Kyler Murray Debate Thread

[AZCB34]

Disappointment maybe. No one who gets a second contract—especially with the same team—is a bust.

I dunno. Teams make dumb decisions all the time.

 

[kerouac9]

I dunno. Teams make dumb decisions all the time.

Can you provide recent examples of other clear busts who were given second contracts by the team that drafted them?

I just refuse to believe that Jamarcus Russell and Kyler Murray belong in the same basket.

 

[krazy2k]

In November, KM will be playing the new game - Failure to Answer the Call of Duty.

 

[AZCB34]

Can you provide recent examples of other clear busts who were given second contracts by the team that drafted them?

I just refuse to believe that Jamarcus Russell and Kyler Murray belong in the same basket.

Do you think there are varying degrees of being a bust?

I don’t think Kyler belongs in the same conversation as Russell but based on where he was drafted and the amount of money he has been paid I think it is not unreasonable to suggest Kyler falls on the bust spectrum somewhere

 

[kerouac9]

Do you think there are varying degrees of being a bust?

I don’t think Kyler belongs in the same conversation as Russell but based on where he was drafted and the amount of money he has been paid I think it is not unreasonable to suggest Kyler falls on the bust spectrum somewhere

No, you are either a bust or you’re not. Buster Davis, Cody Brown, Jamarcus Russell are all busts.

Kyler Murray, Zaven Collins, and Isiah Simmons are disappointments but not busts.

 

[Cheesebeef]

No, you are either a bust or you’re not. Buster Davis, Cody Brown, Jamarcus Russell are all busts.

Kyler Murray, Zaven Collins, and Isiah Simmons are disappointments but not busts.

Simmons is a total bust. Couldn’t stay on the field on bad defenses and didn’t make a second contract.

Murray’s not a bust, but he’s a massive disappointment. You draft a QB #1 in the draft and you hope he can be a guy who gets you at least to the first round of the playoffs more often than not.

 

[kerouac9]

Simmons is a total bust. Couldn’t stay on the field on bad defenses and didn’t make a second contract.

Murray’s not a bust, but he’s a massive disappointment. You draft a QB #1 in the draft and you hope he can be a guy who gets you at least to the first round of the playoffs more often than not.

Simmons got a second contract with the Giants. He’s definitely on the high end of the disappointment spectrum but I have no problem with players looking at Monti’s 2023 plan and opting out.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Simmons got a second contract with the Giants. He’s definitely on the high end of the disappointment spectrum but I have no problem with players looking at Monti’s 2023 plan and opting out.

Wait… didn’t you say getting a second contract from your own team was the sign they weren’t a bust?

And it’s not like the contract he got with the Giants was that big. It was near league minimum. And he never even got the team option picked up on his first contract with us.

For the 8th pick in the draft, that’s a bust. Not the biggest bust of all time, but comparing every bust to Jamarcus Russell is just a totally specious argument. Being a bust isn’t binary unless you just want to either win N internet argument or are loathe to admit you’re wrong. Just like there’s a spectrum of disappointing players, the same is true for busts.

 

[kerouac9]

Wait… didn’t you say getting a second contract from your own team was the sign they weren’t a bust?

And it’s not like the contract he got with the Giants was that big. It was near league minimum. And he never even got the team option picked up on his first contract with us.

That’s a bust.

He’s still in the NFL. Again, there are guys neigh unplayable from the jump. Jamarcus Russell. Treylon Burks (selected by a front office where Monti was second in command after trading AJ Brown) has 53 receptions in three seasons. That’s a bust.

If Simmons was a third-round pick no one would be mad. Even if he doesn’t make the final 53 in Green Bay this season he won’t be a bust.

Getting re-signed by your own team is a sufficient but not necessary condition to stay off the bust list. Kevin Minter started 17 games in five seasons after leaving the Cards. He’s definitely was not a bust, though I’m loathe to admit it because he was so ordinary.

 

[oaken1]

He’s still in the NFL. Again, there are guys neigh unplayable from the jump. Jamarcus Russell. Treylon Burks (selected by a front office where Monti was second in command after trading AJ Brown) has 53 receptions in three seasons. That’s a bust.

If Simmons was a third-round pick no one would be mad. Even if he doesn’t make the final 53 in Green Bay this season he won’t be a bust.

Getting re-signed by your own team is a sufficient but not necessary condition to stay off the bust list. Kevin Minter started 17 games in five seasons after leaving the Cards. He’s definitely was not a bust, though I’m loathe to admit it because he was so ordinary.

Remember when Ryan Leaf was the poster boy for Bust University??
Hardly nobody ever brings him up anymore.

 

[daves]

If Simmons was a third-round pick no one would be mad.

Haha, look who's going into the alternate universe to avoid admitting he's wrong now!

 

[GeorgiaCard88]

I’m definitely not in camp Murray but he’s far from a bust. At 45 mil a year you are expected to play at an elite level though - and he has disappointed on that front. He can still make spectacular plays, still win games, still play at a level that we can be a playoff team. He just fails to be consistent and is unable to elevate his team around him from bad-average to average-good.

I’ve actually got some hope that now that our roster is once again more well rounded and filled with talent- Kyler is going to shine because he doesn’t have to elevate the team around him. If he still can’t lead this team to a playoff birth….this roster is positioned to be a nice landing spot for a rookie qb

 

[Cheesebeef]

He’s still in the NFL. Again, there are guys neigh unplayable from the jump. Jamarcus Russell.

I stopped reading here because you chose again to make the completely specious and binary argument, pointing directly to the extreme rather than admit you’re wrong.

Pointless to continue the convo further, especially when I saw you jump into the “If Simmons was a third rounder” multiverse argument you regularly bash others so often for.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Haha, look who's going into the alternate universe to avoid admitting he's wrong now!

Seriously.

 

[SeattleCardinal]

Remember when Ryan Leaf was the poster boy for Bust University??
Hardly nobody ever brings him up anymore.

Well, it has been a quarter of a century.

 

[oaken1]

Well, it has been a quarter of a century.

You say that like it's a long time

 

[AZ Native]

You say that like it's a long time

Well, it was 1/3 of my life.

 

[gimpy]

Was?

 

[oaken1]

Well, it was 1/3 of my life.

It was a lot longer 40 years ago than it is today that's for sure

 

[Redsz]

This is the year. No second chances. If he plays well and we have a winning record then he will be back. Otherwise it's time to cut ties and start again.

 

[kerouac9]

This is the year. No second chances. If he plays well and we have a winning record then he will be back. Otherwise it's time to cut ties and start again.

2026 is definitely his last chance.

 

[BirdGangThing]

2026 is definitely his last chance.

and if not 2026 then definitely 2027

 

[unseenaz]

Haha, look who's going into the alternate universe to avoid admitting he's wrong now!

You either die a hero… or live long enough to see yourself become the villain…

 

[oaken1]

You either die a hero… or live long enough to see yourself become the villain…

Damn... I was kinda hoping after living as a villain I would live long enough to die a hero

 

[kerouac9]

and if not 2026 then definitely 2027

Definitely. History has its eyes on him.