Denny Green Talking Championship...

[Russ Smith]

Russ: You make several great points. The big question...and potential vulnerability of this defense is right up the middle, where Russell Davis, Gerald Hayes and Robert Griffith (can he make the transition to FS?) will be tested repeatedly. Davis made strides last year, but was still soft against the run. Hayes has excellent potential..but he's raw...and Griffith may lack the speed and instincts to be effective at free safety. There doesn't appear to be much depth at those critical positions either, which may be cause for concern.

The perimeter...on the other hand...is potentially awesome...with Berry and Okeafor at ends...Dansby, Huff and Blackstock bringing speed on the edges...and if Pendergast caters his schemes to Antrel Rolle's strengths...as I believe he will...wow...with Adrian Wilson roaming all over the place...wow!

I think the D will get better as the year goes along as Rolle and Green progress and hopefully Hayes, Dansby, Dockett etc all get better as the year goes.

I think by playoff time if healthy our D can be as good as anybody's, but young teams are very hard to predict and we're relying on a LOT of young players on defense.

Hopefully the offense will step up and help the defense out.

 

[Crimson Warrior]

I remember about this time last year when some fans were threatening a boycott after he cut Kendall. I don't understand that mentality as you could tell from day one that Green is changing things for the better. Well, most can I guess.

Certainly I never threatened to boycott. But I still think green is heavy handed. Kendall is the best example, but not the only one. How about Ronnie Mac? He has been unceremoniously showed the door after playing his butt off for about eight years.

Green benched him in his last game. That was rough.

Tough workouts last year in camp, jerking the QBs in and out of games, kicking his oline coach to the curb, etc.

Now don't get me wrong, I'm ready to run through a brick wall for Denny. I'm fired up. And Ronnie Mac has made way more money by 32 than I ever will in my whole life. I don't feel sorry for him, and I put the team above any player.

Its just that Denny is throwing his weight around a lot. At some point, if he gets too crazy, he'll lose the team if the guys get too po'ed at him.

Probably won't happen, though. No big deal...

 

[ajcardfan]

Certainly I never threatened to boycott. But I still think green is heavy handed. Kendall is the best example, but not the only one. How about Ronnie Mac? He has been unceremoniously showed the door after playing his butt off for about eight years.

Green benched him in his last game. That was rough.

Tough workouts last year in camp, jerking the QBs in and out of games, kicking his oline coach to the curb, etc.

Now don't get me wrong, I'm ready to run through a brick wall for Denny. I'm fired up. And Ronnie Mac has made way more money by 32 than I ever will in my whole life. I don't feel sorry for him, and I put the team above any player.

Its just that Denny is throwing his weight around a lot. At some point, if he gets too crazy, he'll lose the team if the guys get too po'ed at him.

Probably won't happen, though. No big deal...

Now that Green has his guys (with some of the key ones being McGinnis players) he seems to be calming down quite a bit. The trust has to go both ways. Remember, ten guys openly signed a complaint about last year's OTAs. For every guy who signed, it's not unreasonable to assume there were two without the guts to sign it. So, Green had a very large challenge to his authority right away. Things can't be done the player's way, not when those players have been big time losers. It's been a long, ugly process, but I think Green feels he has the team buying into his program now. And, if anyone doesn't, they are too isolated to be much trouble (like Hambrick).

For example, it looked like Boldin might be a major fly in the ointment, so Green let him and the world know how unhappy he was. Boldin shows up for the OTAs, works hard, and Green raves about him at the end of the workouts. Same thing happens last year in that environment, Boldin might be gone.

As for McKinnon, he was my favorite player for years. It was surprising that he even made the team last year. It really was. Sadly, it looks like he'll never strap it up again. I just can't see anyone signing him. Not a guy who has come out on passing downs and not played special teams for about 4 years now.

 

[Stronso]

Certainly I never threatened to boycott. But I still think green is heavy handed. Kendall is the best example, but not the only one. How about Ronnie Mac? He has been unceremoniously showed the door after playing his butt off for about eight years.

Green benched him in his last game. That was rough.

Tough workouts last year in camp, jerking the QBs in and out of games, kicking his oline coach to the curb, etc.

Now don't get me wrong, I'm ready to run through a brick wall for Denny. I'm fired up. And Ronnie Mac has made way more money by 32 than I ever will in my whole life. I don't feel sorry for him, and I put the team above any player.

Its just that Denny is throwing his weight around a lot. At some point, if he gets too crazy, he'll lose the team if the guys get too po'ed at him.

Probably won't happen, though. No big deal...

Shyte.......as Herm Edwards said here in NYC: "You play to win the game!" And that starts at the top wth the B's, Graves and Denny

 

[pete]

I wrote the "Green Must Go" article and I take full responsibility for it. Dennis Green made several controversial moves last year while talking Top 5 offense and an immediate playoff berth from day one. The manner in which he treated the players was a real sticking point with me. A father of one of the players emailed me to elaborate on Green's mistreatment of the players. I still have a problem with Green's methods there...and I still have a problem with the way he stood all alone like a mumbling Buddha on the sidelines, making no adjustments while games were going down the tubes. I still have a problem with changing QBs in the hotel the night before a ballgame, at a time when the team was on a little winning streak. I still have a problem with the way he threw in the towel in the Detroit game, by having his offense huddle up for thirty seconds a pop, down 14 with 3 minutes left. Call me an idiot, that's fine.

Is football about wins and losses, or all of this other soap opera crap? I could care less what the father of a player who Green was probably 86'ing thinks about him. If the player is now gone, he was most likely a Mac/Tobin slacker who accepted losing season after season while milking a fat NFL paycheck. Why do you, or anyone else, feel the need to defend these players? They had their chance, they didn't win, and now they're gone!

Sure, Green made some mistakes last year. He knows it. One of the things that I like about Green is that he is quick to realize his mistakes and take action. Like firing Wylie and Wood. Like getting Warner in here instead of going with McCown again or some has been reject. Really, when you think about where this team was 18 months ago, which was last place, and where it is now, which is seriously contending for the NFC West, Green has made remarkable progress in a short amount of time. If the Cards win the NFC West this season and go to the playoffs, he should be considered for coach of the year.

Green and his methods have this team on the fast track to success and that is all the Bidwills and fans should care about.

 

[Doc Cardinal]

Why do fans think Green is merciless or stalinist? The man has laid down a higher standard and the players that don't want to meet it have been cut, or will be cut. I don't see why having higher expectations and a goal of winning a championship makes him a hard nosed coach.

The players that really want to win a championship appreciate Green and what he's doing. They don't want slackers for teammates. They want to play with guys like Green who want to win the trophy.

Well said Duckfallas....and I love your avatar.

 

[duckfallas]

Well said Duckfallas....and I love your avatar.

How do you like the new avatar?

 

[seesred]

Green had to come in last year and set the tone. Sure PK packing going to camp only to be told he is no longer on the team at the time seamed extreme and mean. Well, Denny had to be mean. The players had to know he meant bussiness.He could have let him go the day before. But I'm sure he timed the move exactly as it came to being. He told every player everyday he hated the offense.He made changes of people he brought in and said no I wont be a loser.

He watched tape, he saw a last place team with last place players. He drew up a plan and after just one season we are all talking about not just the playoffs, we are talking about the division champions. We are not hoping our defese is going to be good, it already is. The offense, changes at WR, QB, RB, Line. Special teams upgraded with many new young talented players. Brought in some top talent in FA. Two D-ends, a saftey, linebacker. He changed scouts, coaches, and (maybe not him) Radio stations to the top KTAR. We are now ready to hit the field with a feeling if we play the game plan we WILL win the game. Can you say Super bowl. Crazy things have happened.

GBR
40
In Green we trust

 

[JPlay]

All we need is for them to produce on the field. Get those close wins. No more teams blowing us out. Finally have a running game and a real QB. Start stopping the run consistently, and not give up big plays.

 

[Crimson Warrior]

Green had to come in last year and set the tone. Sure PK packing going to camp only to be told he is no longer on the team at the time seamed extreme and mean. Well, Denny had to be mean. The players had to know he meant bussiness.He could have let him go the day before. But I'm sure he timed the move exactly as it came to being. He told every player everyday he hated the offense.He made changes of people he brought in and said no I wont be a loser.

He watched tape, he saw a last place team with last place players. He drew up a plan and after just one season we are all talking about not just the playoffs, we are talking about the division champions. We are not hoping our defese is going to be good, it already is. The offense, changes at WR, QB, RB, Line. Special teams upgraded with many new young talented players. Brought in some top talent in FA. Two D-ends, a saftey, linebacker. He changed scouts, coaches, and (maybe not him) Radio stations to the top KTAR. We are now ready to hit the field with a feeling if we play the game plan we WILL win the game. Can you say Super bowl. Crazy things have happened.

GBR
40
In Green we trust

Good post seesred. You and ajcardfan say similar things, and I agree with both of you. Its the rebuttal to Walter's arguments, and the last thing that I'll say on the matter.

This franchise was in terrible shape at the end of 2003. We were truly a laughing stock.

To say that drastic measures were needed is an understatement. And, Green shook things up. He did what needed to be done.

 

[Duckjake]

Certainly I never threatened to boycott. But I still think green is heavy handed. Kendall is the best example, but not the only one. How about Ronnie Mac? He has been unceremoniously showed the door after playing his butt off for about eight years.

Ron McKinnon is one of if not the most overrated player in Arizona Cardinal history. He was the prime example of what was wrong in the Valley for the last 8 years. Great guy, huge heart but second team talent. Green thankfully has removed those type players from the roster along with the handful of talented players who were coasting in Phoenix.

If McKinnon were smart he would have announced his retirement at the start of the season effective at the end of the 2004 schedule. He would have been the toast of the town for 17 weeks. Just really hard for those guys to give up the lifestyle.

 

[Cheesebeef]

Ron McKinnon is one of if not the most overrated player in Arizona Cardinal history. He was the prime example of what was wrong in the Valley for the last 8 years. Great guy, huge heart but second team talent. Green thankfully has removed those type players from the roster along with the handful of talented players who were coasting in Phoenix.

If McKinnon were smart he would have announced his retirement at the start of the season effective at the end of the 2004 schedule. He would have been the toast of the town for 17 weeks. Just really hard for those guys to give up the lifestyle.

exactly. Bemoaning the rightful benching and letting go of the second coming of Garth Jax would only be considered out of the ordinary by a fan of a team that was continually awful. That's not this team any more (at least it looks that way).

 

[Doc Cardinal]

How do you like the new avatar?

Yeah not bad.

My son's a big Ohio State fan and we play Texas in game 2 I think so he already has his tee shirt with the F-Texas on the front and The Steer They Rode In On...on the back.

 

[Duckjake]

Yeah not bad.

My son's a big Ohio State fan and we play Texas in game 2 I think so he already has his tee shirt with the F-Texas on the front and The Steer They Rode In On...on the back.

Great to see that the Texas mystique continues. The premier College sports program in America. The Longhorns are the only school in America to be the #1 rival of Universities in 5 different conferences. Like the Yankees in baseball the Horns are hated across America because of their unmatched success in all sports.

What?!?! Texas is playing for the NCAA Championship in baseball?!?!? Again?

Who would have guessed.

 

[Crimson Warrior]

exactly. Bemoaning the rightful benching and letting go of the second coming of Garth Jax would only be considered out of the ordinary by a fan of a team that was continually awful. That's not this team any more (at least it looks that way).

That is weak cheese. You used to respect Ronnie Mac. I remember that you called him a "warrior". The guy had a zillion tackles behind some truly awful defensive lines and now you guys are ragging on him?

You guys know that I'm talking about how he was benched (not if).

 

[MaoTosiFanClub]

That is weak cheese. You used to respect Ronnie Mac. I remember that you called him a "warrior". The guy had a zillion tackles behind some truly awful defensive lines and now you guys are ragging on him?

You guys know that I'm talking about how he was benched (not if).

Ah, Crimson the loyal defender of mediocre talent like Jason White, Ronnie Mac, and Marcel Shipp.

Newsflash: Just because a guy tries hard doesn't mean he's any good.

EDIT - I do appreciate McKinnon's (and Shipp for that matter) hard work over the years but I never confused the guy with an above average LB. However, their lack of talent compared to other players at their positiona round the league makes me fully understand why he was showed the door.