Things that make me say "hmmmmm"

[Chris_Sanders]

98.7 was blitzing Ruggs yesterday. I am starting to get really worried Keim is going to blow this badly

 

[jmt]

If Keim blows it at least we got Hopkins. Please don’t draft a WR!

 

[Garthshort]

I posted this in another thread, but Tua didn't use him at his virtual pro day, he used Jeudy. Possibly, Ruggs wasn't available, possibly Tua trusted Jeudy more.

 

[JCSunsfan]

OK. I have a simple question. Ruggs ran a 4.27 40. Isabella ran a 4.31 40. Ruggs is an inch taller and weighs the same. Does he run better routes? Are his hands more sure than Isabella? Are we sure that he will be enough better than Isabella that we will pass on an elite tackle or defensive player to take him? After all, we would be spending a first-round pick on a player that projects to be our #3 (or even #4) wide-receiver. We have had plenty of very fast receivers over the past few years that have not really panned out for us. I like having a fast player, but its only one factor.

It seems to me that Ruggs would be set up to fail if we drafted him 8th. Hopkins, Fitz, Kirk, plus the TE and maybe even the RB will get touches before he will. And then you still have Isabella who can scoot too. Drafting a WR at 8 just not seem to make sense to me.

Unless there is a trade of some kind.

 

[juza76]

I think in the future all the test at combine should be made with helmet and pads

I mean Isabella is a 429 guy with shorts
Deandre Hopkins was 457
I guess with pads there won't be almost 0.30 of difference
Then a runner has the technique to run faster, especially starting from the blocks, but in the football field is a substantial difference

 

[JCSunsfan]

I think in the future all the test at combine should be made with helmet and pads

Ha. I agree. But can you imagine all the attempts at cheating? Special light weight helmets and pads that do not represent real games etc. The football equivalent of a corked bat.

 

[juza76]

Ha. I agree. But can you imagine all the attempts at cheating? Special light weight helmets and pads that do not represent real games etc. The football equivalent of a corked bat.

The equipment would be provided by the Nfl, and delivered at the day of the test

 

[juza76]

98.7 was blitzing Ruggs yesterday. I am starting to get really worried Keim is going to blow this badly

In a trade down option i don't mind getting Ruggs
The guy can stretch the field, has playmaking ability, is excellent as returner and as a gunner too
Is not just receiver

 

[DVontel]

I’d draft Ruggs before Lamb.

 

[Chris_Sanders]

OK. I have a simple question. Ruggs ran a 4.27 40. Isabella ran a 4.31 40. Ruggs is an inch taller and weighs the same. Does he run better routes? Are his hands more sure than Isabella? Are we sure that he will be enough better than Isabella that we will pass on an elite tackle or defensive player to take him? After all, we would be spending a first-round pick on a player that projects to be our #3 (or even #4) wide-receiver. We have had plenty of very fast receivers over the past few years that have not really panned out for us. I like having a fast player, but its only one factor.

It seems to me that Ruggs would be set up to fail if we drafted him 8th. Hopkins, Fitz, Kirk, plus the TE and maybe even the RB will get touches before he will. And then you still have Isabella who can scoot too. Drafting a WR at 8 just not seem to make sense to me.

Unless there is a trade of some kind.

This is exactly what worries me. Keim keeps trying to draft a "Speed" guy. All of these guys are 4.43 or less and all about the same physical makeup

John Brown 2014 (3rd)
JJ Nelson 2015 (5th)
Chad Williams 2017 (3rd)
Christian Kirk 2018 (2nd)
Andy Isabella 2019 (2nd)

I guess John Brown is the best of that lot. Keim has a terrible habit of just trying to do the same thing over and over until he gets it right. None of these guys have really transformed the offense.

I don't know what anyone sees in Ruggs. There is just no track record of success with his speed and body type.

 

[Chris_Sanders]

I’d draft Ruggs before Lamb.

....why?

 

[JCSunsfan]

This is exactly what worries me. Keim keeps trying to draft a "Speed" guy. All of these guys are 4.43 or less and all about the same physical makeup

John Brown 2014 (3rd)
JJ Nelson 2015 (5th)
Chad Williams 2017 (3rd)
Christian Kirk 2018 (2nd)
Andy Isabella 2019 (2nd)

I guess John Brown is the best of that lot. Keim has a terrible habit of just trying to do the same thing over and over until he gets it right. None of these guys have really transformed the offense.

I don't know what anyone sees in Ruggs. There is just no track record of success with his speed and body type.

I am with you. I am hoping for Simmons or Brown. One of Wills, Mechton, or Wiirfs would be OK (even Thomas maybe).

 

[Chris_Sanders]

Yeah I am pretty much off WR right now in round 1 unless they believe Kirk is useless.

 

[Chris_Sanders]

And if they believe Kirk is useless then drafting a 6th clone of the same type and expecting a different result is the definition of insanity

 

[cardncubfan]

I’d draft Ruggs before Lamb.

I would not.

 

[DVontel]

....why?

Game-breaking speed, good hands, can high-point, competent route-runner, etc. Also way more experienced against press-man(which is big imo)

I don't think there's a single thing Lamb does "much" better than Ruggs and I don't buy into Lamb's "great" YAC-ability like that considering the Big 12 is pretty much 7v7. Ruggs' floor is much lower than Lamb's, while his ceiling is a lot higher.

I 100% believe if you take Justin Jefferson out of LSU and switch him with Lamb for their whole college careers, the production is identical. However, one is a viewed as a later first rounder while the other switches between being the best in the class.

 

[Chris_Sanders]

There is no such thing as "Game Breaking Speed"

I already shown that

Small speed receivers are HUGE on the bust scale. We have drafted 5 of them. 2 busts. 2 average WR. 1 likely bust.

 

[DVontel]

So what about everything else in that post

 

[SoonerLou]

The difference between Ruggs and Isabella is that Ruggs is fluid shifting his gears and AI is not while running a route

If Andy can learn how to shed blockers and catch with his hands instead of his body I think he will improve greatly in his 2nd year.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

There are many more differences between the two including height, vertical, ability to high point the ball, tracking the ball on deep routes, the ability to catch the ball away from their frame(Ruggs with over ten inch hands). Ruggs was the most explosive player I have ever seen on tape. My opinion was made before the combine. AI’s tape Never matched his combine numbers. He wasn’t worth a day two pick based on what I seen. Zero comparison between these two players.

Listened to TJ Houshmandzadeh on Cowherd earlier today.

Made a great point that its not how fast a guy is, but how well a guy decelerates. Andy's got the speed he just doesnt know how to slow down under control and then explode out. Thats what helps get guys open.

Andy still has to figure out how to be crafty with his speed.

 

[Chris_Sanders]

Well I am not really looking to defend Lamb. I don't have any stake in the Lamb game. I am terrified of drafting Ruggs.


Ruggs has never had more than 46 receptions or more than 744 yards despite having an elite QB, an elite offensive line, and having an elite #1 WR next to him.


These are his cons according to PFF, which just fly in the face of the statement that he is a competent route runner who does well against press


1. Routes often have a static, straight line approach to attacking defensive backs.

2. Contact on his routes robs him of far more speed than you'd like.

3. Doesn't use his body or hands to separate from defenders along the route.

4. Hitch getting off line of scrimmage and doesn't quite pop like you'd expect with his speed.


And I would absolutely add as cons

Lacks elite college production despite an ideal situation
Lacks ideal size and strength
Receivers with his size / speed ratio rarely become top NFL performers

Closest comp with size, speed, and college production is Phillip Dorsett.

 

[Jetstream Green]

Well I am not really looking to defend Lamb. I don't have any stake in the Lamb game. I am terrified of drafting Ruggs.


Ruggs has never had more than 46 receptions or more than 744 yards despite having an elite QB, an elite offensive line, and having an elite #1 WR next to him.


These are his cons according to PFF, which just fly in the face of the statement that he is a competent route runner who does well against press


1. Routes often have a static, straight line approach to attacking defensive backs.

2. Contact on his routes robs him of far more speed than you'd like.

3. Doesn't use his body or hands to separate from defenders along the route.

4. Hitch getting off line of scrimmage and doesn't quite pop like you'd expect with his speed.


And I would absolutely add as cons

Lacks elite college production despite an ideal situation
Lacks ideal size and strength
Receivers with his size / speed ratio rarely become top NFL performers

Closest comp with size, speed, and college production is Phillip Dorsett.

I listed my positive thought but I agree with you. Let's make it simple. Alabama is going into the season and they can only have one out of Ruggs and Jeudy... yeah, they are taking Jeudy the elite WR which their season shows

 

[SoonerLou]

Is this the interview that sold him on Ruggs?

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[daves]

For those who are terrified of the Cardinals taking Ruggs, there's this from Darren Urban's latest Mailbag:

What do you think about the Cardinals drafting Henry Ruggs III at number 8?

I know people have tired of me phrasing it like this but ... is Ruggs the guy you think is going to be the best pro of who is on the board? Is he better than Jeudy? Lamb? Wirfs? Wills? I have no problem if the Cardinals take Ruggs because of that. I would be leery of taking Ruggs because he is the "speed" guy and while not as good as Jeudy, for instance, might fit better. If you're taking a receiver, he better be more than an upgraded J.J. Nelson when you could also pick a multi-time Pro Bowl tackle.

...dbs

 

[football karma]

"he better be more than an upgraded J.J. Nelson "

Urban for the win

 

[Chris_Sanders]

"he better be more than an upgraded J.J. Nelson "

Urban for the win

Its 100% accurate!!!