The old Keim Telegraph

slanidrac16

ASFN Icon
Supporting Member
Joined
Jul 11, 2002
Posts
15,002
Reaction score
14,417
Location
Plainfield, Il.
Even if we got only a 3rd at best for a small trade, I would love that then select CeeDee than a whole lot more than staying at #8 to get him.
There are 5 guys who I think might draw interest for someone to trade up with us. Okuda, Simmons, Brown, Juedy or Lamb.

if we traded down we would still guarantee getting a top flight wr. That being ssid it would be really hard for us to pass on any of those guys.
 

Russ Smith

The Original Whizzinator
Supporting Member
Joined
May 14, 2002
Posts
84,223
Reaction score
32,835
Sounds like we are leaning to Lamb which is fine with me. I prefer Jeudy but it's not like I think there's a huge difference and even if I think Jeudy is better, and I do, when you factor in Kyler and Lamb having played together that may offset the difference. Lamb might be better right away because he's already played with Kyler.

Just please no small school project or a converted LB to TE or something.
 

iLLmatiC

Drive-by Poster
Joined
Jul 4, 2004
Posts
7,428
Reaction score
4,913
Location
Gilbert, AZ
Sounds like we are leaning to Lamb which is fine with me. I prefer Jeudy but it's not like I think there's a huge difference and even if I think Jeudy is better, and I do, when you factor in Kyler and Lamb having played together that may offset the difference. Lamb might be better right away because he's already played with Kyler.

Just please no small school project or a converted LB to TE or something.

At this point with Keim I'm cool with the sure thing.
 

Finito

ASFN Icon
Joined
Oct 23, 2005
Posts
20,906
Reaction score
13,586
Sounds like we are leaning to Lamb which is fine with me. I prefer Jeudy but it's not like I think there's a huge difference and even if I think Jeudy is better, and I do, when you factor in Kyler and Lamb having played together that may offset the difference. Lamb might be better right away because he's already played with Kyler.

Just please no small school project or a converted LB to TE or something.

go look at Tampa Bays draft. Those picks had BA all over them
 

overseascardfan

ASFN Addict
Joined
Apr 9, 2005
Posts
8,807
Reaction score
2,094
Location
Phoenix
Keim said on Burns and Gambo last week that he puts a lot of stock in positions with high re-signing price tags when preparing his first round draft board. So you figure that's QB, LT, Pass Rusher & CB. He has his QB so you figure if Okudah is top rated QB, Andrew Thomas is the top LT & Chase Young would be the pass rusher. Of course he is talking to Jeudy & Lamb because he needs to be prepared in case Okudah, Thomas & Young are off the board because the next best pass rusher is arguably Epenesa. Okudah would be the pick if he is there at #8 due to BPA but if Thomas is there would he take him knowing he may have to replace Humphries if he doesn't keep progressing or go with a WR in a deep draft? Of course if Thomas & Okudah are gone then BPA would be a WR, I don't think they go Simmons unless Young, Okudah, Thomas & WR's are off the board.

https://cardswire.usatoday.com/2020/02/17/nfl-draft-arizona-cardinals-steve-keim/

“One of the things I’ve always thought about philosophically was when you have a position group, and again they grade in a similar area, when you look at the big picture and you say, ok when I get to free agency, which players at that position exist in free agency, because usually people tie up left tackles, corners, quarterbacks — guys that are hard to find,” he said on Arizona Sports 98.7 FM. “So I would obviously lean in the direction of players that are hard to find and don’t really make it to free agency because they get extended.”
 

DVontel

ASFN Icon
Joined
Jan 28, 2015
Posts
12,357
Reaction score
21,037
Keim said on Burns and Gambo last week that he puts a lot of stock in positions with high re-signing price tags when preparing his first round draft board. So you figure that's QB, LT, Pass Rusher & CB. He has his QB so you figure if Okudah is top rated QB, Andrew Thomas is the top LT & Chase Young would be the pass rusher. Of course he is talking to Jeudy & Lamb because he needs to be prepared in case Okudah, Thomas & Young are off the board because the next best pass rusher is arguably Epenesa. Okudah would be the pick if he is there at #8 due to BPA but if Thomas is there would he take him knowing he may have to replace Humphries if he doesn't keep progressing or go with a WR in a deep draft? Of course if Thomas & Okudah are gone then BPA would be a WR, I don't think they go Simmons unless Young, Okudah, Thomas & WR's are off the board.

https://cardswire.usatoday.com/2020/02/17/nfl-draft-arizona-cardinals-steve-keim/

“One of the things I’ve always thought about philosophically was when you have a position group, and again they grade in a similar area, when you look at the big picture and you say, ok when I get to free agency, which players at that position exist in free agency, because usually people tie up left tackles, corners, quarterbacks — guys that are hard to find,” he said on Arizona Sports 98.7 FM. “So I would obviously lean in the direction of players that are hard to find and don’t really make it to free agency because they get extended.”
lmao, good Lord dude.
 

Dr. Jones

Has No Time For Love
Joined
Nov 2, 2004
Posts
24,796
Reaction score
13,532
Sounds like we are leaning to Lamb which is fine with me. I prefer Jeudy but it's not like I think there's a huge difference and even if I think Jeudy is better, and I do, when you factor in Kyler and Lamb having played together that may offset the difference. Lamb might be better right away because he's already played with Kyler.

Just please no small school project or a converted LB to TE or something.

I think this is where I stand also.

Again, my personal 5 tier plan with a level 6 addition:

1. Young - Obvious IMO but wont be there
2. Okudah - Almost as Obvious. Still wont be there.
3. Simmons - Only if Vance has a plan. This guy is perfect for us IMO and perfect for the new NFL.
4. Jeudy - Has a significant advantage over CeeDee with his elite level traits. Suddenness, quickness, sharpness of route.
5. Any of these three OT's: Thomas, Wirfs, Wills <-- We need a RT. I don't care what K2 or SK say about Justin Murray
6. Lamb or Brown: I think both are the best bet to be just "meh" in the NFL not named Mekhi Becton (who I think is an absolute bust possibility).
 

football karma

Happy in the pretense of knowledge
Joined
Jul 22, 2002
Posts
14,739
Reaction score
12,872
my priorities 60 days out (or so)

1. Young
2. Brown
3. Simmons
4. Okudah
5. Wills / Thomas / Wirfs / Becton
6. Lamb / Jeudy / Ruggs


I put the OTs (and WRs) in the same slots because the reality is I have no idea which one is better -- i.e. -- if on draft day the top 4 were off the board and they took Wirfs over Thomas, id be perfectly fine with that.

im intrigued by the Becton idea because you just don't get guys like that everyday with the upside being a dominant offensive lineman, but with commensurate risk of disappointment.
 

PACardsFan

ASFN Addict
Joined
May 15, 2002
Posts
9,991
Reaction score
11,401
Location
York, PA
my priorities 60 days out (or so)

1. Young
2. Brown
3. Simmons
4. Okudah
5. Wills / Thomas / Wirfs / Becton
6. Lamb / Jeudy / Ruggs


I put the OTs (and WRs) in the same slots because the reality is I have no idea which one is better -- i.e. -- if on draft day the top 4 were off the board and they took Wirfs over Thomas, id be perfectly fine with that.

im intrigued by the Becton idea because you just don't get guys like that everyday with the upside being a dominant offensive lineman, but with commensurate risk of disappointment.

Becton scares me. I wouldn't draft him unless we could trade into the mid teens to do so. And I'm pretty sure he'd be gone by then. He's either going to be great or will eat himself out of the NFL.
 

DVontel

ASFN Icon
Joined
Jan 28, 2015
Posts
12,357
Reaction score
21,037
I don’t even know why you guys are even still mentioning Becton & Thomas(not to mention, he doesn’t even fit our offense at all).

We’re not drafting a primary LT & I hate the thought of moving them to RT like idiots when there’s already primary RTs on the board.
 

Cardiac

ASFN Icon
Joined
Jul 21, 2002
Posts
11,977
Reaction score
3,077
I don’t even know why you guys are even still mentioning Becton & Thomas(not to mention, he doesn’t even fit our offense at all).

We’re not drafting a primary LT & I hate the thought of moving them to RT like idiots when there’s already primary RTs on the board.

I've heard enough experts say that although it may take time to adjust if you can play LT then you can play RT. If my RT can move over to LT in case of an injury to my LT then that's a good thing.
 

Chopper0080

2021 - Prove It
Joined
May 15, 2002
Posts
26,629
Reaction score
34,716
Location
Colorado
Even if we got only a 3rd at best for a small trade, I would love that then select CeeDee than a whole lot more than staying at #8 to get him.
Agreed. Trading back and taking a WR I can get on board with...staying at 8 and taking one makes me sick.
 

football karma

Happy in the pretense of knowledge
Joined
Jul 22, 2002
Posts
14,739
Reaction score
12,872
I don’t even know why you guys are even still mentioning Becton & Thomas(not to mention, he doesn’t even fit our offense at all).

We’re not drafting a primary LT & I hate the thought of moving them to RT like idiots when there’s already primary RTs on the board.

all of them played RT

Thomas his first year

Becton moved back and forth

Wills and Wirfs full time at RT
 

football karma

Happy in the pretense of knowledge
Joined
Jul 22, 2002
Posts
14,739
Reaction score
12,872
Agreed. Trading back and taking a WR I can get on board with...staying at 8 and taking one makes me sick.

chalk right now seems that two QBs and the four top defensive players go in the top 6.

that says that of the four OTs and three WRs -- 6 of them will be there at 8

I would have no problem with trading down to 11 / 12 / 13 or so and taking who is left
 

AZCrazy

ASFN Lifer
Joined
May 18, 2014
Posts
3,964
Reaction score
2,507
If Justin Herbert fell to 8, it would be our best possible haul to trade down a few spots, but not too many. There are about 11-12 elite talents in this draft.

Just gotta let FA play out first.

And Keim just isn't that deceptive. I don't think he feels the need for a lot of intrigue, just pick your guy. His most secretive draft was the only one when he didn't have to be, last year, with the top pick. With the slotting of contracts now, it's taken out the "is this guy going to be a total idiot in contract negotiations?" problem.
 

BritCard

ASFN Icon
Joined
Jan 10, 2020
Posts
21,031
Reaction score
37,086
Location
UK
If Justin Herbert fell to 8, it would be our best possible haul to trade down a few spots, but not too many. There are about 11-12 elite talents in this draft.

Just gotta let FA play out first.

And Keim just isn't that deceptive. I don't think he feels the need for a lot of intrigue, just pick your guy. His most secretive draft was the only one when he didn't have to be, last year, with the top pick. With the slotting of contracts now, it's taken out the "is this guy going to be a total idiot in contract negotiations?" problem.

If he makes it obvious he wants Lamb it let's another team move up and get him if they like him. He's a bit transparent.
 

Krangodnzr

Captain of Team Murray
Joined
Jul 21, 2002
Posts
34,280
Reaction score
30,225
Location
Orange County, CA
I don’t even know why you guys are even still mentioning Becton & Thomas(not to mention, he doesn’t even fit our offense at all).

We’re not drafting a primary LT & I hate the thought of moving them to RT like idiots when there’s already primary RTs on the board.

I think we arent drafting an OL at all if you read between the lines.
 

overseascardfan

ASFN Addict
Joined
Apr 9, 2005
Posts
8,807
Reaction score
2,094
Location
Phoenix
I don’t even know why you guys are even still mentioning Becton & Thomas(not to mention, he doesn’t even fit our offense at all).

We’re not drafting a primary LT & I hate the thought of moving them to RT like idiots when there’s already primary RTs on the board.
I respect you man, but agree to disagree. You are entitled to your opinion, don't throw shade at ours. We get it, you and others are not on the Thomas train, cool. But Thomas played RT his freshman year at UGA in he SEC so he was tested. Keim quoted what he did, he takes premium positions into account when drafting, he said LT which is what Thomas is. Thomas would push Humphries to continue improving because he knows Thomas could replace him if he pulls a David Johnson.
 

Krangodnzr

Captain of Team Murray
Joined
Jul 21, 2002
Posts
34,280
Reaction score
30,225
Location
Orange County, CA
Becton scares me. I wouldn't draft him unless we could trade into the mid teens to do so. And I'm pretty sure he'd be gone by then. He's either going to be great or will eat himself out of the NFL.

Why would he eat himself out of the NFL? He has been about the same weight most of his college career.

Watch how easily he moves in pass sets and how hard he is to get around. I think he has a much higher ceiling than the other linemen.
 

DVontel

ASFN Icon
Joined
Jan 28, 2015
Posts
12,357
Reaction score
21,037
I respect you man, but agree to disagree. You are entitled to your opinion, don't throw shade at ours. We get it, you and others are not on the Thomas train, cool. But Thomas played RT his freshman year at UGA in he SEC so he was tested. Keim quoted what he did, he takes premium positions into account when drafting, he said LT which is what Thomas is. Thomas would push Humphries to continue improving because he knows Thomas could replace him if he pulls a David Johnson.
I’m on the Thomas train. I think he’s going to be a great player if he goes to the right scheme. Him coming here or going to any other zone blocking scheme is just not smart drafting.


Out of him, Becton, Willis, & Wirfs, Thomas fits us the worst out of 3. He never played in a zone scheme at UGA & he is at his absolute best at LT. Sure, he played RT one year, but there’s a reason he got moved to LT right after. That’s because that’s where he shines the most. Why draft a player where his abilities would not reach their full potential? Not to mention, I don’t think he’s even a better overall OT than Willis.


With as many needs as we have, why draft a player to a position we signed an extension too just because he might not live up to it in a year or two?

I’m not trying to be a smart***, but it just makes no sense at all to draft Thomas for this team. Willis & Wirfs fits this team a lot more. Even Becton fits this team more due to athleticism & blocking system he just came from.

Like I said earlier, I like Thomas a lot, but not for this team because this offense would not cater to Thomas’ strengths like it would for Willis & Wirfs.
 

Cardiac

ASFN Icon
Joined
Jul 21, 2002
Posts
11,977
Reaction score
3,077
I think we arent drafting an OL at all if you read between the lines.

I have decided that we won't draft an OT in rd1 but believe that it's possible starting in rd2. The way Humps contract is structured is a sign that SK isn't completely sure he is the long term answer.

Add that Murray at best doesn't suck and we have like zero depth.
 

PACardsFan

ASFN Addict
Joined
May 15, 2002
Posts
9,991
Reaction score
11,401
Location
York, PA
Why would he eat himself out of the NFL? He has been about the same weight most of his college career.

Watch how easily he moves in pass sets and how hard he is to get around. I think he has a much higher ceiling than the other linemen.

You could be absolutely right. He's not just big, he's gargantuan. I heard yesterday that he measured in taller & heavier than we was at the end of college season. And, for a huge man, he has nice footwork. My fear is that sometimes when you give a big man big money, the end result isn't always pretty. Some people last year thought Murray was a risky move. I never doubted he'd be very good. Maybe Becton will be great & worth the risk. Much will depend on the kid's attitude & work ethic. Let's see how he's vetted.
 

Mainstreet

Cruisin' Mainstreet
Supporting Member
Joined
Oct 19, 2003
Posts
112,537
Reaction score
51,772
It seems like the Cardinals are sniffing a trade down in the draft if the opportunity arises.

I'm hoping all this receiver talk early in the draft (#8) is just that. I'd like for the Cardinals go offensive tackle or defensive tackle if they stay put.
 

Staff online

Forum statistics

Threads
534,799
Posts
5,246,447
Members
6,273
Latest member
sarahmoose
Top