Heading into next season we need a legit number two

BritCard

ASFN Icon
Joined
Jan 10, 2020
Posts
21,031
Reaction score
37,086
Location
UK
If it helps create easier reads for your developing QB, why wouldn't you?

Why wouldn't you use the same trips formation on most plays? I can think of a whole bunch of reasons. Especially when combined with limited routes.

Also Kyler has started 27 games in the NFL. We shouldn't have to put trips to one side just so Kyler knows Nuk has single coverage.
 

Chopper0080

2021 - Prove It
Joined
May 15, 2002
Posts
26,631
Reaction score
34,717
Location
Colorado
Why wouldn't you use the same trips formation on most plays? I can think of a whole bunch of reasons. Especially when combined with limited routes.

Also Kyler has started 27 games in the NFL. We shouldn't have to put trips to one side just so Kyler knows Nuk has single coverage.
Dude...Kyler Murray has 45 starts between his college career and his pro career. For context, Justin Herbert has 52. Kyler needs all the help he can get to decode defenses and make the correct reads.
 
OP
OP
Jetstream Green

Jetstream Green

Kool Aid with a touch of vodka
Joined
Feb 5, 2003
Posts
29,459
Reaction score
16,598
Location
San Antonio, Texas
I heard it said that WR do not really come into their own till about their third year (unless you are Boldin and a bad ass). This often makes me wonder how many WRs could have been good if given the attention. It's a crap shoot though with the draft and one cannot just invest that patience with every WR you draft. I know that when selected and physical attributes will send others out the proverbial door but I will say this here, Keesean can run routes and catch better than Isabella who is just a speed guy you can find every draft with that 50/50 catch ability. Yes, some think to give him time to learn to catch with his hands but that is a instinct attribute before a trained one and how many people here did not frankly get embarrassed watching the guy jump up to cradle the ball on the tip pass... same damn jump response on that pass which Kyler threw to tie the game which this is not going to change while Keesean recently went with his hands in traffic, Johnson being that guy I would extended that patience
 
Last edited:

daves

Keepin' it real!
Supporting Member
Joined
Nov 2, 2003
Posts
3,308
Reaction score
6,384
Location
Orange County, CA
Kliff's scheme.

Guys like Chris Simm's and Mike Renner have been saying for some time that the offense isn't very inventive. Very little pre snap motion, everything out of shotgun, limited route trees etc

Kliff tries to do some things with play design and formations that can be interesting. For example some of the designed runs for Kyler with TE's in pre snap motion, but you can only do these things so often.

The vast majority, the bread and butter, are rather basic. Nearly all the explosive plays are Kyler runs, and wide deep balls. Not hard to take away once you figure it out.
Isn't a hallmark of the Air Raid a relatively small number of plays, from which receivers have options to run their routes differently depending on the coverage? I wonder whether the options are being limited for some reason.

...dave
 

BritCard

ASFN Icon
Joined
Jan 10, 2020
Posts
21,031
Reaction score
37,086
Location
UK
Dude...Kyler Murray has 45 starts between his college career and his pro career. For context, Justin Herbert has 52. Kyler needs all the help he can get to decode defenses and make the correct reads.

You know what else helps with reading the defense? Pre snap motion.

If it's all about helping Kyler read defenses then when is our motion rate only 10%?
 

BritCard

ASFN Icon
Joined
Jan 10, 2020
Posts
21,031
Reaction score
37,086
Location
UK
Isn't a hallmark of the Air Raid a relatively small number of plays, from which receivers have options to run their routes differently depending on the coverage? I wonder whether the options are being limited for some reason.

...dave

I think the whole air raid concept thing is overblown. Kliff is running an NFL scheme with some air raid / college concepts, just like a bunch of teams. Most notably the Chiefs. Just minus all the inventive stuff the Chiefs do.
 

BritCard

ASFN Icon
Joined
Jan 10, 2020
Posts
21,031
Reaction score
37,086
Location
UK
Where have you seen that it is only 10%?

Seth Walder updates it every 2 weeks or so. Last one was from a couple weeks back. I don't see anything changing.

xc_hide_links_from_guests_guests_error_hide_media

You don't have to look very hard at the top half to see lots of good teams and the bottom half to see lots of bad teams.
 
Last edited:

JohnnyCakes

Miserables
Joined
Oct 28, 2020
Posts
3,237
Reaction score
2,599
Location
Phoenix
id very much like to see Allen Robinson in cardinal Red. He is withering away in chicago and is a FA next year. Has great hands
 

Chopper0080

2021 - Prove It
Joined
May 15, 2002
Posts
26,631
Reaction score
34,717
Location
Colorado
Seth Walder updates it every 2 weeks or so. Last one was from a couple weeks back. I don't see anything changing.

xc_hide_links_from_guests_guests_error_hide_media

You don't have to look very hard at the top half to see lots of good teams and the bottom half to see lots of bad teams.
Thanks. I wasn't having any luck with Google.
 

BritCard

ASFN Icon
Joined
Jan 10, 2020
Posts
21,031
Reaction score
37,086
Location
UK
The legit number two thing.....

After watching some of the All22 from last Sunday all I can say is that Kirk is open a bunch. There are plays where the DB lines up a good 7-8 yards off Kirk. Continues to stay 7-8 yards off Kirk when Kirk is moving. Kirk goes past the 1st down marker and is waiting for the ball, still with a huge cushion, and Murray throws a 4 yard checkdown to Edmonds.

There's the one I posted images of where Kirk was open over the middle on a really nice route, Kyler looked right at him and then ran for 8 yards. Kirk could have housed it, or gone for 40 yards min.

I wouldn't count Kirk out. It's not his fault he's not getting the ball.
 

DVontel

ASFN Icon
Joined
Jan 28, 2015
Posts
12,358
Reaction score
21,041
The legit number two thing.....

After watching some of the All22 from last Sunday all I can say is that Kirk is open a bunch. There are plays where the DB lines up a good 7-8 yards off Kirk. Continues to stay 7-8 yards off Kirk when Kirk is moving. Kirk goes past the 1st down marker and is waiting for the ball, still with a huge cushion, and Murray throws a 4 yard checkdown to Edmonds.

There's the one I posted images of where Kirk was open over the middle on a really nice route, Kyler looked right at him and then ran for 8 yards. Kirk could have housed it, or gone for 40 yards min.

I wouldn't count Kirk out. It's not his fault he's not getting the ball.
Kirk can also not drop easy TD catches like he did Sunday.
 

Ouchie-Z-Clown

I'm better than Mulli!
Joined
Sep 16, 2002
Posts
59,937
Reaction score
51,286
Location
SoCal
The legit number two thing.....

After watching some of the All22 from last Sunday all I can say is that Kirk is open a bunch. There are plays where the DB lines up a good 7-8 yards off Kirk. Continues to stay 7-8 yards off Kirk when Kirk is moving. Kirk goes past the 1st down marker and is waiting for the ball, still with a huge cushion, and Murray throws a 4 yard checkdown to Edmonds.

There's the one I posted images of where Kirk was open over the middle on a really nice route, Kyler looked right at him and then ran for 8 yards. Kirk could have housed it, or gone for 40 yards min.

I wouldn't count Kirk out. It's not his fault he's not getting the ball.
But his questionable hands are his fault. And I’m not just talking about drops. Throughout his career a lot of his catches have been bobbled or not clean hand catches. He’s got subpar hands and he’s not particularly clutch. That’s a bad combo for a guy you want to rely upon as your #2.
 

BritCard

ASFN Icon
Joined
Jan 10, 2020
Posts
21,031
Reaction score
37,086
Location
UK
But his questionable hands are his fault. And I’m not just talking about drops. Throughout his career a lot of his catches have been bobbled or not clean hand catches. He’s got subpar hands and he’s not particularly clutch. That’s a bad combo for a guy you want to rely upon as your #2.

He also has some great catches. The one vs Miami with his fingertips was top draw.

He's not top drawer but he's not the garbage some make him out to be. We do under use him.
 

Metcalf Rules

Hall of Famer
Joined
Jan 18, 2004
Posts
2,326
Reaction score
2,750
Location
Great Falls, MT
The Cardinals have had a legit #2 all year because sometimes their guys play like cr@p! But seriously, how about Devonta Smith of Alabama, 6 receptions for 200 yards in the first half. Jevon McKinley of Notre dame is also a big receiver who had 3 tds today, granted it was against Syracuse. He could probably be had in later rounds.
 

Finito

ASFN Icon
Joined
Oct 23, 2005
Posts
20,906
Reaction score
13,586
The Cardinals have had a legit #2 all year because sometimes their guys play like cr@p! But seriously, how about Devonta Smith of Alabama, 6 receptions for 200 yards in the first half. Jevon McKinley of Notre dame is also a big receiver who had 3 tds today, granted it was against Syracuse. He could probably be had in later rounds.

Smith won’t be there when we draft
 

Rohinaz

All Star
Joined
Oct 14, 2018
Posts
539
Reaction score
573
Location
Scottsdale
Terrace Marshall has size, speed and hands. He may be there when we pick

Sent from my SM-G988U using Tapatalk
 
Top