PFF Top 100 free agents

[DVontel]

Got to remember these rankings are based on PFF grades for one season. I doubt they bare much reality to how teams rank them.

Of all our own FA's the one I want back least is Drake. And it pains me to say that because I was a fan of the signing and a fan of his play last year. But he just hasn't been good this year.

I know he finished 13th in yards but he was 40th in YPA.

He finished with an average of 4 per carry with is below average by todays standards but he racked up most of that late in games vs tired defenses. Of his 955 yards 408 of them came in Q4 at 5.3 average.

When trying to establish the run and take the pressure off your QB early in the game he was awful. Only 162 yards in Q1 and 163 yards in Q2 all season. At a rate of 3.1 and 2.8 YPC.

Which is the exact opposite of his stats in 2019 where in Q1 Drake gave us 6.6 YPA and 502 of his yards.

Based on his play last year Drake isn't someone you can reply on as a primary back. I really don't know why we didn't use Edmonds more. He gave us 6.3 YPA in Q1 this season.

Another baffling decision by Kliff.

Probably because Chase was #notgood when he was the primary back. Miami for example.

 

[BigDavis75]

I think fans here are massively over rating Reddick. He's not an OLB1, he's never getting OLB1 money and he's not a top end OLB2. The highest paid OLB2 in the league is Preston SMith at $13m. .


He had a good year. I'm really pleased for him, but I think PFF got it mostly right. I think on the open market he's looking at $10m tops which is what Leonard Floyd got paid this past year but if the salary cap goes down then more like $8.5 is right.

He’s absolutely a top end olb2, we were without chandler for most of the year and as our top pass rusher he still put up a very strong season.

 

[Finito]

You don't luck into 12.5 sacks and 6 FFs. He finally played his natural position and basically excelled. Saying he isn't that good would be an exaggeration. In a full season as an OLB he showed that he could be good.

well I mean he kind of did. Pretty much half his stats for the season came in one game.

take away the one game and your looking at 15 games with 7.5 sacks and 3FF. Is that good??? Is that a guy that makes people say wow we can’t lose him he’s to valuable?

I’m not seeing it. He had one amazing game but for 15 games he was pretty average and those stats don’t lie.

 

[Finito]

we really don’t know that yet.

and people said the same things about the other guys I mentioned. They all ended up being either very good players or even Pro-Bowl level for Jamir.

and what we DO know is that Peterson isn’t that good AND getting old. And Drake is next to nothing.

if you’re going to spend the money, at least do it with the young guy who’s got upside.

Dansby and Miller were pretty damn good from jump.

 

[DVontel]

well I mean he kind of did. Pretty much half his stats for the season came in one game.

take away the one game and your looking at 15 games with 7.5 sacks and 3FF. Is that good??? Is that a guy that makes people say wow we can’t lose him he’s to valuable?

I’m not seeing it. He had one amazing game but for 15 games he was pretty average and those stats don’t lie.

Lmaooooo

 

[BritCard]

Probably because Chase was #notgood when he was the primary back. Miami for example.

The only example, as it's the only game he had the chance.

Yet the one game he started last year he had 127 yards and 3 TD's.

They certainly should have given more snaps to Chase.

 

[BritCard]

He’s absolutely a top end olb2, we were without chandler for most of the year and as our top pass rusher he still put up a very strong season.

Fans for 3 years

"Reddick sucks. Terrible draft pick"

Fans after 10 games as a starter at OLB.

"Reddick is a top end OLB2. He's worth $12m a year"

 

[gimpy]

well I mean he kind of did. Pretty much half his stats for the season came in one game.

take away the one game and your looking at 15 games with 7.5 sacks and 3FF. Is that good??? Is that a guy that makes people say wow we can’t lose him he’s to valuable?

I’m not seeing it. He had one amazing game but for 15 games he was pretty average and those stats don’t lie.

I guess you could ask if 7.5 sacks and 3 forced fumbles is pretty average for 16 games? What other players have those numbers?

 

[BigDavis75]

Fans for 3 years

"Reddick sucks. Terrible draft pick"

Fans after 10 games as a starter at OLB.

"Reddick is a top end OLB2. He's worth $12m a year"

He was playing out of position, don't be obtuse. In terms of the performance of our defenders this year where would you rank Reddick?

 

[BritCard]

He was playing out of position, don't be obtuse. In terms of the performance of our defenders this year where would you rank Reddick?

I'm not going to say nobody is paying Reddick top end money based on 1 season at OLB (there's often somebody, normally us) but it would be silly.

This is basically the same situation as Jordan Philips. Trash for 3 years, has one 10 sack season. We pay him big money and he reverted right back to the guy he was in the 3 seasons.

Another major factor nobody is mentioning is who he got his sacks against.

His best by far were probably against Mike McGlinchy. Then Taylor Decker.

After that it's all rookies and no name backups.

Again, not taking anything away from Haason but looking at it from a GM perspective you have to ask yourself "If I pay this guy $12m is he going to be able to beat X, Y and Z tackles in my division?" and the answer is at best "I don't know".

There's too many questions to risk that kind of money in my opinion.

 

[speedy]

More then a couple weeks he was recorded as the fastest player in the NFL to the QB if I'm not mistaken. Hard to say he was a contract year wonder when its his first year playing his actual natural position.

Again, I agree with you Shane.

You don’t let a guy like Reddick walk. He’s on the upswing, and he is a home grown talent (even if our coaching STAFFS managed to completely misuse him for 4 years). We should keep guys like him.

As for PP... offer him a deal he is worthy of, maybe with a little more sugar for being a member of the family, but if we get outbid, go find another corner...

 

[BigDavis75]

I'm not going to say nobody is paying Reddick top end money based on 1 season at OLB (there's often somebody, normally us) but it would be silly.

This is basically the same situation as Jordan Philips. Trash for 3 years, has one 10 sack season. We pay him big money and he reverted right back to the guy he was in the 3 seasons.

Another major factor nobody is mentioning is who he got his sacks against.

His best by far were probably against Mike McGlinchy. Then Taylor Decker.

After that it's all rookies and no name backups.

Again, not taking anything away from Haason but looking at it from a GM perspective you have to ask yourself "If I pay this guy $12m is he going to be able to beat X, Y and Z tackles in my division?" and the answer is at best "I don't know".

There's too many questions to risk that kind of money in my opinion.

It's a very straightforward question, where would you rank Reddick for the defenders we have on the roster? It's also not the same situation as Phillips, Reddick was playing out of position and flourished when he was put in the right spot - I don't understand why this is so difficult to process.

We are talking about a player who is 26 and finished top 5 in the league in sacks, TFL and FF at one of the most important positions in the game. He had this season as clearly our best front 7 player and our top pass rush threat. He was also the only player capable of holding the edge consistently which is extremely important in our division. The defense finished 10th in adjusted DVOA with a group that was very injured (we were down 5 starters in a lot of games) and below average talent overall. So either Vance did an amazing coaching job or some of our defenders are better than this board thinks.

You don't let young talent like this walk over a few million when it would create a huge hole during our star QBs rookie contract.

 

[BritCard]

It's a very straightforward question, where would you rank Reddick for the defenders we have on the roster? It's also not the same situation as Phillips, Reddick was playing out of position and flourished when he was put in the right spot - I don't understand why this is so difficult to process.

We are talking about a player who is 26 and finished top 5 in the league in sacks, TFL and FF at one of the most important positions in the game. He had this season as clearly our best front 7 player and our top pass rush threat. He was also the only player capable of holding the edge consistently which is extremely important in our division. The defense finished 10th in adjusted DVOA with a group that was very injured (we were down 5 starters in a lot of games) and below average talent overall. So either Vance did an amazing coaching job or some of our defenders are better than this board thinks.

You don't let young talent like this walk over a few million when it would create a huge hole during our star QBs rookie contract.

Firstly, he didn't "flourish". Up to the NYG game he had gone 5 games without a sack and had 3 sacks in 7 starts since CJ went down. Nobody was saying he was having a great year. We were all saying he looked better and he had done well, but not great.

They he played against 2 rookie tackles and had 5 sacks, and when we needed him in the Rams game he didn't show up.

He's done well. He's been much better at OLB. He deserves a nice little contract which frankly he wasn't going to get before, but I think people are getting carried away.

Where would I rank him? About 5th ish maybe. But then he's not got much to rank against.

 

[dreamcastrocks]

i will vomit if this is what we do. If Redick gets away for that little money, its Calvin Pace, Karlos Dansby, Jamir Miller all over again.

I mean, throwing 45 million at a washed up, terrible example for younger players PEDerson and Drake, who didn’t prove much in his prove it year after cashing the check, would be a terrible allocation of resources.

So much this.

 

[BigDavis75]

Firstly, he didn't "flourish". Up to the NYG game he had gone 5 games without a sack and had 3 sacks in 7 starts since CJ went down. Nobody was saying he was having a great year. We were all saying he looked better and he had done well, but not great.

They he played against 2 rookie tackles and had 5 sacks, and when we needed him in the Rams game he didn't show up.

He's done well. He's been much better at OLB. He deserves a nice little contract which frankly he wasn't going to get before, but I think people are getting carried away.

Where would I rank him? About 5th ish maybe. But then he's not got much to rank against.

Discounting his stats is such a silly argument. He is playing against an nfl team every week and the other players at his position all see weaker assignments as well.

Again, he was top 5 in sacks, tfl and forced fumbles - how could that possibly not be considered flourishing?

Out of curiosity who are these four players you think played better than Reddick?

 

[Cheesebeef]

Dansby and Miller were pretty damn good from jump.

Dansby definitely was. Miller wasn’t. His he didn’t start one game as a rookie and Had a whopping total of 19 tackles in year 1. 52 tackles in year 2 marred by injury. Year 3 and 4 started playing better, but year 5 is where he put it all together, going from 92 tackles to 113 tackles (career best), 3 sacks (second career best), 2 FF (career best) and then punctuated the season with a four sack performance against the Cowboys in the playoffs where the team FINALLY utilities him as a pass rusher for the first time in five seasons. All that happened in his final year of his contract and that’s when he really became a total beast.

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/M/MillJa01.htm

and then we told him to kick rocks.

now, I’m NOT saying Redick is going to be as good as Dansby or Jamir. Those were my two favorite linebackers ever on this team. But he’s certainly got a shot to be somewhere between Pace (who ended up being very good for the Jets) and those two guys. And he’s still young enough to grow.

to prioritize an aging and declining every year old CB who sets a terrible example as a leader of the team or Drake over the upside is why bad teams stay bad.

 

[Finito]

Lmaooooo

I mean do you think different?

 

[DVontel]

Firstly, he didn't "flourish". Up to the NYG game he had gone 5 games without a sack and had 3 sacks in 7 starts since CJ went down. Nobody was saying he was having a great year. We were all saying he looked better and he had done well, but not great.

They he played against 2 rookie tackles and had 5 sacks, and when we needed him in the Rams game he didn't show up.

He's done well. He's been much better at OLB. He deserves a nice little contract which frankly he wasn't going to get before, but I think people are getting carried away.

Where would I rank him? About 5th ish maybe. But then he's not got much to rank against.

This is going to turn out like the Humphries conversation isn’t it

 

[BritCard]

Discounting his stats is such a silly argument. He is playing against an nfl team every week and the other players at his position all see weaker assignments as well.

Again, he was top 5 in sacks, tfl and forced fumbles - how could that possibly not be considered flourishing?

Out of curiosity who are these four players you think played better than Reddick?

Nobody is discounting it. I'm accounting for it.

If he got all his sacks in one game it would matter right? So it matters that 40% came in one game for a guy with so little history to base a contract offer on.

 

[BigDavis75]

Nobody is discounting it. I'm accounting for it.

If he got all his sacks in one game it would matter right? So it matters that 40% came in one game for a guy with so little history to base a contract offer on.

Ah yes, the commonly seen 12.5 sack game - excellent point.

 

[kerouac9]

IMHO, whether to keep Patrick Peterson (and Larry Fitzgerald for that matter) and at what price is a Michael Bidwill decision, not necessarily a Steve Keim decision. I think that's a good reason to expect that Patrick stays at an amount that will make some of us nauseous.

Reddick is a hard one. I know that people think that Arians was the one playing him out of position, but I remember Bruce comparing Reddick to Von Miller when he was drafted (who obviously isn't an ILB). That said, I think that Steve Keim will like to have another 1st rounder stay beyond his current contract, and the price for 10-sack guys isn't always as much as you'd expect (ask Markus Golden).

 

[juza76]

IMHO, whether to keep Patrick Peterson (and Larry Fitzgerald for that matter) and at what price is a Michael Bidwill decision, not necessarily a Steve Keim decision. I think that's a good reason to expect that Patrick stays at an amount that will make some of us nauseous.

Reddick is a hard one. I know that people think that Arians was the one playing him out of position, but I remember Bruce comparing Reddick to Von Miller when he was drafted (who obviously isn't an ILB). That said, I think that Steve Keim will like to have another 1st rounder stay beyond his current contract, and the price for 10-sack guys isn't always as much as you'd expect (ask Markus Golden).

The day Michael Bidwill won't put the nose In football operations maybe the franchise will have a chance

 

[wa52lz]

You don't luck into 12.5 sacks and 6 FFs. He finally played his natural position and basically excelled. Saying he isn't that good would be an exaggeration. In a full season as an OLB he showed that he could be good.

Marcus Golden disagrees

 

[football karma]

So it matters that 40% came in one game for a guy with so little history to base a contract offer on.

your point is valid, but i think the position is extreme

you can recognize an outlier, but i dont think you assign a "0" value to it either

cut his day at NYG in half to a very good, but not unusual 2.5 sack day. Heck, make it 2

he still finishes the season at 10, which is top 10 in the NFL

maybe said differently: if he is brought back, i dont think you can pencil in 11-13 sacks from Reddick, but i think you can count on 8-9 with a ton of pressures as well.

further, character wise Reddick is a team first, hard working, high effort guy. I think you need as many of those as you can get

 

[BritCard]

your point is valid, but i think the position is extreme

you can recognize an outlier, but i dont think you assign a "0" value to it either

cut his day at NYG in half to a very good, but not unusual 2.5 sack day. Heck, make it 2

he still finishes the season at 10, which is top 10 in the NFL

maybe said differently: if he is brought back, i dont think you can pencil in 11-13 sacks from Reddick, but i think you can count on 8-9 with a ton of pressures as well.

further, character wise Reddick is a team first, hard working, high effort guy. I think you need as many of those as you can get

Not discounting it at all. Simply pointing out there are other factors to consider.