Great Article: For All You 40 Time Hype Men

Mr. Boldin

Mel Kiper's Daddy
Joined
Jan 8, 2003
Posts
1,628
Reaction score
259
http://www.signonsandiego.com/sports/20050418-9999-1s18forty.html

But it is another Canadian, Ben Johnson, who is believed to have run 40 yards faster than any human in history. Johnson is best known for injecting copious amounts of steroids and winning the 100 meters at the 1988 Olympics in Seoul in 9.79 seconds, only to have his gold medal and world record stripped after failing a post-race drug test.

Timing officials have since broken down that famed race into 10-meter increments, and Johnson was so preposterously fast that he went through 50 meters in 5.52 seconds and 60 meters in 6.37 – both under the current world records at those distances. He went through 40 yards that day in 4.38 seconds.

He was running in spikes . . . on a warm afternoon perfectly suited for sprinting . . . with a slight tailwind . . . with years of training from arguably track's top coach, Charlie Francis . . . with Carl Lewis and six others of the fastest men on the planet chasing him . . . with 69,000 people roaring at Seoul's Olympic Stadium . . . with hundreds of millions of people watching on TV . . . with the ultimate prize in sports, an Olympic gold medal, at stake.

And, as we learned later, with muscles built with the assistance of the anabolic steroid stanazolol.

Four-point-three-eight seconds.

Then again, maybe Ben Johnson isn't the fastest 40-yard man in the world.

Maybe half the NFL is faster.

Say someone clocks a hand-timed 4.35 in an NFL workout.

The accepted standard to convert a hand-timed event to its automatically timed equivalent is to round up to the nearest tenth of a second – in this case 4.4 – and add .24 seconds. Now you're at 4.64.

Most football 40s don't go on a starter's pistol but on an athlete's motion. The average reaction time among elite sprinters (from the gun to the moment they exert pressure on the starting block's electronic pads) is about .15 seconds; for a football player with little track experience it probably would be closer to .2. Add that in, and you have 4.84.

I had to bring this out with all the talk of Yamon Figures' 4.30 40, Jason Hill and Chris Houston's 4.32, and those expecting Ginn to run sub 4.3.

It isnt real...
 

arthurracoon

The Cardinal Smiles
Joined
Dec 6, 2002
Posts
16,534
Reaction score
0
Location
Nashville
One argument against this is that Johnson had to run 100m, not 40m. Thus, he was probably conserving some energy for the first 50m at least, spreading his energy out over 100m instead of 40m. If he was going to expend all his energy in 40m, he might have been able to run faster than 4.38s.

Someone else on this board also mentioned that in NFL workouts, you can start running whenever you want. Thus, there is no hesitation time between the gun going off (and watch) and moving your legs to start running.
 

abomb

Registered User
Supporting Member
Joined
Oct 3, 2003
Posts
21,836
Reaction score
1
Apples and oranges for the reasons mentioned. The reaction to the starting gun has to add 0.1 at least.
 

Shogun

Never doubt Mitch. EVER.
Joined
Dec 12, 2005
Posts
4,072
Reaction score
1
This article (or those like it) pop up every year, yet still make no difference in the thought process. Ben Johnson does not play football, so I could care less about his time. Leon Hall's time in comparison to other DBs, THAT is what really matters.
 
OP
OP
Mr. Boldin

Mr. Boldin

Mel Kiper's Daddy
Joined
Jan 8, 2003
Posts
1,628
Reaction score
259
One argument against this is that Johnson had to run 100m, not 40m. Thus, he was probably conserving some energy for the first 50m at least, spreading his energy out over 100m instead of 40m. If he was going to expend all his energy in 40m, he might have been able to run faster than 4.38s.

True, he might have been saving some energy, however its only 100 meters, which is a sprint for them. Also he would have broken the 50 (54 yards) and 60 meter (65 yards) world records, you still have to be running extremely fast to break the 50 meter record even if you are conserving some enegry.

Someone else on this board also mentioned that in NFL workouts, you can start running whenever you want. Thus, there is no hesitation time between the gun going off (and watch) and moving your legs to start running.

Yeah you can start running whenever you want, but someone still has to press the stop watch to start the time... Hence the addition of .2 seconds for thumb reaction.
 

arthurracoon

The Cardinal Smiles
Joined
Dec 6, 2002
Posts
16,534
Reaction score
0
Location
Nashville
True, he might have been saving some energy, however its only 100 meters, which is a sprint for them. Also he would have broken the 50 (54 yards) and 60 meter (65 yards) world records, you still have to be running extremely fast to break the 50 meter record even if you are conserving some enegry.

Which makes it even more amazing to think how fast he could have run if he tried to use all of his energy in 40 (is it m or yrds?) - (I actually have no clue what I am saying on this).

Yeah you can start running whenever you want, but someone still has to press the stop watch to start the time... Hence the addition of .2 seconds for thumb reaction.

Unless

A. They use a laser (or something like it) system to measure the time.
or
B. The person pressing the time on the stopwatch tries to anticipate the runner leaving the gate, and thus presses it early, or on time.




Note: FTR, I agree, 40 times are overrated.

Note #2: woo hoo! I used a random acronym!
 
Last edited:

Russ Smith

The Original Whizzinator
Supporting Member
Joined
May 14, 2002
Posts
84,236
Reaction score
32,850
One argument against this is that Johnson had to run 100m, not 40m. Thus, he was probably conserving some energy for the first 50m at least, spreading his energy out over 100m instead of 40m. If he was going to expend all his energy in 40m, he might have been able to run faster than 4.38s.

Someone else on this board also mentioned that in NFL workouts, you can start running whenever you want. Thus, there is no hesitation time between the gun going off (and watch) and moving your legs to start running.


Nope 100meters is an allout sprint. They aren't conserving at all. I've been saying this for years if you take the FASTEST 40 yards out of a race like that it will work out to like 3.8 or 3.9 and that's with the entire 40 yards at full speed since you're taking the fastest chunk out of the 100 yards.

The world record 100 yard dash is 9 flat, they don't run it anymore so I'm guessing it would be more like 8.7 or 8.8 if run now by elite runners. there's just no way from a dead start that someone who's not a world class
sprinter is running a sub 4.3 40.

As long as they're all being compared on a level field it doesn't matter.
 

arthurracoon

The Cardinal Smiles
Joined
Dec 6, 2002
Posts
16,534
Reaction score
0
Location
Nashville
Nope 100meters is an allout sprint. They aren't conserving at all. I've been saying this for years if you take the FASTEST 40 yards out of a race like that it will work out to like 3.8 or 3.9 and that's with the entire 40 yards at full speed since you're taking the fastest chunk out of the 100 yards.

The world record 100 yard dash is 9 flat, they don't run it anymore so I'm guessing it would be more like 8.7 or 8.8 if run now by elite runners. there's just no way from a dead start that someone who's not a world class
sprinter is running a sub 4.3 40.

As long as they're all being compared on a level field it doesn't matter.


wow - impressive

:raccoon:
 

Captain Matt

Registered
Joined
May 9, 2003
Posts
450
Reaction score
94
Location
Washington DC (most of the time)
From your resident Physics geek:

1 meters = 1.0936133 yards

so, Johnson's 100 meter run was really 109.3 yards.... or rather his 40 was 43.74 yards (about Edge's rush average past the 40 yard marker.... LOL).

So if Johnson was running 40 meters in 4.4 seconds, then he was doing 9.94 meters per second and that extra 3.74 yards could have taken only about 0.376 seconds. So you get Johnson, with a gun and laser running the 40 yards in about 4.38-.38=4 seconds flat. That is fast. Extremely fast. No one in the NFL comes close.
 

Heucrazy

Pretty Prince of Parties
Joined
Jan 13, 2005
Posts
7,449
Reaction score
1,303
Location
Reno, NV
Norfolk, Maverick quote, wings.........I'm guessing you're a Naval Aviator. :thumbup:
 

Russ Smith

The Original Whizzinator
Supporting Member
Joined
May 14, 2002
Posts
84,236
Reaction score
32,850
From your resident Physics geek:

1 meters = 1.0936133 yards

so, Johnson's 100 meter run was really 109.3 yards.... or rather his 40 was 43.74 yards (about Edge's rush average past the 40 yard marker.... LOL).

So if Johnson was running 40 meters in 4.4 seconds, then he was doing 9.94 meters per second and that extra 3.74 yards could have taken only about 0.376 seconds. So you get Johnson, with a gun and laser running the 40 yards in about 4.38-.38=4 seconds flat. That is fast. Extremely fast. No one in the NFL comes close.

Except that the original says they timed his 40 yards at 4.38, not 40 meters
so there's no reason to convert the time? Or did I misunderstand that?
 

MadCardDisease

Moderator
Moderator
Supporting Member
Joined
May 13, 2002
Posts
19,824
Reaction score
11,761
Location
Chandler, Az
As long as they're all being compared on a level field it doesn't matter.

Exactly!

If one guy runs a 4.36 and another runs a 4.67 I think it is pretty obvious which one is faster. Who really cares if it isn't a "Real" forty. As long as they are all being compared equally you can get a good idea of who has got speed and who is dragging anchor.
 

Cards Czar

The Bird is the Word
Supporting Member
Joined
May 14, 2002
Posts
3,171
Reaction score
368
Location
Alton, Ill
From your resident Physics geek:

1 meters = 1.0936133 yards

so, Johnson's 100 meter run was really 109.3 yards.... or rather his 40 was 43.74 yards (about Edge's rush average past the 40 yard marker.... LOL).

So if Johnson was running 40 meters in 4.4 seconds, then he was doing 9.94 meters per second and that extra 3.74 yards could have taken only about 0.376 seconds. So you get Johnson, with a gun and laser running the 40 yards in about 4.38-.38=4 seconds flat. That is fast. Extremely fast. No one in the NFL comes close.

OMG the LT is a brown shoe!



Navy Mike (Black shoe)
 

Cbus cardsfan

Back to Back ASFN FFL Champion
Joined
May 14, 2002
Posts
21,149
Reaction score
6,591
100 meters take endurance also. So, you guys are saying that no one in the NFL could have a lead on Ben Johnson at the 40 yard mark? I don't buy that at all. There are guys who are quicker out of the starting line and get to max speed faster. They just can't hold that speed for the whole 100 meters. Otherwise, why not just end that race at 40. I'm sure Johnson was behind quite a few times at the 40 yard mark. I know Carl Lewis was but then his stride and speed would kick in over the last 50. Then you throw in the fact that .1 of asecond is so minute, it's not inconceivable at all that some college/NFL guys could run a faster 40.
 
OP
OP
Mr. Boldin

Mr. Boldin

Mel Kiper's Daddy
Joined
Jan 8, 2003
Posts
1,628
Reaction score
259
100 meters take endurance also. So, you guys are saying that no one in the NFL could have a lead on Ben Johnson at the 40 yard mark? I don't buy that at all. There are guys who are quicker out of the starting line and get to max speed faster. They just can't hold that speed for the whole 100 meters. Otherwise, why not just end that race at 40. I'm sure Johnson was behind quite a few times at the 40 yard mark. I know Carl Lewis was but then his stride and speed would kick in over the last 50. Then you throw in the fact that .1 of asecond is so minute, it's not inconceivable at all that some college/NFL guys could run a faster 40.


Ben Johnson would have also set the 50 meter world record during that race. 50 meters is 54 yards... So Ben Johnson trails a NFL player after 40 yards and 14 yards later sets a world record? You have to consider that Ben Johnson, or any Olympic track athlete, trains 20 times more on his start than an NFL player. I seriously doubt that when ben Johnson explodes from the blocks that any NFL player could have taken a lead on him through 40 yards.
 

Duckjake

LEGACY MEMBER
LEGACY MEMBER
Joined
Jun 10, 2002
Posts
32,190
Reaction score
317
Location
Texas
There are guys who are quicker out of the starting line and get to max speed faster. They just can't hold that speed for the whole 100 meters.

You see guys come from behind in the 100 all the time.

A perfect example of a guy who is a slow starter but then gets faster is JJ Arrington.
 

Captain Matt

Registered
Joined
May 9, 2003
Posts
450
Reaction score
94
Location
Washington DC (most of the time)
Yep Mike.... brown shoes.... P-3s.... But recently (thanks to some stellar navy vaccinations) I had an autoimmune response and developed type 1 diabetes. So, they sent me to NPS in Monterey as an admin transfer to EDO. Shore duty for 8 more and I'm done brother.....
 

Staff online

Forum statistics

Threads
534,875
Posts
5,247,015
Members
6,274
Latest member
G-PA
Top