15 thoughts - training camp

Stout

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Does Monti then get full credit for Williams?

Williams had injury concerns coming in. Beej had no history of injury and the minor injury wasn’t considered a red flag at all. Williams had a red flag and was a much bigger risk
He absolutely gets full credit for Williams. And I was vocally against using a high pick on him. I got that one wrong and Monti got that one right.

Different circumstances, though. Beej was a 2nd rounder and we had absolutely nothing at the position. It was a risk we couldn't afford to take, and it bit us in the rear. He then compounded it by neglecting the position again last year.
 

kerouac9

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He absolutely gets full credit for Williams. And I was vocally against using a high pick on him. I got that one wrong and Monti got that one right.

Different circumstances, though. Beej was a 2nd rounder and we had absolutely nothing at the position. It was a risk we couldn't afford to take, and it bit us in the rear. He then compounded it by neglecting the position again last year.
Williams was absolutely the correct risk. But that doesn't offset or excuse fairly missing on Beej.

Twelve second round picks selected after Beej have a double-digit Approximate Value. This isn't a situation of "How did we draft Isabella over DK Metcalf?"
 

Chopper0080

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Williams was absolutely the correct risk. But that doesn't offset or excuse fairly missing on Beej.

Twelve second round picks selected after Beej have a double-digit Approximate Value. This isn't a situation of "How did we draft Isabella over DK Metcalf?"
I think by now we can say that Monti is willing to gamble on health when it comes to draft picks. Ojulari, Williams, Wilson, and Will Johnson all had health concerns but were drafted in the top 100.
 
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Gandhi

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None of these guys have any trade value. People could have gotten Collier for nothing four months ago.

Every team in the NFL has a Xavier Thomas or two. He’s Cap Capi. He’s Victor Dimukeje.

Owen Pappoe is a replacement level ILB.
Are you aware that the Chiefs traded a 7th rounder for Cam Thomas at the end of camp? Or that Keim traded a 6th and 7th for Robbie Anderson? Some years ago, the Patriots paid a 6th rounder for Korey Cunningham. Once, the Cardinals paid a 7th round pick for Trayvon Mullen. There are countless examples.
 
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Gandhi

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I don’t see us trading or picking up another wr unless we get a rash of injuries. Davis simply drops too many passes.
Most surprising is during this whole thread the name Kyler Murray didn’t come up.:)
I forgot to comment on the Davis-thing, but I think it is worth noting.

I have seen many fans (from many different teams) complain that Davis drops too many passes. I just have to say that the statistics don’t support that notion.

From 2022-2024, Tyreek Hill, Ja’Marr Chase, Puca Nacua and Davante Adams - among others - have many more drops than Davis.

Now, obviously context is important (for example that those guys get a lot more targets), but if we just look at 2024, Jerry Jeudy, Malik Nabers, and Chase were far ahead of Davis.

Another thing to keep in mind is that Davis has dropped significantly fewer balls in 2022 and 2023 compared to 2024 based on drop pass rate percentage.
 

kerouac9

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Are you aware that the Chiefs traded a 7th rounder for Cam Thomas at the end of camp? Or that Keim traded a 6th and 7th for Robbie Anderson? Some years ago, the Patriots paid a 6th rounder for Korey Cunningham. Once, the Cardinals paid a 7th round pick for Trayvon Mullen. There are countless examples.
7th rounders are different from mid-round picks. Cam Thomas was a former 3rd round pick entering his third season. Robbie Chosen Anderson was a former 1000-yard receiver.

Maybe some of these guys can be turned into 7th round picks. But I don't think we're going to get equal or greater value that the 5th we invested in both Owen Pappoe and Xavier Thomas. I think both being at least replacement level NFL players make them more valuable to keep on the roster and try and stash on the practice squad.
 
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Gandhi

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7th rounders are different from mid-round picks. Cam Thomas was a former 3rd round pick entering his third season. Robbie Chosen Anderson was a former 1000-yard receiver.

Maybe some of these guys can be turned into 7th round picks. But I don't think we're going to get equal or greater value that the 5th we invested in both Owen Pappoe and Xavier Thomas. I think both being at least replacement level NFL players make them more valuable to keep on the roster and try and stash on the practice squad.
Who said anything about equal or greater value than they used on those players?
 

Cbus cardsfan

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The big camp issues are the guys who have been talked about on defense.
IF, Robinson, BJ, and Elijah can play their potential the defense can be top notch. Those are talented guys coming off injuries.

On offense, I think they are set. They must like Jones and the fast unproductive guy they signed as a free agent for the WR room.

I don’t think Cooper is a good fit just because he’s kind of redundant to Wilson/Jones. He’s probably better but still going to be the 3rd-4th option.

Lastly, Denzel Burke could be cut or end up being the best CB on the team. It will be interesting to watch. I’m betting he’ll be pretty damn good.
 

Ouchie-Z-Clown

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Does Monti then get full credit for Williams?

Williams had injury concerns coming in. Beej had no history of injury and the minor injury wasn’t considered a red flag at all. Williams had a red flag and was a much bigger risk
Of course he does. Who else would?
 

Krangodnzr

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I forgot to comment on the Davis-thing, but I think it is worth noting.

I have seen many fans (from many different teams) complain that Davis drops too many passes. I just have to say that the statistics don’t support that notion.

From 2022-2024, Tyreek Hill, Ja’Marr Chase, Puca Nacua and Davante Adams - among others - have many more drops than Davis.

Now, obviously context is important (for example that those guys get a lot more targets), but if we just look at 2024, Jerry Jeudy, Malik Nabers, and Chase were far ahead of Davis.

Another thing to keep in mind is that Davis has dropped significantly fewer balls in 2022 and 2023 compared to 2024 based on drop pass rate percentage.
I think it's his overall catch % that hovers so low and he's also not much of a YAC guy. He's a deep ball guy, but kind of an average player.
 

kerouac9

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Gabe Davis and Elijah Moore are guys who, I assume, the coaching staff are aware of and have declined to pursue. If you trust this coaching staff is at least average, then you just have to accept that and move on.
 

oaken1

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Gabe Davis and Elijah Moore are guys who, I assume, the coaching staff are aware of and have declined to pursue. If you trust this coaching staff is at least average, then you just have to accept that and move on.
considering our QB's trust issues it may be as simple as...they are a little better than what we have but in the long run will not increase output because Kyler wont throw them the ball. so keep the continuity...shaking up the roster could be a net negative if the talent increase is minimal.
 

phillycard

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Amari Cooper wont have issues being a #3 wherever he signs. He had a worse year than Michael Wilson despite being asked to be the #1 guy for the Bills/Browns. He is extremely washed. He would be competing with Zay Jones for snaps.

I agree with you a lot on Ojulari. He had a good rookie season, missed his second season with an ACL. I don't see any reason he can't recover from the ACL and continue being good.
Yeah, semi hard pass on Amari Cooper for me. Too many nightmares of AJ Green.
 
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Gandhi

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Lastly, Denzel Burke could be cut or end up being the best CB on the team. It will be interesting to watch. I’m betting he’ll be pretty damn good.
This is my thoughts too, Cbus. As you obviously know, Burke's college-time has been extremely up-and-down. He truly could become a major steal.
 
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Gandhi

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Gabe Davis and Elijah Moore are guys who, I assume, the coaching staff are aware of and have declined to pursue. If you trust this coaching staff is at least average, then you just have to accept that and move on.
I agree with this. Otherwise it makes no sense that they have not at the very least brought them in for a visit. And in the case of Moore, he signed a very cheap one year-deal, so yeah, I assume they could have gotten him if they wanted.
 

BACH

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Williams was absolutely the correct risk. But that doesn't offset or excuse fairly missing on Beej.

Twelve second round picks selected after Beej have a double-digit Approximate Value. This isn't a situation of "How did we draft Isabella over DK Metcalf?"
Nope. Because the injury concern at draft time is something you make up.

There was zero injury concern at the time of the draft.
 

PackerNation2025

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Training camp starts today. Tomorrow is the first open practice that fans can attend.
I was gonna say, why are the Cards not practicing?
The Packers practiced at 10:30 this morning. Camp in full swing. Cardinals already behind the rest of the league.

Below is Josh Jacobs after practice. The reporters felt the "urgency" at practice. The Pack is on a mission this year. It's time!
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BirdGangThing

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I was gonna say, why are the Cards not practicing?
The Packers practiced at 10:30 this morning. Camp in full swing. Cardinals already behind the rest of the league.

Below is Josh Jacobs after practice. The reporters felt the "urgency" at practice. The Pack is on a mission this year. It's time!
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you're so lonely and thirsty and nobody cares about the packers lol guessing you've been laughed off and banned from divisional rival forums so you're setting up accounts on other forums now - im not mad just disappointed - we used to get good trash talk in here and now this - it's like you took the lackluster product on the field in green bay and somehow morphed it into words on this site - passive aggressive one second - $4000 douche baggery the next - this is not playoff trashtalk - not even preseason - me thinks you were undrafted
 
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