Cardinals to get long look at Josh Jones, Josh Miles in preseason action

Zeem_Freeze

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Kugler said that Jones is a future starter at tackle for the Cardinals and could start this year, although Humphries and Beachum are locked in there.

“If your third tackle is capable of starting, you’ve got a good tackle,” he said.


wow! great for the birds. Kugler has always been one of my favorite coaches on this staff. Oline seems to always overperform with Kugs
 

Krangodnzr

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Kugler said that Jones is a future starter at tackle for the Cardinals and could start this year, although Humphries and Beachum are locked in there.

“If your third tackle is capable of starting, you’ve got a good tackle,” he said.


wow! great for the birds. Kugler has always been one of my favorite coaches on this staff. Oline seems to always overperform with Kugs
Josh Jones was much better at tackle than guard.
 

LA Redbird

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I remember a few years ago when we signed Kugler and I (and many here) thought he was the biggest signing that season (in terms of coach signing). I feel the OL kind of fell apart a bit last year, but I don't know how much was attributable to coaching issues over Covid and injuries. Plus, the run game has been solid. Hope our depth and experience reaps rewards this year.
 

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I remember a few years ago when we signed Kugler and I (and many here) thought he was the biggest signing that season (in terms of coach signing). I feel the OL kind of fell apart a bit last year, but I don't know how much was attributable to coaching issues over Covid and injuries. Plus, the run game has been solid. Hope our depth and experience reaps rewards this year.

14 players took 0-line snaps last season.
 

Krangodnzr

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I like Beachum as a solid value contact player but I struggle to be sold on Jones as a future starting tackle if he can't beat out Beachum.
I think Beachum has been one of the better Arizona Cardinals right tackles. I can understand going with Beachum over Jones if the competition is close. You'd also have to consider who would be the better swing tackle at this point.
 

cardpa

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I like Beachum as a solid value contact player but I struggle to be sold on Jones as a future starting tackle if he can't beat out Beachum.
I tend to agree, if a player who Keim had as a 1st rounder can't beat out a journeyman 7th rounder then I can't put much faith in him being our future RT.
 

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I like Beachum as a solid value contact player but I struggle to be sold on Jones as a future starting tackle if he can't beat out Beachum.
Exactly. Tough to get excited about a 3rd year player who still can't beat out a 33-year-old who was let go by Jax and the Jets.

No offense to Beachum, who seems like a solid all around dude.
 

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I tend to agree, if a player who Keim had as a 1st rounder can't beat out a journeyman 7th rounder then I can't put much faith in him being our future RT.

The 7th rd journeyman has been in the league since 2012 and has 130 starts.

He's a solid pro, and let's agree that the scouts blew their evaluation of this guy coming out of college.
 

Chopper0080

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The 7th rd journeyman has been in the league since 2012 and has 130 starts.

He's a solid pro, and let's agree that the scouts blew their evaluation of this guy coming out of college.
And to be fair, Jones might be a great backup OT for the next 4 or 5 years for the Cardinals which is valuable. I am just hesitant to believe he will ever be anything more than that because if he was, he would be starting IMO.
 

Krangodnzr

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And to be fair, Jones might be a great backup OT for the next 4 or 5 years for the Cardinals which is valuable. I am just hesitant to believe he will ever be anything more than that because if he was, he would be starting IMO.
I think the Cardinals believe that Beachum is a really good player. Fitzgerald talked him up quite a bit if you remember.

So I doubt they start Jones over a guy that they think highly of.
 

Chopper0080

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I think the Cardinals believe that Beachum is a really good player. Fitzgerald talked him up quite a bit if you remember.

So I doubt they start Jones over a guy that they think highly of.
If you believe the Cardinals would keep a 24 year old on the bench if he was better than 32 year old Beachum...I guess we can agree to disagree.

And it terms of what the Cardinals think about Beachum. I am sure they love his consistency and reliability. That said, his actual ability is very limited.
 

Krangodnzr

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If you believe the Cardinals would keep a 24 year old on the bench if he was better than 32 year old Beachum...I guess we can agree to disagree.
I don't believe he is better right now, but by week 15 of this season he might be.
And it terms of what the Cardinals think about Beachum. I am sure they love his consistency and reliability. That said, his actual ability is very limited.
I disagree that Beachum is limited. I can't find the Pass Block Win Rate for him in 2021, but in 2020 his rate was fairly good. He's a solid player and I would understand why the Cardinals wouldn't move on from him unless Jones was thrust into the starting RT role and ran away with it.
 
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Zeem_Freeze

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If you believe the Cardinals would keep a 24 year old on the bench if he was better than 32 year old Beachum...I guess we can agree to disagree.

And it terms of what the Cardinals think about Beachum. I am sure they love his consistency and reliability. That said, his actual ability is very limited.
32 isnt 36.... and Beachum is a smart player.. probably few mental mistakes
 

Chopper0080

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32 isnt 36.... and Beachum is a smart player.. probably few mental mistakes
I mentioned that the Cardinals value his consistency.

However, when is that last time you heard of a team keeping a 24 potential starter on the bench for a 32 yard average starter? I am not saying that it never happens, but it is extremely rare.
 

Krangodnzr

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I mentioned that the Cardinals value his consistency.

However, when is that last time you heard of a team keeping a 24 potential starter on the bench for a 32 yard average starter? I am not saying that it never happens, but it is extremely rare.
When you think you're contending you do.
 

Krangodnzr

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I mentioned that the Cardinals value his consistency.

However, when is that last time you heard of a team keeping a 24 potential starter on the bench for a 32 yard average starter? I am not saying that it never happens, but it is extremely rare.
It's the same reason you start Hicks over Collins. If you believe that Hicks won't make the mental mistakes that Collins will make, even if one of the players is a lot more physically talented, you go with the guy who makes less mistakes. The Cardinals right or wrong, don't want to train players on the field when they have veteran alternatives who can be consistent right now.

Remember Bobbie Massie's rookie year? His first eight games were as bad as anyone had ever seen, but his last eight games he was actually pretty solid. Arians came in and was so concerned about his inconsistency that he signed the corpse of Eric Winston to start over him. Winston was trash, but he wasn't as bad as Massie was over the first eight games of his rookie year.

It's a pretty reasonable idea.
 

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I don't believe he is better right now, but by week 15 of this season he might be.

I disagree that Beachum is limited. I can't find the Pass Block Win Rate for him in 2021, but in 2020 his rate was fairly good. He's a solid player and I would understand why the Cardinals wouldn't move on from him unless Jones was thrust into the starting RT role and ran away with it.
Beachum was 5th in the NFL in Snaps per Blown Block last season and allowed just 0.5 sacks.

D.J. Humphries was T12th among Tackles last year in blown blocks, with 32 (26 passing) to go with 6.5 sacks allowed. 1163 snaps lead the team.

Josh Jones Future Starter was 9th among interior linemen in blown blocks, with 29 (23 passing) to go with 5.5 sacks allowed. 939 snaps was third among OL.

Both Hudson and Pugh ranked among the league leaders in snaps per blown block. It seems like the Cards' strategy of alternating good and bad linemen has some limitations. It would be great if Hernandez could even be an average starter. That right side would be rock-solid.
 

Krangodnzr

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Beachum was 5th in the NFL in Snaps per Blown Block last season and allowed just 0.5 sacks.

D.J. Humphries was T12th among Tackles last year in blown blocks, with 32 (26 passing) to go with 6.5 sacks allowed. 1163 snaps lead the team.

Josh Jones Future Starter was 9th among interior linemen in blown blocks, with 29 (23 passing) to go with 5.5 sacks allowed. 939 snaps was third among OL.

Both Hudson and Pugh ranked among the league leaders in snaps per blown block. It seems like the Cards' strategy of alternating good and bad linemen has some limitations. It would be great if Hernandez could even be an average starter. That right side would be rock-solid.

Based on this sites analysis, Beachum was by far the Cardinals best OL last year.
 

Chopper0080

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It's the same reason you start Hicks over Collins. If you believe that Hicks won't make the mental mistakes that Collins will make, even if one of the players is a lot more physically talented, you go with the guy who makes less mistakes. The Cardinals right or wrong, don't want to train players on the field when they have veteran alternatives who can be consistent right now.

Remember Bobbie Massie's rookie year? His first eight games were as bad as anyone had ever seen, but his last eight games he was actually pretty solid. Arians came in and was so concerned about his inconsistency that he signed the corpse of Eric Winston to start over him. Winston was trash, but he wasn't as bad as Massie was over the first eight games of his rookie year.

It's a pretty reasonable idea.
Hicks was one year over Collins and then Hicks was let go.

Massie was the unquestioned starter to begin year 3.

Jones is the unquestioned backup to Beachum to begin year 3 and for the 3rd year in a row.

You are drawing another false equivalence between these situations.
 
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