
    12,600
    Likes Received:
    3,485
    Joined:
    Oct 17, 2011
    Location:
    The Giant Toaster
    We got Ferg’d!
     

Share This Page