Father time vs LeBron

[Mainstreet]

man, I think people are really overrating Holiday and what impact he could have here. That Pelicans team, pre-trade demand WASN'T good, despite having a top 5 player in the league, a PF a lot of people like here, an okay coach... and Holiday. now, i'm not saying they weren't good BECAUSE of Holiday (I'll head that projected tripe off at the pass), but that team isn't without talent and I wonder how good he can be... what impact does he really make? Yes, we have a terrible situation at PG, but bringing him and his whopping salary probably caps us up for the next couple years moving forward and I just don't know if he does anything except maybe move the needle ten games.

Holiday is another point guard to consider if the Suns can get him for the right package. Something like Tyler Johnson, Warren and the Bucks pick might be enough with the Suns taking something back.

I don't think Suns fans are locked onto a particular player at this point.

 

[JCSunsfan]

I get that... but there's a cost/benefit to getting him. How much are we giving up... draft picks, players for a guy who hasn't led a team with MUCH better talent anywhere and is going to cost a fortune?

YOu really think he is going to cost that much?

I am a bit nervous about James Jones trying to go a different direction--vets instead of building with youth. So, I don't know right now. It seems if you are going to build with youth you have to wait long enough for your youth to mature before you give up on the process.

 

[BC867]

I am a bit nervous about James Jones trying to go a different direction--vets instead of building with youth.

I don't understand why you want an either/or. Questioning "vets instead of building with youth."

We are overbalanced with youth at this time and need to catchup veterans to balance it out.

 

[SirStefan32]

YOu really think he is going to cost that much?

I am a bit nervous about James Jones trying to go a different direction--vets instead of building with youth. So, I don't know right now. It seems if you are going to build with youth you have to wait long enough for your youth to mature before you give up on the process.

To me, it all depends on what veteran costs how much and which young players end up being traded. In my mind, Booker, Ayton, and probably Bridges are the keepers. Then you get to Warren, JJ, and Oubre, and that's where it gets interesting. If you get Mirotic and Holiday in exchange for Warren and one of the other guys, that's pretty good. If you trade two of those three for crap, then that's a problem. I don't think youth vs. experience thing is an either-or situation.

 

[sunsfan88]

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This actually echoes the feelings of many Lakers fans on social media as well.

I wonder if the off court opportunities he came to Los Angeles for is worth not even being wanted on the team (by the fans and possibly his own teammates as well).

Probably doesn’t care but it’s much different to being the King of Cleveland and beloved there.

 

[GatorAZ]

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There’s a chance this blows up in Magic’s face. Selling off talented players like D’Angelo Russell and Julius Randle then failing to acquire another star. Lebron is micromanaging at an all time high and his young teammates are probably sick of him. The vets are over the hill role players that don’t respect the coach and they’re on pace to miss the playoffs.

Woj has been adamant that Kawhi would prefer the Clippers over the Lakers if he left Toronto and Boston has better assets for AD than the Lakers. Plz let their huge summer be a Butler/Bledsoe combo.

 

[Ronin]

Who is their next coach going to be? And when?

 

[Hoop Head]

Lakers lost to the Grizzlies tonight to fall to 10th place in the West. Lebron is being blamed for ruining the chemistry of the Lakers since he publicly lobbied for the team to trade for Anthony Davis and even after the trade deadline passed he kept it going during All-Star weekend, even though nothing could be done at that point. After the Lakers lost to the Pelicans the other night Lebron called out his teammates about being used to losing and how he's never been accustomed to losing.

Here's a link to that story on Yahoo.

The whole mess in LA may end up keeping them from bringing in another star player this summer. I think they could sign Cousins, or another similarly damaged talent, but I can't see them seriously adding one of the other potential big name free agents like KD, Kyrie, or Kawhi. Jimmy Butler is a possibility, he's clashed with those in Philly already and it's no sure thing he'll resign there, or that they'll want him back. Cousins isn't even a sure thing. He seems content not being the center of attention in Golden State and may look for a home that keeps him out of the spotlight next year, at least a lesser spotlight than would be on him in LA if he joined Lebron.

They will probably need to unload some of their youth to try and salvage their roster. Trading all would be a mistake and set them back too much talent wise. Even if they could get AD, I can't see him and Lebron doing all that much. Davis can't get the Pelicans to the playoffs alone and Lebron can't do the same with the Lakers. They may end up needing to trade away their youth to salvage something but that won't exactly help them very much since that youth can't get Lebron to the playoffs now. Kuzma could probably get a good haul though. They won't be able to add cheap minimum salaried veterans since they can't offer a guaranteed trip to the finals like Lebron did in the East for the last 5-6 years. The Lebron Lakers could end up like the old man Kobe Lakers where they have cap space but no one wants to join that mess.

I hoped the Lakers would be bad this year but this implosion of sorts will be better than anything I could have hoped for if they miss the playoffs and they trade their youth away for pennies on the dollar. They've lost more than I thought they would and starting while and falling apart is better than watching them struggle all year. This is all self-inflicted by Lebron, Rich Paul, and Magic. There's actually a chance the Suns make it to the playoffs before they do, which would be amazing.

 

[Phrazbit]

Lakers biggest problem is an over-estimation of the value of their assets. They seem to think Kuzma, Ball and Ingram are all budding stars, while, IMO, the rest of the league thinks Kuzma is a solid rotation player with a limited ceiling, Ball is a good passer and defender but with huge holes in other areas (and a lot of off the court headache) and Ingram is just another chucker, who provides nothing but low efficient scoring and is a turnstile on the other end.

They could have landed Kawhi for a couple of those guys, but they tried low balling the Spurs, any chance of getting AD went out the window when they clearly tampered and then started the negotiations with laughable low ball offers.

They're not getting Durant. I'd be stunned of Irving was willing to go there. IMO, their best case is getting Klay and Cousins... and I don't really see that team winning a title. I think Klay is good player made to look great because he never has to create his own shot and Cousins is going to combust under pressure.

 

[sunsfan88]

If the Suns decide to fire Kokskov for whatever reason, Luke Walton would be pretty high on my list of coaches to go after (he’s guaranteed to take the fall for them).

Prior to LeBron coming, he was actually developing that roster pretty nicely.

 

[Ronin]

God I hope the Lakers miss the playoffs. It would be oh so sweet.

 

[GatorAZ]

Lakers biggest problem is an over-estimation of the value of their assets. They seem to think Kuzma, Ball and Ingram are all budding stars, while, IMO, the rest of the league thinks Kuzma is a solid rotation player with a limited ceiling, Ball is a good passer and defender but with huge holes in other areas (and a lot of off the court headache) and Ingram is just another chucker, who provides nothing but low efficient scoring and is a turnstile on the other end.

They could have landed Kawhi for a couple of those guys, but they tried low balling the Spurs, any chance of getting AD went out the window when they clearly tampered and then started the negotiations with laughable low ball offers.

They're not getting Durant. I'd be stunned of Irving was willing to go there. IMO, their best case is getting Klay and Cousins... and I don't really see that team winning a title. I think Klay is good player made to look great because he never has to create his own shot and Cousins is going to combust under pressure.

The Lakers didn’t overvalue their assts. They offered damn near the whole team for Davis and would’ve never beat Toronto’s offer for Kawhi.

Also Ingram will still have some value around the league...

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[Mainstreet]

God I hope the Lakers miss the playoffs. It would be oh so sweet.

Yes it would. As long as they don't get lucky in the lottery.

 

[Ronin]

Yes it would. As long as they don't get lucky in the lottery.

:crossesfingers:

 

[JCSunsfan]

God I hope the Lakers miss the playoffs. It would be oh so sweet.

Nah. 8th seed, get blown out in the first round, no chance at Zion. Thats what I want. They miss the playoffs and they will somehow get the #1 pick.

 

[Ronin]

Nah. 8th seed, get blown out in the first round, no chance at Zion. Thats what I want. They miss the playoffs and they will somehow get the #1 pick.

Whatever gets egg on the face of Jeannie Buss, Pelinka and Magic Johnson

 

[Phrazbit]

The Lakers didn’t overvalue their assts. They offered damn near the whole team for Davis and would’ve never beat Toronto’s offer for Kawhi.

Also Ingram will still have some value around the league...

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They poisoned the water with New Orleans by opening the talks with laughable low ball offers.

As for Ingram, sure, young "scorers" on rookie deals have some value, but I don't think he is the anywhere near the budding star the Lakers seem to peg his trade value at.

There is a reason that as he has become more involved in the offense the Lakers have gotten worse and worse. He's a chucker, a dude who can score 30... while freezing out his teammates, doing almost nothing else on the stat sheet and not even pretending to try on defense. Bad outside shooter, bad passer, terrible defender. He is a low efficiency offensive player and offense is supposedly his specialty. The dude sucks.

 

[Ronin]

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[sunsfan88]

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[sunsfan88]

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Even dribbling the ball is too much to ask of The King...

 

[TJ]

Unpopular opinion alert: If I’m Magic Johnson, instead of trading a ton of young talent for the Brow, he should trade LeBron for the Brow and another player.

 

[Hoop Head]

Anyone think the Lakers will entertain the idea of trading Lebron this offseason? If they fail to get AD or any other star then they have to consider it, right? Lebron no longer has a no-trade clause in his contract and also has a 15% trade kicker but the Lakers don't care about salary like other teams. Lebron is locked in for 2 more years at least.

 

[sunsfan88]

Anyone think the Lakers will entertain the idea of trading Lebron this offseason? If they fail to get AD or any other star then they have to consider it, right? Lebron no longer has a no-trade clause in his contract and also has a 15% trade kicker but the Lakers don't care about salary like other teams. Lebron is locked in for 2 more years at least.

No it’s just way too much bad PR. They made their bed, they have to sleep in it.

 

[AzStevenCal]

Unpopular opinion alert: If I’m Magic Johnson, instead of trading a ton of young talent for the Brow, he should trade LeBron for the Brow and another player.

It's not that it's unpopular; it's unfeasible, maybe even unpossible. Even before this recent LA train wreck, I would have to think that Davis has a lot more trade value than Lebron does. But yeah, I think most fans realize the Lakers would be better off with Davis.

 

[Hoop Head]

Unpopular opinion alert: If I’m Magic Johnson, instead of trading a ton of young talent for the Brow, he should trade LeBron for the Brow and another player.

I don't think that's the unpopular opinion at all. With Rich Paul as both of their reps though I can't see it happening. I could see Lebron sulking so much that he would be willing to sit out an entire year than play in New Orleans.

I wonder if Lebron will ask for a trade. I don't know where he would wind up, perhaps Boston? if they fail to land Anthony Davis? You know Ainge would do it, not sure many other GM's would want to risk it.