Lack of Confidence

Harry

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One of the things Vince Lombardi was fond of saying was he could give you the Pack’s playbook and you still couldn’t stop them. Their execution was good enough their plays would still work. Post game when Murray was asked about the now notorious fourth and one he said, without the profanity, the Cards were out-schemed. What he meant was they were apparently going to sellout to stop the run.

First if they just run on third and one it would have been easier. Second how could the Cards not anticipate they’d be facing an alignment that was apparently targeted to stop a run; duh! Third the Chargers had already been pulling up their secondary and mostly Connor had just broken through. I’m confident with two tries he’d have gotten a yard against this defense. Simply, just run the play as called and assume your team is better than theirs. If you’re not you should be punting in the first place. The fact was they weren’t just selling out against the run and they motioned enough to convince Murray they were taking away his McBride outlet. They weren’t. Yet another reason to run the play as called. A little film study would likely have shown this feint in previous Charger short yardage defense.

In the end most of the blame still lies with Kingsbury’s ego. He should have kicked. He should have Murray better prepared after all this time. He should not still be the coach. If the Cards truly have a shot at Payton they should open the position and start negotiations immediately. Sadly, they will most likely never start negotiations.
 

NWMike

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At this point it seems pretty clear the only way Kliff survives next year is financial (e.g. Michael doesn't want to buy him out or even worse can't afford to). I think what happens or doesn't happen with Kliff will say loads about what we can expect the next few years. Either Michael wants to win and is willing to take a financial hit to correct a massive mistake he made last year (I really do hope there is some sort of out clause) or he's stubborn/strapped for cash and we are going down the road of perennial loser.

For my part if you are going to take a run at Payton than Keim has to be the first to go. I just don't think you are going to attract a high caliber coach with a suspect GM. Coaches want to be put in position to succeed and its pretty clear working with Keim is hit or miss. He had a couple good years with BA and I guess part of one with KK. If you keep Keim and get rid of Kliff you are stuck with either a coaching retread desperate to get back in the game or a no name prospect like KK. We'll know for sure in 5 weeks.
 

Timm Rosenbach

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At this point it seems pretty clear the only way Kliff survives next year is financial (e.g. Michael doesn't want to buy him out or even worse can't afford to). I think what happens or doesn't happen with Kliff will say loads about what we can expect the next few years. Either Michael wants to win and is willing to take a financial hit to correct a massive mistake he made last year (I really do hope there is some sort of out clause) or he's stubborn/strapped for cash and we are going down the road of perennial loser.

For my part if you are going to take a run at Payton than Keim has to be the first to go. I just don't think you are going to attract a high caliber coach with a suspect GM. Coaches want to be put in position to succeed and its pretty clear working with Keim is hit or miss. He had a couple good years with BA and I guess part of one with KK. If you keep Keim and get rid of Kliff you are stuck with either a coaching retread desperate to get back in the game or a no name prospect like KK. We'll know for sure in 5 weeks.

I think that you may be right and Bidwill is looking at the financial statements for the Cardinals for the past 6 years and sees the financial fiasco caused by all of these horrible decisions. I don’t think its beyond the realm of possibility that Bidwill can’t afford to fire Kliff and Keim.
 

wit3card

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I think that you may be right and Bidwill is looking at the financial statements for the Cardinals for the past 6 years and sees the financial fiasco caused by all of these horrible decisions. I don’t think its beyond the realm of possibility that Bidwill can’t afford to fire Kliff and Keim.
If so he is a bad company man and should never hire a GM again without input from elsewere...
 

Timm Rosenbach

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If so he is a bad company man and should never hire a GM again without input from elsewere...

He’s a lawyer, not an entrepreneur. I agree that he should get input when hiring the next GM. And he should not be so hands-on.
 

Totally_Red

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If Payton is hired, he'll demand roster control and get it. Keim either relinquishes that control or is gone. He may be gone anyway, depending on how Payton feels about him, but I have no doubt Michael would rather keep him.
 

Mainstreet

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If Payton is hired, he'll demand roster control and get it. Keim either relinquishes that control or is gone. He may be gone anyway, depending on how Payton feels about him, but I have no doubt Michael would rather keep him.

I'm all in on the first two sentences.
 

sdscard4

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Kliff and Keims salary really don't mean jack...Cards are making serious dough
I don't believe for one bit money has anything to do weather he fires them or not. I believe they're all buddies...that's the hold up...we Get embarrassed again and Payton makes it known he wants AZ ....they will be fired
 

Arz101

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Kliff and Keims salary really don't mean jack...Cards are making serious dough
I don't believe for one bit money has anything to do weather he fires them or not. I believe they're all buddies...that's the hold up...we Get embarrassed again and Payton makes it known he wants AZ ....they will be fired
They don't have the money after big contracts..with a recession looming there is zero percent chance they will make a change.

Keim already watching tapes for the shortest receivers and tweener off ball line backers for drafting in round 1. Kliff is off this week to some island where he will be conducting zoom meetings with the rest of the team. Bidwill is selling his paradise valley home for something bigger.
 

DaHilg

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Kliff and Keims salary really don't mean jack...Cards are making serious dough
I don't believe for one bit money has anything to do weather he fires them or not. I believe they're all buddies...that's the hold up...we Get embarrassed again and Payton makes it known he wants AZ ....they will be fired
It’s for sure the holdup, or they’d be gone. I’ve never seen a coach this incompetent - not even Adam Gase. There is not a phase in the game or even in the locker room that Kliffy excels at period.
 
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AZ Native

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Kliff and Keims salary really don't mean jack...Cards are making serious dough
I don't believe for one bit money has anything to do weather he fires them or not. I believe they're all buddies...that's the hold up...we Get embarrassed again and Payton makes it known he wants AZ ....they will be fired
I don't care about the money either because I'm not paying it.
 

Russ Smith

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One of the things Vince Lombardi was fond of saying was he could give you the Pack’s playbook and you still couldn’t stop them. Their execution was good enough their plays would still work. Post game when Murray was asked about the now notorious fourth and one he said, without the profanity, the Cards were out-schemed. What he meant was they were apparently going to sellout to stop the run.

First if they just run on third and one it would have been easier. Second how could the Cards not anticipate they’d be facing an alignment that was apparently targeted to stop a run; duh! Third the Chargers had already been pulling up their secondary and mostly Connor had just broken through. I’m confident with two tries he’d have gotten a yard against this defense. Simply, just run the play as called and assume your team is better than theirs. If you’re not you should be punting in the first place. The fact was they weren’t just selling out against the run and they motioned enough to convince Murray they were taking away his McBride outlet. They weren’t. Yet another reason to run the play as called. A little film study would likely have shown this feint in previous Charger short yardage defense.

In the end most of the blame still lies with Kingsbury’s ego. He should have kicked. He should have Murray better prepared after all this time. He should not still be the coach. If the Cards truly have a shot at Payton they should open the position and start negotiations immediately. Sadly, they will most likely never start negotiations.

With all due respect Harry if they handed that ball off to Conner he's hit 2 yards in the backfield by Van Noy. He might have been able to break the tackle he often does but Kyler absolutely made the right read there.

again that play is a easy first down to Maxx if Maxx didn't fall down. Maxx came off the LOS and he was the one that was supposed to chip or block Van Noy but he missed. I assume because of that he realized I better get open because he's NOT going to hand it off but in doing so he lost his balance, went down and by the time he was up, Kyler was completely off that side and trying to get Hop to take off. Hollywood isn't even running a play he's blocking because he knows the other option on the RPO is the screen to McBride.

That's why Kyler said schematically we were hosed.
 

Russ Smith

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I think that you may be right and Bidwill is looking at the financial statements for the Cardinals for the past 6 years and sees the financial fiasco caused by all of these horrible decisions. I don’t think its beyond the realm of possibility that Bidwill can’t afford to fire Kliff and Keim.

Or hopefully he sees he can't afford NOT to fire them
 

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He's not going to eat all of the contracts. KK and SK will get hired by someone else, which will offset most of their salary. I believe that is the standard language in contracts these days.

I thought it was different if Kliff went the college route bu @BritCard set me straight.

That's how he was able to fire Wilks so quickly.
 
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Russ Smith

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He's not going to eat all of the contracts. KK and SK will get hired by someone else, which will offset most of their salary. I believe that is standard language in contracts these days.

Kliff will I am not sure Keim will.

I guess my point is if he REALLY looks at the money he'll see all the money he's wasting by keeping those guys employed.
 

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Kliff will I am not sure Keim will.

I guess my point is if he REALLY looks at the money he'll see all the money he's wasting by keeping those guys employed.
Good point. I wouldn't hire Keim either but he is the 2 time-winning Executive of the Year, if memory is correct. MAYBE someone will hire him for something.
 

BritCard

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If Payton is hired, he'll demand roster control and get it. Keim either relinquishes that control or is gone. He may be gone anyway, depending on how Payton feels about him, but I have no doubt Michael would rather keep him.

If Kliff goes then Keim goes.

Payton will demand full roster control because he had it at the Saints and I would put money on Jeff Ireland coming in and running everything else. He's a very, very good college scouting director.
 

BritCard

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Nobody is hiring Keim or Kliff in any sort of important roles where there would be a significant offset.

This is silly. Matt Rhule just signed an 8 year, $74m contract.

Matt Rhule. Who was 11-27 in the NFL.

Kliff would get a college HC job in the blink of an eye. He would be at the top of most programmes list of candidates.

Keim no, but he'd get an Assistant GM job easy enough. Plus his money is nothing anyway.
 

DaHilg

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This is silly. Matt Rhule just signed an 8 year, $74m contract.

Matt Rhule. Who was 11-27 in the NFL.

Kliff would get a college HC job in the blink of an eye. He would be at the top of most programmes list of candidates.

Keim no, but he'd get an Assistant GM job easy enough. Plus his money is nothing anyway.
Kliffy can’t hold Rhule’s jock… he turned a Temple team to 11-1 and then turned around that disgusting (sexual allegations) Baylor program to a contender before he went to Carolina. Hard to to fault him on Carolina as never has a QB there and CMAC played maybe 50% of the games.
 

Krangodnzr

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This is silly. Matt Rhule just signed an 8 year, $74m contract.

Matt Rhule. Who was 11-27 in the NFL.

Kliff would get a college HC job in the blink of an eye. He would be at the top of most programmes list of candidates.

Keim no, but he'd get an Assistant GM job easy enough. Plus his money is nothing anyway.
I don't think he would. He specifically has made comments about how he doesn't like recruiting. If I'm a college AD, Kliff is on my "No way in hell I hire him" list. He's a candidate for TV or an NFL OC job.
 

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