3rd down FG

[daves]

kyler still can’t run a 2 minute offense

Murray has led four 4th-quarter comebacks and had seven game-winning drives. And had A.J. Green remembered to play WR, he would've had a 99-yard game-winning drive with less than 2 minutes to go against the team with the best record in the league.

...dbs

 

[daves]

I don’t blame KK at all for continuing the drive for the TD. But to commit to the TD and then give up on 3rd down to save 5 seconds?!?
That’s what’s baffling and also the point of this thread.

I'm not sure kicking on 3rd down was the right decision... but i don't think the argument in favor was "to save 5 seconds". As others have pointed out, Murray had been making some questionable throws, so it was probably more a matter of making sure he didn't throw another one short and in-bounds, or, as no one has pointed out yet, in case of a bad snap or hold by "Finkle" McCoy. Had they kicked on 4th down and McCoy botched the hold, everyone here would be calling Kingsbury an idiot for not wasting a down and ensuring a second chance at a must-have kick.

...dbs

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

The FACT is he has improved every year, has won 10 games (with two left), got this team into the playoffs, and a chance to win the division title. Top 10 offenses in the NFL the last two years. Those are the facts that matter most.

He is doing with with a 3rd year QB and an All-Pro WR. Outside of that, our talent is weak sauce.

Name a team with at least 10 wins that has less offensive talent than us:

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[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

I like Keim in many ways, but this discussion reminds me that when a manager struggles (in any profession), it’s really the upper administration that needs to intervene and assist that manager and I don’t see any overt maneuvering in this regard by our GM. If you invest in a HC in whom you believe, you need to follow through to ensure that he gets the guidance and support necessary for success. In KK’s case, perhaps hiring a veteran OC as a mandate going forward would stop the historic trend of flaming out each season. The guy (KK) needs some help and guidance.

This is 100% what good management does. They help to ensure the people reporting to them have the tools to be successful - even when it might be something that their reports might not like.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Thats a fact. So much of the “that’s a horrid play call“ when something doesn’t Work. But if an amazing play happens to all the players not the play. or you see open WRs running free and Kyler doesn’t take advantage or throws a bad ball it’s all on the coach he’s a bum. Way too much hindsight involved.

Yeah I don’t agree with this. I think this is lazy argumentation. For the first half of the season I saw plenty of compliments on play design on this board.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Murray has led four 4th-quarter comebacks and had seven game-winning drives. And had A.J. Green remembered to play WR, he would've had a 99-yard game-winning drive with less than 2 minutes to go against the team with the best record in the league.

...dbs

Lol. You’re too smart to believe that post is responsive to my post. Dave, you know “2 minute drill” does not equate to either “game winning drive” or “4th quarter comeback.” Come at me when you actually have response with some substance. Or at least more than a single failed last minute drive. I’ll give you one for free: Hail Murray (but that’s hardly a well-oiled 2 minute drill).

 

[cardcrazy]

I'm not sure kicking on 3rd down was the right decision... but i don't think the argument in favor was "to save 5 seconds". As others have pointed out, Murray had been making some questionable throws, so it was probably more a matter of making sure he didn't throw another one short and in-bounds, or, as no one has pointed out yet, in case of a bad snap or hold by "Finkle" McCoy. Had they kicked on 4th down and McCoy botched the hold, everyone here would be calling Kingsbury an idiot for not wasting a down and ensuring a second chance at a must-have kick.

...dbs

In his postgame, When asked about why he kicked on 3rd down, Kingsbury said it was to save as much time as possible to score a TD.
And if you’re afraid of a questionable throw by Murray then who do you think was going to be throwing the ball on the subsequent TD drive?
I’m not buying any of it!
There was no good reason to kick on 3rd down because it was unreasonable.

 

[Stout]

Murray has led four 4th-quarter comebacks and had seven game-winning drives. And had A.J. Green remembered to play WR, he would've had a 99-yard game-winning drive with less than 2 minutes to go against the team with the best record in the league.

...dbs

What Ouchie said. Also, go look at that 2-minute drill (Actually, the drive started with a whopping 4:16 on the clock!), go look at how many freaking plays he had to run to get a field goal, then get back to me. Because that "hurry-up" drive was utterly embarrassing.

 

[Phrazbit]

What Ouchie said. Also, go look at that 2-minute drill (Actually, the drive started with a whopping 4:16 on the clock!), go look at how many freaking plays he had to run to get a field goal, then get back to me. Because that "hurry-up" drive was utterly embarrassing.

Murray hasn't exactly been clutch but I am putting "hurry up" problems on the coaches. Even mid 2000s Andy Ried would be embarrassed at how bad we are at getting play calls in on a timely basis.

 

[Stout]

Murray hasn't exactly been clutch but I am putting "hurry up" problems on the coaches. Even mid 2000s Andy Ried would be embarrassed at how bad we are at getting play calls in on a timely basis.

KK might share some blame in that area, but Kyler taking every damned check down and passing for 3-5 yards a pop on something like a 16-play FG drive was insanely awful situational QBing.

 

[BullheadCardFan]

KK might share some blame in that area, but Kyler taking every damned check down and passing for 3-5 yards a pop on something like a 16-play FG drive was insanely awful situational QBing.

It's like he wasn't even looking down field. Just trying to get rid of the ball as quick as possible

 

[Russ Smith]

In his postgame, When asked about why he kicked on 3rd down, Kingsbury said it was to save as much time as possible to score a TD.
And if you’re afraid of a questionable throw by Murray then who do you think was going to be throwing the ball on the subsequent TD drive?
I’m not buying any of it!
There was no good reason to kick on 3rd down because it was unreasonable.

The risk on the next drive is baked in though. The defense knows you have to throw and if you need a TD they're going to be deep and sitting on the end zone anyways. Lots of late game winning drives end with INT's for that very reason.

I agree with what DCR said about when to kick it time wise I think the reason Kliff ran more plays is he didn't trust his holder, or kicker frankly, to make a 50 yard plus kick so he decided to get a bit closer. Then some of Kyler's decisions made him panic so he kicked it.

 

[cardcrazy]

The risk on the next drive is baked in though. The defense knows you have to throw and if you need a TD they're going to be deep and sitting on the end zone anyways. Lots of late game winning drives end with INT's for that very reason.

Agree! That’s why you take every down when you’re on the 10. You must get a TD to win so you’ll probably not be this close again. Take the shot on 3rd down, because if you’re successful then you don’t have to deal with the scenario above. Assuming a successful onsides. You just need 15 or so more yards for a chance at a game winning FG.

 

[cardcrazy]

It’s “risk vs gain”
KK had no situational awareness.
He panicked! Not something you wanna see from a professional head coach your paying millions.

 

[daves]

Dave, you know “2 minute drill” does not equate to either “game winning drive” or “4th quarter comeback.” Come at me when you actually have response with some substance.

I'm sure you'll point me to a site that ranks teams or players by performance in "2 minute drills" precisely, since apparently you think game winning drives and 4th quarter comebacks have no relevance or correlation to that kind of situational football. I'll wait....

...dbs

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

I'm sure you'll point me to a site that ranks teams or players by performance in "2 minute drills" precisely, since apparently you think game winning drives and 4th quarter comebacks have no relevance or correlation to that kind of situational football. I'll wait....

...dbs

Lol. Worse counter ever. A fourth quarter comeback could come with an 8 minute drive. Same as a game winning drive. A two minute drive literally means it had to have occurred within two minutes. You’re a scientist. Surely the numerical significance of minimal time to drive the field isn’t lost on you. You’re better than that.