Video: Kyler Murray can’t see the middle of the field.

DaHilg

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Very good video, makes some good points. My only qualm is do we really expect our miniature QB to stand tall in the pocket when often times there is either a pocket under duress being our interior line was gawd awful? Secondly, would you have confidence even in the times we had a somewhat clean pocket to step up into? Example; Aaron Donald just bull-rushed and made your pocket collapse 4 of the last 6 passing downs.. are you stepping up in the pocket on the 7th passing down? No, this is not the case in every clip in the video - I don’t believe it’s a vision problem in physically.. I do believe it is a confidence problem, that has developed into a mental issue in automatically going to your parameter routes as your first option.. thus completely missing the times where there is a clean pocket and open Ertz.
 

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Agreed. Excellent. And also horrifying. We get this for 5 years baby!

Very good video, makes some good points. My only qualm is do we really expect our miniature QB to stand tall in the pocket when often times there is either a pocket under duress being our interior line was gawd awful? Secondly, would you have confidence even in the times we had a somewhat clean pocket to step up into? Example; Aaron Donald just bull-rushed and made your pocket collapse 4 of the last 6 passing downs.. are you stepping up in the pocket on the 7th passing down? No, this is not the case in every clip in the video - I don’t believe it’s a vision problem in physically.. I do believe it is a confidence problem, that has developed into a mental issue in automatically going to your parameter routes as your first option.. thus completely missing the times where there is a clean pocket and open Ertz.
Really good vid. However, if you look in the comments you'll see Seahawks fans saying Russell had the same issue. As the guy in the video said those run-action plays (as I've been saying for 3 years) help alleviate some of those issues. We dont do enough of it.
Excellent video.
As I've said also. Its not a film issue. Its a footwork/movement in the pocket to find throwing lanes issue. As well as Keim not giving the Cards an awesome interior/thus Kyler not always trusting it.


Kyler needs to be as committed as Drew Brees was to finding throwing windows in muddy pockets. That's a training eyes/feet problem.
 

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Really good vid. However, if you look in the comments you'll see Seahawks fans saying Russell had the same issue. As the guy in the video said those run-action plays (as I've been saying for 3 years) help alleviate some of those issues. We dont do enough of it.

As I've said also. Its not a film issue. Its a footwork/movement in the pocket to find throwing lanes issue. As well as Keim not giving the Cards an awesome interior/thus Kyler not always trusting it.


Kyler needs to be as committed as Drew Brees was to finding throwing windows in muddy pockets. That's a training eyes/feet problem.
I remember Kurt Warner once talking about height saying any QB has trouble seeing over the middle when talking once about Kyler and as you mentioned, Kyler needs to work on finding throwing lanes
 

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Really good vid. However, if you look in the comments you'll see Seahawks fans saying Russell had the same issue. As the guy in the video said those run-action plays (as I've been saying for 3 years) help alleviate some of those issues. We dont do enough of it.

As I've said also. Its not a film issue. Its a footwork/movement in the pocket to find throwing lanes issue. As well as Keim not giving the Cards an awesome interior/thus Kyler not always trusting it.


Kyler needs to be as committed as Drew Brees was to finding throwing windows in muddy pockets. That's a training eyes/feet problem.
Kyler also bails when he doesn't have to.

See Seahawks game #2. Earlier in the year he did a much better job, but I think losing Hopkins probably affected his confidence.
 

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I wondered how many posts it would take before someone threw up the NextGen Stats graphic. What that doesn't show is the volume on those passes. If Kyler goes 7-8 for 90 yards and a TD over a season, his passer rating is gonna look pretty good in that area, but what it really shows you is that Kyler isn't throwing nearly enough into that area.
 

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I wondered how many posts it would take before someone threw up the NextGen Stats graphic. What that doesn't show is the volume on those passes. If Kyler goes 7-8 for 90 yards and a TD over a season, his passer rating is gonna look pretty good in that area, but what it really shows you is that Kyler isn't throwing nearly enough into that area.

They also don't show that he often only makes those throws when the line has broken down, or the play is designed for the line to split and leave a huge throwing lane.

It's one thing making those throws when you have 3 big linemen in front of you and another when all you see is turf.
 

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The video has some good points, but also falls flat on quite a bit of its premises. Especially the 'can't see over the middle' one. The example he uses to say Kyler 'can't see over the middle,' (around the 7:30 mark) Kyler is out of the pocket, and would have had a clear view of Ertz if he saw him. If you wanted to call him out for not going through the progressions, sure. To say that he can't see over the middle, you need to show clear examples of it. The video doesn't.

In fact, there are some plays in the video where he does throw through the middle but they are discounted because they are an 'alert.' Sigh.
 

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Wilson has the same problem, but is better at overcoming it.
 

oaken1

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honestly,,, we saw big improvement from Kyler over the middle last year... I like it just like he is now... a quarterback that plays the outside but hits the middle when its available.

lots of QB's throw over the middle because they dont have the arm to throw to the outside accurately.
playing the outside protects your WR's and protects the ball....and we all saw Kirk make plenty of catches over the middle, so we know Kyler can hit it if its there.
 

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honestly,,, we saw big improvement from Kyler over the middle last year... I like it just like he is now... a quarterback that plays the outside but hits the middle when its available.

lots of QB's throw over the middle because they dont have the arm to throw to the outside accurately.
playing the outside protects your WR's and protects the ball....and we all saw Kirk make plenty of catches over the middle, so we know Kyler can hit it if its there.
If you can't show that you can consistently throw over the middle, teams are going to key on the outside and make life hell for the offense. While KM can beat a defense that way, it's rather boom or bus, and has no consistency.
 

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Whether it's over the middle, outside or deep my take is that Kyler needs to learn how to go through progressions quicker, manipulate the pocket to buy time (not bail at the first hint of the rush) and get it out quicker to the open guy. He runs the drop back 10 fetal fall play way too often.

A big plus he has is his running ability but it's also one of his biggest minuses at times.
 

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If you can't show that you can consistently throw over the middle, teams are going to key on the outside and make life hell for the offense. While KM can beat a defense that way, it's rather boom or bus, and has no consistency.
But that's sports right?
You take away what the opponent does best and make him beat you with what he doesn't want to do. That's not any kind of revelation.
Kyler had serious issues over the middle his first two seasons. But last season he proved that if the middle is all the defense is giving then he'll take it...and iirc he took it at close to 70% completions.

Kyler throwing over the middle is a non issue.

Post snap reads and responding to disguised coverages is an issue
 

dreamcastrocks

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But that's sports right?
You take away what the opponent does best and make him beat you with what he doesn't want to do. That's not any kind of revelation.
Kyler had serious issues over the middle his first two seasons. But last season he proved that if the middle is all the defense is giving then he'll take it...and iirc he took it at close to 70% completions.

Kyler throwing over the middle is a non issue.

Post snap reads and responding to disguised coverages is an issue
Yep. It is a lazy argument at this point.
 

dreamcastrocks

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I think he is lamenting Kliff's lack of coaching, which is brought up in the video as a large reason for these issues.
Interesting. Didn't think of it that way...
 

Stout

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But that's sports right?
You take away what the opponent does best and make him beat you with what he doesn't want to do. That's not any kind of revelation.
Kyler had serious issues over the middle his first two seasons. But last season he proved that if the middle is all the defense is giving then he'll take it...and iirc he took it at close to 70% completions.

Kyler throwing over the middle is a non issue.

Post snap reads and responding to disguised coverages is an issue

No, not really. Throwing over the middle is a staple. A good QB needs to be able to do it well, and also do it consistently, or they're not going to make much noise in the NFL. Yes, he has a decent percentage throwing over the middle. That's not the problem. The problem is missing open receivers in the middle of the field and thus not throwing to them. As was said by someone earlier in the thread, you can get an outrageously good percentage throwing over the middle if you only throw 9 of them and complete 8. What about the other 10 that you left on the field?

Throwing over the middle, being patient enough to throw over the middle, is certainly still an issue.
 

Stout

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Yep. It is a lazy argument at this point.
The lazy argument is high completion percentage over the middle = being good at throwing over the middle. It in no way factors in the throws that aren't made, for various reasons, be it lack of vision, impatience and bailing from the pocket, or just a natural propensity for wanting to go for the big shot downfield on the outside. Just quoting the completion percentage is a lazy argument at this point.
 
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