Kyler Murray Debacle Thread

[BritCard]

It's very weird to submit an opinion "defense overperformed/bottom 6 in talent" and then use that to dispute an objective metric.

They are who their record says they are. It's okay early in the season to say this was an under-equipped defense from a talent perspective, because there's no evidence to back that up. At the end of the season you're just disputing facts because they're inconvenient to your point.

The defense over performed their talent level. I thought the board mostly recognised that? The pre season consensus was that it was one of the worst defensive rosters BEFORE we lost Jones and Nichols, and later Gardeck and it ended up mainly mediocre. It played above itself due to scheme and coaching.

 

[Stout]

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Stout w/Kyler:

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[Ronin]

Kyler Murray named MVP sleeper for 2025 after ‘quietly’ having one of his best seasons | Sporting News

After flying under the radar last season, Kyler Murray is gaining MVP buzz ahead of 2025 thanks to improved health, a loaded offense, and rising expectations in Arizona.

www.sportingnews.com

 

[kerouac9]

The defense over performed their talent level. I thought the board mostly recognised that? The pre season consensus was that it was one of the worst defensive rosters BEFORE we lost Jones and Nichols, and later Gardeck and it ended up mainly mediocre. It played above itself due to scheme and coaching.

Go find your posts from last year saying this defense was going to be among the worst in the league in 2024.

It was obvious that they he defense was going to be better than in ‘23.

 

[SECTION 11]

Kyler Murray named MVP sleeper for 2025 after ‘quietly’ having one of his best seasons | Sporting News

After flying under the radar last season, Kyler Murray is gaining MVP buzz ahead of 2025 thanks to improved health, a loaded offense, and rising expectations in Arizona.

www.sportingnews.com

This does not surprise me at all.

 

[kerouac9]

This does not surprise me at all.

Saying Kyler has the best supporting cast of his career this year just isn’t factual

 

[SECTION 11]

Saying Kyler has the best supporting cast of his career this year just isn’t factual

Yeah I don’t know about that. I know words have been typed on the matter.

 

[kerouac9]

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Kyler headlined the second-to-last tier of “honorability” as a guy who is afraid to take a hit and prefers not to test his arm talent.

 

[602 Native]

K1 isn’t a leader.

Also K1

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[football karma]

Saying Kyler has the best supporting cast of his career this year just isn’t factual

judges will accept "the best supporting cast since 2021"

 

[Chopper0080]

K1 isn’t a leader.

Also K1

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My guy. That's like saying a marriage is solid because the honeymoon was great. My work does similar team building retreats. This isn't a new concept. As I said elsewhere, I don't know that this means much, but it is something I like to see.

 

[kerouac9]

My guy. That's like saying a marriage is solid because the honeymoon was great. My work does similar team building retreats. This isn't a new concept. As I said elsewhere, I don't know that this means much, but it is something I like to see.

It's definitely better than not doing it/making the effort/etc. But I don't know if a weekend makes much of a difference vs just grinding through the offseason, day after day, getting it perfect.

 

[602 Native]

Saying Kyler has the best supporting cast of his career this year just isn’t factual

MHJ needs to step up for this to be even close to being accurate.

 

[kerouac9]

MHJ needs to step up for this to be even close to being accurate.

And so do Trey Benson and Michael Wilson, to be honest. If we're just talking skill positions vs 2021:

RB: Conner, Edmonds
WR: Hop, Green, Kirk, Moore
TE: Ertz, Maxx Williams

You can make a lot of upside arguments about the guys we have, but based on what we've seen on the field, I'd only take today's Conner and McBride over what's in that group.

 

[DaHilg]

And so do Trey Benson and Michael Wilson, to be honest. If we're just talking skill positions vs 2021:

RB: Conner, Edmonds
WR: Hop, Green, Kirk, Moore
TE: Ertz, Maxx Williams

You can make a lot of upside arguments about the guys we have, but based on what we've seen on the field, I'd only take today's Conner and McBride over what's in that group.

Ahh I miss Maxx, he was fun to watch when healthy

 

[Russ Smith]

And so do Trey Benson and Michael Wilson, to be honest. If we're just talking skill positions vs 2021:

RB: Conner, Edmonds
WR: Hop, Green, Kirk, Moore
TE: Ertz, Maxx Williams

You can make a lot of upside arguments about the guys we have, but based on what we've seen on the field, I'd only take today's Conner and McBride over what's in that group.

Yep Benson is a huge factor in how good the offense is this year IMO. Deep threat is huge at WR but having a homerun hitter RB taking some of the load off Conner would be huge. Trey has the talent he improved significantly during the year, but he's got to be healthy on the field

 

[DaHilg]

Yep Benson is a huge factor in how good the offense is this year IMO. Deep threat is huge at WR but having a homerun hitter RB taking some of the load off Conner would be huge. Trey has the talent he improved significantly during the year, but he's got to be healthy on the field

Agreed.. and Father Time will catch JC soon, perhaps this year even based on historical running backs falling off

 

[football karma]

And so do Trey Benson and Michael Wilson, to be honest. If we're just talking skill positions vs 2021:

RB: Conner, Edmonds
WR: Hop, Green, Kirk, Moore
TE: Ertz, Maxx Williams

You can make a lot of upside arguments about the guys we have, but based on what we've seen on the field, I'd only take today's Conner and McBride over what's in that group.

Chase Edmonds made a bunch of plays that year. nearly 600 yards rushing at 5.1 per, 42 receptions for 300 yards more.

Assuming similar touches, I would take in an instant for Benson this year

 

[oaken1]

Chase Edmonds made a bunch of plays that year. nearly 600 yards rushing at 5.1 per, 42 receptions for 300 yards more.

Assuming similar touches, I would take in an instant for Benson this year

agree. IMO Benson is the superior player by a large margin.
of course, that still has to prove out during the season

 

[Russ Smith]

Chase Edmonds made a bunch of plays that year. nearly 600 yards rushing at 5.1 per, 42 receptions for 300 yards more.

Assuming similar touches, I would take in an instant for Benson this year

Chase was one of those guys that I never figured out how he fell off the cliff that fast? He was good for us and I was really mad when we let him go but we clearly knew something because he was just never the same guy after us. 3 straight years 4.5 ypc or better with significant carries then only 1 year after and he had like 25 carries that year.

I think he had some injuries but seemed so weird just all of a sudden he wasn't the same guy

 

[oaken1]

Chase was one of those guys that I never figured out how he fell off the cliff that fast? He was good for us and I was really mad when we let him go but we clearly knew something because he was just never the same guy after us. 3 straight years 4.5 ypc or better with significant carries then only 1 year after and he had like 25 carries that year.

I think he had some injuries but seemed so weird just all of a sudden he wasn't the same guy

sometimes the system makes all the difference....and a team will let a guy go if they recognize he is a product of said system and that a better back will net more gains from the system with the same r less investment

 

[Russ Smith]

sometimes the system makes all the difference....and a team will let a guy go if they recognize he is a product of said system and that a better back will net more gains from the system with the same r less investment

Sure but I'm talking the guy who was our breakaway threat was suddenly getting caught from behind routinely. I remember I drafted him in fantasy because I thought he'd eventually win lots of carries with the Dolphins and be productive. First game I watched him play twice he got caught from behind, seemed like he lost not a step but 2 steps overnight or something.

I always liked Chase he had some terrific games for us. But we were clearly right in letting him go when we did.

 

[oaken1]

Sure but I'm talking the guy who was our breakaway threat was suddenly getting caught from behind routinely. I remember I drafted him in fantasy because I thought he'd eventually win lots of carries with the Dolphins and be productive. First game I watched him play twice he got caught from behind, seemed like he lost not a step but 2 steps overnight or something.

I always liked Chase he had some terrific games for us. But we were clearly right in letting him go when we did.

Maybe an undisclosed NFI or something. But he did drop off a cliff

 

[Shane]

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[Shane]

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