Nets/Suns Trade

[ColdPickleNachos]

So here is the deal on Harrison.

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That's a really nice situation for the Suns, and I think it adds to the argument of carrying 4 point guards even more.

Let's assume Warren is not being traded. In this instance, Ariza is your starting 4 and you have a system built around small ball. With limited minutes at the 3, it makes sense Warren will see a lot of his time at the 4 as well. Bender and/or Chriss are likely getting minutes at the 5 as well in order to get significant minutes.

A strong argument could be made that a 4th point guard has a better path to playing time over a third center. Hopefully, that 4th point guard is Okobo because the Suns are bringing in a point guard who can compete for starter minutes with Knight.

(cough) Ferrell (cough)

 

[Hoop Head]

I'm a little bummed to see Dudley go. He's a solid veteran leader but he doesn't fit. I'm not high on Williams being brought back either. If no other options are available it's not a bad plan but he'll likely be available if nothing else happens before training camp. No need to commit to him before then. Glad Reed's deal is now guaranteed, and Shaq is being kept also but not quite on a guaranteed deal at this point.

Here's an article on the trade and Reed and Harrison's roles being secured after the deal from 98.7 AZ Sports.

http://arizonasports.com/story/1604674/phoenix-suns-to-trade-jared-dudley-brooklyn-nets/

 

[ColdPickleNachos]

Here is some of the good news I was speculating about. The Suns have more than $2 million to work with.

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These would be my moves:

1. Sign Alan Williams for 1 year at $2.5 million.

2. Trade Troy Daniels for a second round pick. (I agree with others on this board that his shooting is valuable, but Reed and Bridges offer shooting and defense at the same position.)

3. Bring in Yogi Ferrell for 1 year at the $4.4 million exception.

Knight Ferrell Harrison Okobo
Booker Bridges Reed
Jackson Warren
Ariza Chriss Bender
Ayton Chandler Williams

Rotation:
Knight Ferrell
Booker Bridges
Jackson Warren
Ariza Warren
Ayton Chandler

Develop Chriss, Bender, and Okobo and give them chances throughout the season to prove themselves if they earn it.

Use Harrison and Reed as defensive energizers on days where that's needed and to push the starters in practice.

Williams is a great bench guy and a solid backup plan should Ayton or Chandler get injured for a significant amount of time.

 

[Hoop Head]

These would be my moves:

1. Sign Alan Williams for 1 year at $2.5 million.

2. Trade Troy Daniels for a second round pick. (I agree his shooting is valuable, but Reed and Bridges offer shooting and defense at the same position.)

3. Bring in Yogi Ferrell for 1 year at the $4.4 million exception.

Knight Ferrell Harrison Okobo
Booker Bridges Reed
Jackson Warren
Ariza Chriss Bender
Ayton Chandler Williams

Rotation:
Knight Ferrell
Booker Bridges
Jackson Warren
Ariza Warren
Ayton Chandler

Develop Chriss, Bender, and Okobo and give them chances throughout the season to prove themselves if they earn it.

Use Harrison and Reed as defensive energizers on days where that's needed and to push the starters in practice.

Williams is a great bench guy and a solid backup plan should Ayton or Chandler get injured for a significant amount of time.

I like your rotation but there is no reason to offer Williams more than a league minimum deal. That's his value now. If we're going above a minimum salary I'd prefer they try to get a big by trading Daniels. That would allow them more room to take back salary also. Combined with their existing cap space, they can trade Daniels for a player making about $6 million next season, Daniels salary is $3.2 million which can be added to our space which is projected around $2.5 million but could increase depending on Arthur's buyout. The Arizona Sports article I posted said we have about $3.2 million in cap space currently. That's what ESPN is reporting also, link.

That opens up a lot more options, Patrick Beverly or Milos Teladosic would be options in that range.There is no need to rush a signing either way though. Wait until all trades and higher than minimum salary deals are complete. Ferrell isn't a great option but he's probably the best PG that is available to sign outright.

 

[Mainstreet]

That's a really nice situation for the Suns, and I think it adds to the argument of carrying 4 point guards even more.

Let's assume Warren is not being traded. In this instance, Ariza is your starting 4 and you have a system built around small ball. With limited minutes at the 3, it makes sense Warren will see a lot of his time at the 4 as well. Bender and/or Chriss are likely getting minutes at the 5 as well in order to get significant minutes.

A strong argument could be made that a 4th point guard has a better path to playing time over a third center. Hopefully, that 4th point guard is Okobo because the Suns are bringing in a point guard who can compete for starter minutes with Knight.

(cough) Ferrell (cough)

It made sense all along the Suns needed to carry a 4th PG with questions about Knight, Okobo being a rookie and Harrison a bubble player.

Yogi is an interesting option... cough... cough.

 

[Mainstreet]

These would be my moves:

1. Sign Alan Williams for 1 year at $2.5 million.

2. Trade Troy Daniels for a second round pick. (I agree with others on this board that his shooting is valuable, but Reed and Bridges offer shooting and defense at the same position.)

3. Bring in Yogi Ferrell for 1 year at the $4.4 million exception.

Knight Ferrell Harrison Okobo
Booker Bridges Reed
Jackson Warren
Ariza Chriss Bender
Ayton Chandler Williams

Rotation:
Knight Ferrell
Booker Bridges
Jackson Warren
Ariza Warren
Ayton Chandler

Develop Chriss, Bender, and Okobo and give them chances throughout the season to prove themselves if they earn it.

Use Harrison and Reed as defensive energizers on days where that's needed and to push the starters in practice.

Williams is a great bench guy and a solid backup plan should Ayton or Chandler get injured for a significant amount of time.

I still want Harrell as 1a. Williams would be 1b.

 

[ColdPickleNachos]

I like your rotation but there is no reason to offer Williams more than a league minimum deal. That's his value now. If we're going above a minimum salary I'd prefer they try to get a big by trading Daniels. That would allow them more room to take back salary also. Combined with their existing cap space, they can trade Daniels for a player making about $6 million next season, Daniels salary is $3.2 million which can be added to our space which is projected around $2.5 million but could increase depending on Arthur's buyout. The Arizona Sports article I posted said we have about $3.2 million in cap space currently. That's what ESPN is reporting also, link.

That opens up a lot more options, Patrick Beverly or Milos Teladosic would be options in that range.There is no need to rush a signing either way though. Wait until all trades and higher than minimum salary deals are complete. Ferrell isn't a great option but he's probably the best PG that is available to sign outright.

Your point on trading Daniels makes a lot of sense, but I actually really like Yogi as a one year option.

I'm far from a cap expert, so if anyone knows more than I do, please intervene...But in order to use the $4.4 million exception, wouldn't the Suns first have to be over the cap? That was my thought process for offering Williams or whomever a one year deal slightly above the minimum; it would allow the Suns to use that exception for Ferrell. But I admit I could be off in my thinking given my lack of knowledge on the intricacies of the cap.

 

[ColdPickleNachos]

I still want Harrell as 1a. Williams would be 1b.

Harrell is restricted though, which means I doubt the Clippers let him go. I think he's probably a superior player, but considering he'd be brought in as a second stringer at best (and likely a third stringer) I'd rather have the guy I know is a positive locker room influence.

 

[Hoop Head]

Your point on trading Daniels makes a lot of sense, but I actually really like Yogi as a one year option.

I'm far from a cap expert, so if anyone knows more than I do, please intervene...But in order to use the $4.4 million exception, wouldn't the Suns first have to be over the cap? That was my thought process for offering Williams or whomever a one year deal slightly above the minimum; it would allow the Suns to use that exception for Ferrell. But I admit I could be off in my thinking given my lack of knowledge on the intricacies of the cap.

No, the $4.4 million exception is the non-tax payer room exception. By room they mean space under the salary cap but not quite enough to make a larger offer. I believe the way it works is having say $3 million in cap space like the Suns do, they can actually offer up to $4.4 million in a signing which would take them just over the cap but that would use up all of their space also. It would be better to use the room we have to sign someone and use the exception then when we have very minimal space under the cap available. If we were over the cap we'd have a bigger mid-level exception, which is $8.4 million this year.

Look down at the various mid-level exceptions on here, we have the room mid-level exception and it explains how it works.

http://www.cbafaq.com/salarycap.htm#Q25

 

[SirStefan32]

Sad to see JYD go, but there was just no room for him. I hope he comes back in some capacity after he retires.

 

[Mainstreet]

Harrell is restricted though, which means I doubt the Clippers let him go. I think he's probably a superior player, but considering he'd be brought in as a second stringer at best (and likely a third stringer) I'd rather have the guy I know is a positive locker room influence.

For some reason I was thinking Harrell was unrestricted. What I like about Harrell is can play two positions PF and center.

The worst fear is he might devour an opponent.

 

[ColdPickleNachos]

No, the $4.4 million exception is the non-tax payer room exception. By room they mean space under the salary cap but not quite enough to make a larger offer. I believe the way it works is having say $3 million in cap space like the Suns do, they can actually offer up to $4.4 million in a signing which would take them just over the cap but that would use up all of their space also. It would be better to use the room we have to sign someone and use the exception then when we have very minimal space under the cap available. If we were over the cap we'd have a bigger mid-level exception, which is $8.4 million this year.

Look down at the various mid-level exceptions on here, we have the room mid-level exception and it explains how it works.

http://www.cbafaq.com/salarycap.htm#Q25

Fantastic! Thanks for the info.

 

[Mainstreet]

Sad to see JYD go, but there was just no room for him. I hope he comes back in some capacity after he retires.

I like Dudley but the Suns vastly overpaid him... 3 years at 30 million. I'm disappointed he wouldn't agree to a buyout.

 

[Dan H]

I thought Yogi re-signed with the Mavs?

 

[Mainstreet]

I thought Yogi re-signed with the Mavs?

This is what I heard earlier but it apparently changed.

https://www.cbssports.com/nba/news/...-latest-free-agent-to-spurn-dallas-mavericks/

 

[Dan H]

Interesting. I've always liked him.

 

[Mainstreet]

Interesting. I've always liked him.

If you like Ferrell the Suns might be a target.

 

[Ouchie-Z-Clown]

Forget sauce now with Holmes trade

 

[ColdPickleNachos]

Dudley's still putting in work as a Suns mentor!

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[Hoop Head]

Dudley released a statement thanking Sarver, the fans, and the team. Says Phoenix is his home.

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Glad to see someone speak positive on their way out for a change. Dudley is a good dude, IMO.

 

[Hoop Head]

Booker thanks Dudley on Twitter also. Credits him as a valuable mentor who helped teach him a lot.

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[Hoop Head]

ArizonaSports.com: Suns trade Jared Dudley, 2021 second-round pick to Nets for Darrell Arthur, according to ESPN's Adrian Wojnarowski.

Is it possible you can edit the title of this thread to "Darrell Arthur traded for Jared Dudley" or switch it around, "Dudley traded for Darrell Arthur", it's mainly Dudley talk anyways and since he was the player traded out, it might keep someone from starting a Dudley thread on their own.

 

[Superbone]

Is it possible you can edit the title of this thread to "Darrell Arthur traded for Jared Dudley" or switch it around, "Dudley traded for Darrell Arthur", it's mainly Dudley talk anyways and since he was the player traded out, it might keep someone from starting a Dudley thread on their own.

Not only that but we aren't keeping Arthur.

 

[Hoop Head]

Dudley responded to Alan Williams tweet about thanking him for his time in Phoenix. Williams said as a Suns fan first, he appreciates what Dudley did here and that Phoenix will always welcome him.

All of the appreciation for Dudley is good to see. I wonder how much a guy like Chandler would get. I don't think people would be as vocal about supporting him. I know their careers are quite different but both have/had similar roles the last few years with the Suns. I think the appreciation that is being shown to Dudley helps support the idea that he was a quality veteran leader for our young guys and how much of a role they play on the team that we, as fans, don't ever really see.

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[Hoop Head]

This is one of the reasons I like Dudley, enough to parrot his tweets here for the past 2 days. They're related to the Suns and the offseason is slow, so whatever. Anyways, a fan site asked if he should be in the Ring of Honor and he chimed in saying no. Not many players are that honest about what they have to offer, or what they're not able to do.

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