Edge gives Wells some pointers...

ajcardfan

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While I agree that both men had been successufull in prior opportunities, I just cannot condone the second half of that statement. I am not blaming anyone or trying to come down on you, but I think that many Cards fans have been watching a miserable team for so long that you have come to embrace mediocrity.

Our line was NEVER any good last year. It was never average or remotely close to that. They sucked. Yes it was better in the second half of the season that it was in the beginning. However, being slightly better than horrible doesn't make something good. Not once last year did we run for as many yards as our oppenents gave up on average throughout the season. Everyone here was so pumped when Edge went for 100 against the Rams. Woopdedooo, they gave up and average of 150yds per game.

Actually, I agree with you...

http://www.arizonasportsfans.com/vb/showpost.php?p=1447334&postcount=21

Yes, those were not all great defenses either. But, we still were top half in the NFL over that span for both YPC and in sacks. We were top 10 until the San Diego game. We couldn't do that against even bad defenses for years.


I like Grimm. I think he's better than Loney. I just don't think he's infallible.
 

D-Dogg

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You guys know best after all, Grimm never played , oh he did.
Then Grimm is not accepted in the NFL as a good coach, oh you say he almost got a head coaching job! Well he obviuosly doesn;t know personal as he is playing Wells, wait he played pretty good last year. Do you think that Grimms watched any tape from last year. Oh I knopw everyone on this board is an expert. They watched the films on Wells and now he just plain sucks after one quarter.

GBR
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Wells played well last year at Tackle. He wasn't good at guard.

But the rest of your sentiment is correct. Grimm will get it figured out. There is no reason NOT to try him at guard again...under a different teacher and style he might flourish. It didn't look like it though, so Grimm will try and fix the issue. Last year Ross stunk it up, but played really well before tearing his muscle.

I'm not going to flip out unless we are in week 3 and Wells is getting Matt killed out there. I doubt it would get to that point. Either he'll improve, or someone will take his spot. I don't think Grimm is going to coddle the guy.
 

PJ1

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Wells played well last year at Tackle. He wasn't good at guard.

But the rest of your sentiment is correct. Grimm will get it figured out. There is no reason NOT to try him at guard again...under a different teacher and style he might flourish. It didn't look like it though, so Grimm will try and fix the issue. Last year Ross stunk it up, but played really well before tearing his muscle.

I'm not going to flip out unless we are in week 3 and Wells is getting Matt killed out there. I doubt it would get to that point. Either he'll improve, or someone will take his spot. I don't think Grimm is going to coddle the guy.


I thought Wells was OK at tackle and terrible at guard last year. Hope you are correct and Grimm will address this issue.

As far as Ross I see a difference between him and Wells. Ross has had success at tackle in Pittsburgh. It was a matter of the coaches getting this out of him again and from what I saw it looked like they were on track. As for Wells he has never performed well at the guard position.
 

D-Dogg

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When we worked at Cards camp, I worked in the dorms for the players. My wife (then GF) worked at the practice fields. After she got done working, she went and got dressed for dinner as we were going out that night. She comes over to the dorm and Mauck is there and says something along the lines of "you aren't allowed in here trying to hook up with the players...you need to leave. They are here to practice, not to have a good time with young women." Dunno if he recognized her from the fields or not, but he wasn't joking. He was serious, and rude. I told him who she was and we were going to dinner, and he mumbled something and said Oh. And walked off. Nary an apologetic look, much less an I'm sorry.

He was a gruff ***** of a guy. I didn't like him (obviously) My wife is still offended that he thought she was a groupie.
 

Mulli

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When we worked at Cards camp, I worked in the dorms for the players. My wife (then GF) worked at the practice fields. After she got done working, she went and got dressed for dinner as we were going out that night. She comes over to the dorm and Mauck is there and says something along the lines of "you aren't allowed in here trying to hook up with the players...you need to leave. They are here to practice, not to have a good time with young women." Dunno if he recognized her from the fields or not, but he wasn't joking. He was serious, and rude. I told him who she was and we were going to dinner, and he mumbled something and said Oh. And walked off. Nary an apologetic look, much less an I'm sorry.

He was a gruff ***** of a guy. I didn't like him (obviously)
Boo! He is fat, and his kid sucked.
 

Cbus cardsfan

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I've been saying for two years that Wells stinks and is our most overrated lineman.Matching Buffalo's offer sheet was another genius move by our esteemed GM.
 

BigRedArk

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Wells played well last year at Tackle. He wasn't good at guard.

But the rest of your sentiment is correct. Grimm will get it figured out. There is no reason NOT to try him at guard again...under a different teacher and style he might flourish. It didn't look like it though, so Grimm will try and fix the issue. Last year Ross stunk it up, but played really well before tearing his muscle.

I'm not going to flip out unless we are in week 3 and Wells is getting Matt killed out there. I doubt it would get to that point. Either he'll improve, or someone will take his spot. I don't think Grimm is going to coddle the guy.

How is Grimm gonna figure anything out with the shallow depth we have on our OL now? Yeah LD had obvious flaws but tell me he doesn't look pretty good now at a 1 yr tender (that we could have been able to afford as far as cap room at the time) and Milford Brown at his salary even though he had been demoted IIRC.
He is gonna have to pull some major rabbits out of his hat to develop this raw depth that he is looking at now.
 

TheCardFan

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EVERYONE here knew that Wells stunk at OG. If Grimm is so great, why can't he see what's patently obvious to everyone here? It's been clear for two-plus seasons now.

Ding Ding Ding

Why can't people figure that out? Too much kool aid?
 

TheCardFan

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Everyone here did not think Wells stunk at OG last night. Please speak for yourself and don't let history get in the way of recent performances.


Skkorp...Wells sucked. He was blown up regularly.

Wells has struggles everytime he has been put inside.

And yes...I can admit when I am wrong. I don't think Gandy can play LT but he was not too bad in the first game.

I do think switching Wells to LT and Gandy to LG is the answer with what we have now. Oh yeah..and we should have spent a 5th rounder on Gaither.
 

TheCardFan

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How is Grimm gonna figure anything out with the shallow depth we have on our OL now? Yeah LD had obvious flaws but tell me he doesn't look pretty good now at a 1 yr tender (that we could have been able to afford as far as cap room at the time) and Milford Brown at his salary even though he had been demoted IIRC.
He is gonna have to pull some major rabbits out of his hat to develop this raw depth that he is looking at now.

What he said!
 

4Devil

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First, I have to disagree with the some of what the following post stated:
Originally
Posted by WildBB
Give me a break, we've had no one since Beugel who's really known how to handle an OL the way Grimm does. He'll figure it out.

I don't agree that the offensive line coaching since Joe Bugel has been all that bad, until Dennis Green arrived and hired and fired Bob Wylie all in about one breath.
I don't think Wylie should really even be counted as he didn't coach long enough to have that much of an effect, other than to disagree with Green, which hindsight now shows was more a point for him than against him.

Buddy Ryan hired Dan Neil as OL coach. That one might be debateable.
When Tobin came in he hired Carl Mauck who most people thought got a gum deal in San Diego, as was fired as a scapegoat as much as anything.
George Warhop was hired to replace Mauck in 1998, who left for Buffalo.
Warhop is generally considered at good OL coach. He wasn't the problem here. That could be blamed more on OC problems than OL coaching. In fact it was because Bill Parcells "stole" Warhop to coach in Dallas and was also trying to entice Jerry Sullivan to move too. That's why Mac made his waterloo decision to promote Sullivan to OC to Replace Rich Olson and led to Mac's downfall.
Warhop, (along with Sullivan) now both coach for the 49'ers.

The big OL problem started when Green fired Wylie and promoted Everett Lindsay to OL coach. That's when the shift really started to blow. Between Green's ignorant personnel handling and that, yeah, things hit an all time low.

But this franchise has always generally had some decent OL coaches. Historically the Cards have "always" historically been known for big bruising OLinemen, and was geared for the old NFC East, a division known for power/smash mouth ball control football. The move to the NFC west changed a lot of that, a very different general style of play, more wide open aggressive offences, etc.

I do agree, I think Grimm will get the job done, the question of the day is .....how long will it take?

Also, secondly didn't Grimm state that what he is prefers is smaller more mobile guards and bigger tackes. I don't know that I would personally agree with that theory, but I'll give him his due and see what shakes out, "doing it his way" so to speak. I could see where Wells would fit that mould, but as I've maintained for a long time, Wells does have trouble in power struggles one on one. If he's got a good big road grader beside him, then that can help cover some of that. Right now, that's another area that seems lacking, and one of the reasons I think the Cards should maybe have made a little more effort to keep Big.
I can't blame them for letting him walk for what Dallas paid though.

For me it will be interesting to see how this scenario does play out. Will Grimm and Whis try to mould the players to fit "the system" or modify the system to fit the available talent?
I think they will get it done, but it may take awhile.
 
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crisper57

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Wells was not good. He was blown up and rarely did I see him block anyone without assistance. I hope he improves.
 

seesred

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We had a very solid O-line in 1998. The big mistake we made then was not the coach IMO, it was our stupiity for not resigning Lomas Brown who was the leader of that group. We have improved since than as we have more term deals done during contract years to keep our better players.

As for Wells last year at Tackle he was our best lineman and a free agent. He was resigned. I'm not going to be concerned during the next two pre season games. However if by game four he has not improved or moved back to his comfort zone I'll get on the Wells sucks(I hate that word it is so over used), bandwagon. But until then in Grimm and Whiz I trust.

BY the way I'll be very surprised if we don't watch all the line cuts between now and opening day. You never know what you can get or trade for if needed.

GBR
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4Devil

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We had a very solid O-line in 1998. The big mistake we made then was not the coach IMO, it was our stupiity for not resigning Lomas Brown who was the leader of that group. We have improved since than as we have more term deals done during contract years to keep our better players.

As for Wells last year at Tackle he was our best lineman and a free agent. He was resigned. I'm not going to be concerned during the next two pre season games. However if by game four he has not improved or moved back to his comfort zone I'll get on the Wells sucks(I hate that word it is so over used), bandwagon. But until then in Grimm and Whiz I trust.

BY the way I'll be very surprised if we don't watch all the line cuts between now and opening day. You never know what you can get or trade for if needed.

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While I argree with most of what you say, I don't think I would agree that the failure to resign Lomas Brown was the killer mistake of 1999.
Browns best days were behind him, he was looking for that last fat paycheck, and combined with the situation created with the Jake extension, had joined what had become an epidemic:
"where's mine, now".

The combination of limited money, the Jake deal, resulting is some heavy free agent losses. Jamir Miller took a pay CUT to go to Cleveland, he was so pissed over the whole deal.
Then combine in the injuries that year, and well.......history speaks for itself.

Lomas was a loss, but not realistically all that much of one, L.J. stepped in and replaced him decently, IMO.
 
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40yearfan

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4Devil, you certainly seem to have a lot of knowledge about this team. Thanks for your input.:thumbup:
 

lobo

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Yeah LD had obvious flaws but tell me he doesn't look pretty good now at a 1 yr tender



You asked for it....you got it. LD does not look pretty good now at a 1 yr. tender. I wouldn't pay for him for one hour. Have a nice day.
 

ajcardfan

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Yeah LD had obvious flaws but tell me he doesn't look pretty good now at a 1 yr tender



You asked for it....you got it. LD does not look pretty good now at a 1 yr. tender. I wouldn't pay for him for one hour. Have a nice day.

He's getting a lot of praise in his early reviews from Dallas. I guess we'll always have the "Well, he never would've been that good here" excuse to fall back on if he keeps it up during the season.
 

dreamcastrocks

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He's getting a lot of praise in his early reviews from Dallas. I guess we'll always have the "Well, he never would've been that good here" excuse to fall back on if he keeps it up during the season.

Or he could have just been moved to G instead. A right side of Davis and Levi could have been great for years.
 

BACH

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Funny how Shipp had no problems running left...when Wells was still in there.

Wells rarely struggles in run blocking. It's the one-on-one blocks in pass-blocking that he struggles with.

Maybe his too high in his kicks? That my guess anyway...

I BTW don't see the huge problem with Wells. When he and Johnson starts to gel more, Johnson sliding over will compensate a lot for Wells' struggles in pass-blocking.
 
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