Keim: Just Win 6 Games

Timm Rosenbach

Bye Bye DJ
Joined
Sep 11, 2005
Posts
6,488
Reaction score
4,322
Location
Tucson
A remarkably tumultuous and questionable offseason. Fans like us are over-thinking this. If Keim doesn’t win 6 games, he needs to be sent packing. I am not wowed by these late offseason moves or pickups. Win 6 games or you are out. And this reflects on his CEO “Michael Bidwill.” As Nike once put it: “Just do it” . See you in September Steve
 

Solar7

Go Suns
Joined
May 18, 2002
Posts
10,973
Reaction score
11,581
Location
Las Vegas, NV
Realistically though, is that smart? We just went all-in with KK and Kyler. What GM worth their salt is going to want to come take over a team where he has no say over the coach or starting QB, for at least one, maybe 2-3 years?

Don't get me wrong, someone will take the job, but is that person going to be better?

We really painted ourselves into a corner here, and I think we have to give Keim and KK two years to sort things out.
 

slanidrac16

ASFN Icon
Supporting Member
Joined
Jul 11, 2002
Posts
15,002
Reaction score
14,417
Location
Plainfield, Il.
A lot has to do with the overall appearance of this team. Last year just about every game was a disaster.

I think 6 games is setting the bar a bit low but if we are losing close competitive games which we can build on and add to with another draft and a bunch of free agency money I think keim’s job is safe.
 

BACH

Superbowl, Homeboy!
Joined
May 14, 2002
Posts
5,663
Reaction score
796
Location
A rotten place...
I’m not Putting a number on it.

This team is Young and introducing entirely New systems on both side of the Ball. I want to see progress.

The question is how competitive the team is in the 2nd Half of the season. Show that this team Can compete and I do not Care If it’s 5,6 Or Whatever amount of wins. If there is an abundance of close losses I Could live with 4 wins because it would likely mean a top 3 selection
 

Cardsfaninlouky

ASFN Lifer
Joined
Jan 10, 2019
Posts
4,424
Reaction score
5,819
Location
Louisville
A lot has to do with the overall appearance of this team. Last year just about every game was a disaster.

I think 6 games is setting the bar a bit low but if we are losing close competitive games which we can build on and add to with another draft and a bunch of free agency money I think keim’s job is safe.
Winning 6 games while 4 came down to a play or two from winning I will take, that shows improvement & is way better than last season. I'm hoping for 8-8 at the very least with a chance for more.
 

JeffGollin

ASFN Icon
Joined
May 14, 2002
Posts
20,472
Reaction score
3,056
Location
Holmdel, NJ
Look thru the windshield and not thru your rear view mirror if you want to avoid winding up in a ditch.

At every key point in a pro football team's annual cycle comes the question - "Will the proposed mgt or personnel change help the team the most?"

Do we automatically make a change if we only go 6 & 10?

Probably, but what other options are available? How much will each improve the team?

Suppose the team won its first 6 games, before suffering a spate of injuries which forced them to lose their next 10 games by an average of 1 point? Would you automatically pull the trigger on Keim?

I'd want to know what the projected outcomes are before I automatically dumped Keim.
 

HGC

All Star
Joined
Mar 21, 2017
Posts
953
Reaction score
1,046
Location
Chandler
Winning 6 games while 4 came down to a play or two from winning I will take, that shows improvement & is way better than last season. I'm hoping for 8-8 at the very least with a chance for more.

8-8 at the very least is extremely optimistic. The NFC West is a very tough division with with outstanding defensive coordinators and coaches who have proven track records of success on the biggest stage.
As much as I want to share in your optimism for this team I have serious doubts about Kingsbury’s offense transitioning to the NFL and being as effective as it was in the BIG12.
Hope I’m wrong.
 

Solar7

Go Suns
Joined
May 18, 2002
Posts
10,973
Reaction score
11,581
Location
Las Vegas, NV
8-8 at the very least is extremely optimistic. The NFC West is a very tough division with with outstanding defensive coordinators and coaches who have proven track records of success on the biggest stage.
As much as I want to share in your optimism for this team I have serious doubts about Kingsbury’s offense transitioning to the NFL and being as effective as it was in the BIG12.
Hope I’m wrong.
Agreed. 6 wins would have me shocked. 8-8 would get a ticker-tape parade.
 

Brak

ASFN Lifer
Joined
Jul 6, 2009
Posts
2,685
Reaction score
2,587
Bill Walsh won 2 games his first year, 6 his second, Super Bowl champs his 3rd. Keim gets another year almost no matter what happens this year IMHO. After NEXT year, we'll have a much better idea where this ship is headed, and whether or not this year's moves are panning out.
 

slanidrac16

ASFN Icon
Supporting Member
Joined
Jul 11, 2002
Posts
15,002
Reaction score
14,417
Location
Plainfield, Il.
One thing this team had going into this season was a decent core of players.

Baker, Peterson, Jones, DJ, Fitz and we were able to add Hicks, Suggs, Alford, Reed, Philon and several o-linemen. We’re not a team totally depleted of talent.

We had what appears to be a pretty good draft and we still have first pick off the waiver wire.

Our biggest question is how the offense will come together. Realistically we shouldn’t expect it the explode on the scene. I think we will have as many glowing moments as growing moments. It all adds up to about an 8-8 season, give or take a game.
 

Solar7

Go Suns
Joined
May 18, 2002
Posts
10,973
Reaction score
11,581
Location
Las Vegas, NV
One thing this team had going into this season was a decent core of players.

Baker, Peterson, Jones, DJ, Fitz and we were able to add Hicks, Suggs, Alford, Reed, Philon and several o-linemen. We’re not a team totally depleted of talent.

We had what appears to be a pretty good draft and we still have first pick off the waiver wire.

Our biggest question is how the offense will come together. Realistically we shouldn’t expect it the explode on the scene. I think we will have as many glowing moments as growing moments. It all adds up to about an 8-8 season, give or take a game.

I don't know... to me, that's a lot of optimism for players with question marks around age, availability with suspension, and ultimately, a ton of rookie needs where we're really going to have to take some bumps and bruises until things come together. I'm worried about the defense gelling, things holding up in the back with Pat P out, and then we get into the tough meat of the season when things should be making sense to the team.

I'm hoping for the best, but still can't see us coming away with wins in most scenarios. It's gonna be rough.
 

slanidrac16

ASFN Icon
Supporting Member
Joined
Jul 11, 2002
Posts
15,002
Reaction score
14,417
Location
Plainfield, Il.
I don't know... to me, that's a lot of optimism for players with question marks around age, availability with suspension, and ultimately, a ton of rookie needs where we're really going to have to take some bumps and bruises until things come together. I'm worried about the defense gelling, things holding up in the back with Pat P out, and then we get into the tough meat of the season when things should be making sense to the team.

I'm hoping for the best, but still can't see us coming away with wins in most scenarios. It's gonna be rough.
I can understand you concerns. My biggest concern is the o- line and how quickly the rookie wr’s can mature.
 

PACardsFan

ASFN Addict
Joined
May 15, 2002
Posts
9,991
Reaction score
11,401
Location
York, PA
The only way Keim gets fired is if he gets arrested again or we have a season where we are "unwatchable" again. The chances of reproducing an offense like last year is .000000001%. If we're exciting, but losing close games, Bidwill will understand that we may still be a few more players away. I have much higher expectations, but injuries can destroy the best of expectations.
 

Finito

ASFN Icon
Joined
Oct 23, 2005
Posts
20,906
Reaction score
13,586
He built us into contenders once with a veteran team now those guys are gone he’s earned the right to get a chance to rebuild the team.

You know what good franchises don’t do? Fire everybody the second you have a bad season.
 

Solar7

Go Suns
Joined
May 18, 2002
Posts
10,973
Reaction score
11,581
Location
Las Vegas, NV
He built us into contenders once with a veteran team now those guys are gone he’s earned the right to get a chance to rebuild the team.

You know what good franchises don’t do? Fire everybody the second you have a bad season.
You know what good franchises don't do? Go 5+ years straight without resigning a single one of their first round picks.
 

kerouac9

Klowned by Keim
Joined
Feb 14, 2003
Posts
36,515
Reaction score
25,959
Location
Gilbert, AZ
He built us into contenders once with a veteran team now those guys are gone he’s earned the right to get a chance to rebuild the team.

You know what good franchises don’t do? Fire everybody the second you have a bad season.

It's shocking that we've somehow erased the entire 2018 season. This is exactly what people were saying last year.

If it's another debacle with a Top 3 pick, Keim should absolutely be fired.
 

Brian in Mesa

Advocatus Diaboli
Super Moderator
Moderator
Supporting Member
Joined
May 13, 2002
Posts
70,409
Reaction score
20,885
Location
The Dark Side
It's laughable to think of Keim being fired. The guy got his second DUI (an extreme one) and jack squat happened. He's not going anywhere.
 

Finito

ASFN Icon
Joined
Oct 23, 2005
Posts
20,906
Reaction score
13,586
You know what good franchises don't do? Go 5+ years straight without resigning a single one of their first round picks.

Oh god.

We’ve been over the draft a million times and the it’s about 50% of all first round picks never even make it to there second contract give it a rest.

But but but... yeah we’ve gone over SK and his “success” rate in the draft and he’s pretty much middle of the pack. He’s not great but he damn sure ain’t bad either.

Facts.
 

Finito

ASFN Icon
Joined
Oct 23, 2005
Posts
20,906
Reaction score
13,586
It's shocking that we've somehow erased the entire 2018 season. This is exactly what people were saying last year.

If it's another debacle with a Top 3 pick, Keim should absolutely be fired.

Mistakes were made and they were corrected right? Now if we had gone into this season with Wilks still being the HC then something would be very wrong
 

TJ

Frank Kaminsky is my Hero.
Joined
Apr 2, 2005
Posts
33,724
Reaction score
18,570
Location
South Bay
He built us into contenders once with a veteran team now those guys are gone he’s earned the right to get a chance to rebuild the team.

You know what good franchises don’t do? Fire everybody the second you have a bad season.
Good franchises also have good drafts. Keim has yet to have a first-round pick sign a second long-term contract with the team, and he’s had 7 firsts!!

Keim should’ve been fired the minute Murray was drafted as it signaled just how f’d up this organization is
 

kerouac9

Klowned by Keim
Joined
Feb 14, 2003
Posts
36,515
Reaction score
25,959
Location
Gilbert, AZ
Mistakes were made and they were corrected right? Now if we had gone into this season with Wilks still being the HC then something would be very wrong
We’re they corrected? We won’t really know until next season. If Keim fired one terrible head coach and hired another (who happened to be a failed college head coach), then He deserves to be fired.
 

Solar7

Go Suns
Joined
May 18, 2002
Posts
10,973
Reaction score
11,581
Location
Las Vegas, NV
Oh god.

We’ve been over the draft a million times and the it’s about 50% of all first round picks never even make it to there second contract give it a rest.

But but but... yeah we’ve gone over SK and his “success” rate in the draft and he’s pretty much middle of the pack. He’s not great but he damn sure ain’t bad either.

Facts.
I've been an apologist for Keim in the past, but the honest truth of the matter is that we're lacking success stories from his drafts. If I read it correctly, David Johnson is the only remaining Keim draft pick on his second contract with the Cardinals. One. That's a pretty rough statistic. You don't win in the NFL by failing to develop talent, or picking wrong. DJ Humphries might be his next guy, based upon a cheap cost and lack of options, not success.

Mistakes were made and they were corrected right? Now if we had gone into this season with Wilks still being the HC then something would be very wrong
We replaced Wilks with a fired college coach from a mid-tier program. How is this "correcting" a mistake? This is a Hail Mary. I don't think Wilks should have remained, but I don't think Keim should have either, not with this decision.

We’re they corrected? We won’t really know until next season. If Keim fired one terrible head coach and hired another (who happened to be a failed college head coach), then He deserves to be fired.
Bingo. I want to be optimistic, deep down, but the real potential of this situation is that Keim got pulled over only to crash the car a little later.
 
  • Like
Reactions: HGC

CardsSunsDbacks

Not So Skeptical
Joined
Aug 26, 2012
Posts
9,898
Reaction score
6,107
I feel like people continue to underestimate the fluctuation of NFL standing. Teams go from bad to good and good to bad in just one season all the time in the NFL. This is in large part because whether you are considered a good or bad team you are likely playing a lot of close games that come down to a few plays in the 4th quarter.

A good example of this is last year's Cardinals. The team was an atrocious 3-13 and looked horrible on offense and pretty bad on defense. Yet they were only a handful of plays away from a 7-9 or 8-8 record last year. If you believe like I do that there will be improvement on both sides of the ball than you should believe that this years team should be more consistently competitive than last year's team and that should mean that we will be in enough close games to have a shot at 8-8 or maybe even better.

Obviously I am not expecting it as we have a lot of new things coming together, but I would not be shocked by a pretty big turnaround in the win/loss column.
 

Solar7

Go Suns
Joined
May 18, 2002
Posts
10,973
Reaction score
11,581
Location
Las Vegas, NV
I feel like people continue to underestimate the fluctuation of NFL standing. Teams go from bad to good and good to bad in just one season all the time in the NFL. This is in large part because whether you are considered a good or bad team you are likely playing a lot of close games that come down to a few plays in the 4th quarter.

A good example of this is last year's Cardinals. The team was an atrocious 3-13 and looked horrible on offense and pretty bad on defense. Yet they were only a handful of plays away from a 7-9 or 8-8 record last year. If you believe like I do that there will be improvement on both sides of the ball than you should believe that this years team should be more consistently competitive than last year's team and that should mean that we will be in enough close games to have a shot at 8-8 or maybe even better.

Obviously I am not expecting it as we have a lot of new things coming together, but I would not be shocked by a pretty big turnaround in the win/loss column.

Bolded. Therein lies the rub. I don't think there will be improvement on both sides of the ball. For different reasons than last year, but I don't see it. And that's the reason I think our record will still be hot garbage.
 

Staff online

Forum statistics

Threads
534,767
Posts
5,246,077
Members
6,273
Latest member
sarahmoose
Top