2023 Phoenix Suns Offseason

Ouchie-Z-Clown

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I disagree and I know I'm not alone. You can not say for certain it wouldn't happen. Look what Bridges is doing now. He's elevated his game and will most likely be in talks for an All-Star nod next season in Brooklyn. He was headed that direction here as well but Brooklyn making him the primary option definitely fast tracked it. That team wasn't expected to make the Finals the year before either and writing them off so soon is short sighted.

Look at the #3 and #4 guys on both Denver and Miami, I'd take Mikal and Cam over what Miami has and arguably over Gordon and MPJ also. That team could have been retooled in a number of ways to improve, whether Ayton was dealt or not.

There's many moves that could have been made and the Suns seemed locked on Durant when Durant has never won a title outside of Golden State and they've won with and without him. He's not the difference maker some sell him as. He was great but our window is slamming shut fast due to his age and injury history. Then what? Booker wants out? I'm not going to pretend I know but after seeing Paul fall off a cliff, the last thing this team should have done is traded for another player with maybe 2 years left at high level. We saw that story already with Paul.
So are you saying the Paul deal was a mistake? The deal that got us to a finals and a record regular season? I still make that deal over and over again. It’s what elevated bookers standing in the nba and made us a desired destination for other stars. Made book a destination teammate.
 

Mainstreet

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I am for the team taking swings. This trade is a title or bust move. It may very well not pan out. I think the window is this season which I have said from day one. After this season for me it’s highly unlikely anything will come of it.

The Suns took their swing last season. We saw what it looked like.

Now, the Suns will likely be forced to part with Paul and Ayton to be competitive.
 

Mainstreet

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Regarding Cam? According to Netswire, the price for Cam has now ballooned to 100 million for the Nets to keep him.

I think the Suns could have extended Cam Johnson if James Jones didn't have his eye on Durant.

Also, the Suns could have traded Crowder and Saric for value if they did not have a one track mind.
 

Ouchie-Z-Clown

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I think Bridges and Booker are good enough to be part of your top 3 although ideally we'd need a number 1 playing with them. And I'm not sure CamJ can ever fill a top 3 role. I certainly never thought of him as that third piece or even Bridges as a second piece.

But getting rid of them because CP dropped off a cliff made no sense to me as that still left us with the same problem, a washed up Chris Paul instead of the impact player we needed. Even KD at his best isn't enough to replace Bridges, CamJ and star level CP3 and by including those picks we jeopardized our ability to fill those holes.
I agree with your first paragraph. I think what some are failing to see is:

1. With Paul falling off a cliff you really only have a single #1 or #2 in book (which I believe is your belief from the statement in the first paragraph).

2. The only likely way to get another #1 or #2 is going to be to seal talent. That’s likely some combination of cam, bridges and Ayton. And bridges is likely the centerpiece as neither can nor Ayton have that value. Some either bridges/cam or bridges/aytin likely going out to bring book the needed star.

3. To win a championship it has to be a high level star. Not a trae young. So it likely costs more than just two of youngsters. Throw in a couple picks.

4. That star has to want to play here. That’s not every star. So the universe is limited.

5. Most teams don’t want to trade a star. So most available stars are going to have some ding (ball hog, age, injuries, off the court issues).

6. Trading just a slew of draft picks alone doesn’t net you a Durant level star. It nets your a Rudy Gobert. I think we can all agree that a guy of that level isn’t moving the needle for us much with the old team.

7. The old team was going to continue to be a playoff entrant. Like top 4 seed. Draft picks were going to be in the 20s. There a very tiny chance one of those picks netted us a #1 or #2 to play with the entire cast.
 

Ouchie-Z-Clown

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Apparently I am the only person on the board who changes their mind. I was for the trade 100% and that view hasn't held up in light of the results, at least to me.
No, I think many of us are willing to admit it doesn’t look great - at the moment - with hindsight. But believe it was still the right move, even as a recognized overpay.

And I’m still baffled that people don’t recognize 2023-2024 was always the target. Hence the change of coach. But go ahead, judge away based on <20 games in the regular season, no training camp, no offense built with one of the top offensive players to ever play the game in mind. It’s a bit reactionary. But that’s what we sports fans tend to be.
 

Covert Rain

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The Suns took their swing last season. We saw what it looked like.

Now, the Suns will likely be forced to part with Paul and Ayton to be competitive.
The swing wasn't for last season. Plus, Paul's injuries coupled with a $30 million dollar contract and Ayton's regression are a big part of why their names are coming up (not the only reasons). If Paul could stay healthy and Ayton was playing up to this potential, I doubt the Suns take issue with either player KD trade or not. No, it doesn't solve all the bench issues but you sure would have to relay on them much less.
 

Ouchie-Z-Clown

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We will have to disagree because if Booker was against this I don’t think it happens. Plus, if we continued to regress in the playoffs and get bounced early that would also be a reason why trade or no trade.
Damian lillard’s are the exception to the rule these days. Book could’ve been the same, but the likelihood for a guy with his competitive drive is likely not.
 

Ouchie-Z-Clown

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I think it's more a case of clinging to possibilities rather than being unwilling to admit it. Right now, slim though it is, we still have an outside chance to win it all this next year and maybe the following. For many, winning the championship will more than make up for the bad years that are likely to follow.
I am one of those in the last sentence.
 

Ouchie-Z-Clown

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I think the Suns could have extended Cam Johnson if James Jones didn't have his eye on Durant.

Also, the Suns could have traded Crowder and Saric for value if they did not have a one track mind.
There is no evidence to support this and in fact the actual facts point in the opposite direction.
 

Mainstreet

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The swing wasn't for last season. Plus, Paul's injuries coupled with a $30 million dollar contract and Ayton's regression are a big part of why their names are coming up (not the only reasons). If Paul could stay healthy and Ayton was playing up to this potential, I doubt the Suns take issue with either player KD trade or not. No, it doesn't solve all the bench issues but you sure would have to relay on them much less.

If the swing wasn't for last season, it looks more or less like a throwaway season.

I thought the Suns could have been a contender last season if they made a couple of moves using the expiring contracts of Saric and Crowder.

This was a team that went to the Finals in 2020-21 and won 64 games in 2021-22.

It would have been nice to use the MLE as well.
 

Yuma

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I never said he was against it.

When I say that the "fall out from the trade" has dramatically increased the odds of him demanding out, I mean that 2 years from now it's going to be reeeeally hard to put a good team around him because of this trade.
Durant's contract and Booker's contract end at the same time. So does Ayton's. So if the next few seasons don't work, the Suns are open to rebuild the whole thing again.
 

Yuma

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Kellen Olsen: "I can confirm from the team that Paul has not been waived and, per team sources, that the Suns are exploring those previously reported avenues."
 

Covert Rain

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If the swing wasn't for last season, it looks more or less like a throwaway season.

I thought the Suns could have been a contender last season if they made a couple of moves using the expiring contracts of Saric and Crowder.

This was a team that went to the Finals in 2020-21 and won 64 games in 2021-22.

It would have been nice to use the MLE as well.
That’s one way to look at it. I looked at it as a bonus if we managed to get it done. My expectations are way higher if a guy has been with us the full season. It takes time to gel IMO and learn a system.We agree though on making additional moves. You and I have been in sync with that the past couple seasons or so beating that drum.
 

Mainstreet

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Gerald Bourguet also wrote a nice article about the offseason options for Chris Paul.

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Yuma

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IDK, how this would work, Aaron Edwards on the Locked on Suns podcast keeps banging the drum on us trading for Markelle Fultz.

I know this guy gets mad props from me on developing his game from where he started in the NBA. I don't watch him so I have no idea if he's good, bad, or this has any reality to trade for him.

Supposedly Aaron Edwards says this guy is the ideal PG for Book and KD.
 

Phrazbit

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No, I think many of us are willing to admit it doesn’t look great - at the moment - with hindsight. But believe it was still the right move, even as a recognized overpay.

And I’m still baffled that people don’t recognize 2023-2024 was always the target. Hence the change of coach. But go ahead, judge away based on <20 games in the regular season, no training camp, no offense built with one of the top offensive players to ever play the game in mind. It’s a bit reactionary. But that’s what we sports fans tend to be.

I get that next season is the target, it still makes the trade insane in my eyes. You don’t break up a really good team and mortgage the future for a guy who’s gonna be 35 and is injured all the time with an eye on “next year”.
 
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