I will be totally cool with a rebuild

[Jetstream Green]

Or a 'retool' if it makes one feel better but this draft made complete sense with restocking for the season after. I dig our new QB selection, a strong number two WR prospect, a potential upgrade at center which should be a cornerstone for years. I do not need it all now, but we have enough to get started and make me happy with no pressure for winning now... and who knows with the current league we just might win

 

[Krangodnzr]

I see things like Carson Palmer does. This team does NOT need a rebuild. There are enough good pieces under contract to win in the near future. Once Bradford is off the books and Rosen is the starter, the Cardinals will have some money to spend.

 

[Garthshort]

I agree with Krang.

 

[Jetstream Green]

I see things like Carson Palmer does. This team does NOT need a rebuild. There are enough good pieces under contract to win in the near future. Once Bradford is off the books and Rosen is the starter, the Cardinals will have some money to spend.

Well, I mean I am totally alright with adding a deck to the backyard and not rebuilding the whole house... and maybe a spare room and a hot tub lol

 

[NJCardFan]

The purpose of the draft is to retool. The NFL isn't the NBA with only 2 rounds of a draft which makes 'tanking' a few seasons in the NBA easier. There are 7 rounds and a draft is supposed to help teams fill gaps left by free agency, retirements, etc. Look at New England. They have been on top for 18 years now. Pittsburgh the same thing. They've had 1 losing season this century. The trick is knowing who to draft and how to develop them. That's the real science.

 

[Solar7]

I'm comfortable in knowing that this team has some significant moves to make, and we might not see how the real plan develops until next year. All I want to see is a relatively competitive team by the time we get to season's end, and hopefully have a little hope that Rosen is going to be a player instead of an unknown.

 

[Krangodnzr]

I think one thing that we haven't discussed much, is that this fanbase was really down after last season, and the team finished 8-8! 15 years ago last year would've been cause for celebration. This team has come a long way.

I look at whats going on as a retool, because the core of the team was good enough to go 8-8. If we still had Arians I would predict winning record with this squad because the additions are better than the players they replaced.

 

[Finito]

The purpose of the draft is to retool. The NFL isn't the NBA with only 2 rounds of a draft which makes 'tanking' a few seasons in the NBA easier. There are 7 rounds and a draft is supposed to help teams fill gaps left by free agency, retirements, etc. Look at New England. They have been on top for 18 years now. Pittsburgh the same thing. They've had 1 losing season this century. The trick is knowing who to draft and how to develop them. That's the real science.

New England has a really really bad track record in the draft. "Any other GM would have been fired but BRADY covers up a lot of mistakes"- Todd McShay on the ESPN draft podcast.

But whatever

 

[Mainstreet]

The trouble with the rebuild strategy it can last forever. I do not want to go down this road with the Cardinals. Fans get tired of losing.

Retooling on the go is fine. Hopefully the Cardinals have their QBOTF.

 

[GuernseyCard]

Given that we have hundreds of in and out in the past 5 years, the retooling has been constant..

 

[NJCardFan]

New England has a really really bad track record in the draft. "Any other GM would have been fired but BRADY covers up a lot of mistakes"- Todd McShay on the ESPN draft podcast.

But whatever

Tom Brady didn't play in 2008 and they still won 11 games so it all isn't Brady. And Brady doesn't play defense and you simply cannot dismiss out of hand that New England has a penchant for choosing the right player for their system. You don't have almost 20 years of total domination based solely on 1 player.

 

[pinetopred]

Patriots draft really good in 1st round. JMO the best part of their system is alot of guys can fit into the system that other teams don't even have on their radar specific skill sets and they figure a way to use them. But Brady makes the top statement possible, for most of these years.

 

[kerouac9]

I think one thing that we haven't discussed much, is that this fanbase was really down after last season, and the team finished 8-8! 15 years ago last year would've been cause for celebration. This team has come a long way.

I look at whats going on as a retool, because the core of the team was good enough to go 8-8. If we still had Arians I would predict winning record with this squad because the additions are better than the players they replaced.

Really? Who do we have who's better than Karlos Dansby, Tramon Williams, and Tyrann Mathieu?

We had healthy Palmer and David Johnson playing unconscious and still went 7-8-1 with San Francisco and St. Louis being terrible. I think we could be better this season and be 6-10 just based on improvement in the division and some regression from the defense. I also think that people aren't going to understand the value that Bruce Arians added as a head coach.

 

[Brian in Mesa]

We get our top RB back (one of the top in the entire NFL before his injury). We replace a retiring aged veteran who was drafted number one overall with a younger veteran who was drafted number one overall and is serviceable as long as he stays upright. We add pieces all over the roster so there will be a learning curve, but I don't really see a huge drop-off from 8-8 to 4-12 like the experts have been predicting. It will be interesting to say the least.

 

[legend]

New England is in a pathetic division. Bills, Jets Dolphins . . makes for an easy path to the playoffs - every year.

 

[Cardiac]

Really? Who do we have who's better than Karlos Dansby, Tramon Williams, and Tyrann Mathieu?

We had healthy Palmer and David Johnson playing unconscious and still went 7-8-1 with San Francisco and St. Louis being terrible. I think we could be better this season and be 6-10 just based on improvement in the division and some regression from the defense. I also think that people aren't going to understand the value that Bruce Arians added as a head coach.

I would say that Budda Baker is an upgrade over Honey Badger. Los will be missed leadership wise but there is a reason he is no longer playing football. I agree about Tramon Williams but getting David back is a huge plus.

I also agree that BA was an outstanding HC but I'm hoping Wilks is as good as he sounds and that he has upgraded the assistant coaches, at least ST's will be better.

I'm still concerned about the Oline and if Diche doesn't play up to his talents then the Dline will be decent to okay.

 

[Finito]

Tom Brady didn't play in 2008 and they still won 11 games so it all isn't Brady. And Brady doesn't play defense and you simply cannot dismiss out of hand that New England has a penchant for choosing the right player for their system. You don't have almost 20 years of total domination based solely on 1 player.

Yes yes yes I know it's BB the players are just pawns. We've been over this

 

[kerouac9]

I would say that Budda Baker is an upgrade over Honey Badger. Los will be missed leadership wise but there is a reason he is no longer playing football. I agree about Tramon Williams but getting David back is a huge plus.

I also agree that BA was an outstanding HC but I'm hoping Wilks is as good as he sounds and that he has upgraded the assistant coaches, at least ST's will be better.

I'm still concerned about the Oline and if Diche doesn't play up to his talents then the Dline will be decent to okay.

And who is the upgrade at FS/replaces Kerry Rhodes?

 

[Cheesebeef]

And who is the upgrade at FS/replaces Kerry Rhodes?

Kerry Rhodes?

 

[Cardsmasochist]

New England has a really really bad track record in the draft. "Any other GM would have been fired but BRADY covers up a lot of mistakes"- Todd McShay on the ESPN draft podcast.

But whatever

Wow. I’m surprised that McShay’s comment did get more publicity. Interesting.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

[kerouac9]

Kerry Rhodes?

Tyvon Branch.

 

[MadCardDisease]

I also think that people aren't going to understand the value that Bruce Arians added as a head coach.

I was the biggest BA supporter on this board but even I was starting to grow impatient with his stick the last couple of years. IMO BA's stubborn refusal to get rid of his buddy Amos Jones killed this teams chances the last couple of years. Also I felt that BA kind of lost this team after the "All or Nothing" season. I believe that he became too chummy with many of the veterans. His training camps had become Camp Cupcake and it showed early in the season the last couple of years.

I still think that BA was one of the best HC in Cardinals history but I think he made the right decision to retire when he did. This is why I was all for hiring Wilks in that I think this team needed more discipline and a fresh start.

 

[kerouac9]

I was the biggest BA supporter on this board but even I was starting to grow impatient with his stick the last couple of years. IMO BA's stubborn refusal to get rid of his buddy Amos Jones killed this teams chances the last couple of years. Also I felt that BA kind of lost this team after the "All or Nothing" season. I believe that he became too chummy with many of the veterans. His training camps had become Camp Cupcake and it showed early in the season the last couple of years.

I still think that BA was one of the best HC in Cardinals history but I think he made the right decision to retire when he did. This is why I was all for hiring Wilks in that I think this team needed more discipline and a fresh start.

His record in one-score games was no accident. Maybe it was a result of the Wyatt Earp effect, but it was statistically unusual. It's unclear what if any strategic advantage Wilks can bring.

 

[Chopper0080]

So, Arians had an obvious vet preference. That is now gone.

Arians coached up the offense which enabled us to win games we probably should not have. That is now gone.

Arians did not focus as much on defense or special teams .

Now we have Wilks

Wilks has seemed to bring in a group of coaches who prefer to teach and coach up players (from my experience, that is not uncommon for defense minded coaches)

Wilks will likely rely on a high percentage, control offense. This will put pressure on his defense to keep games close.

We don't know how much focus Wilks will put on offense and special teams.

In terms of what our current operation looks like, it isn't a rebuild. You don't keep valuable veteran assets if you are "rebuilding". We are retooling, and building around a core group of players. These players are Chandler Jones, Patrick Peterson, Justin Pugh, David Johnson, and Larry Fitzgerald. We are trying to get the most out of those players as they are established producers and have limited years left in their prime.

Now, we also have a group of players that are young-ish but our current staff did not draft, and are not beholden to yet. Those players are Ricky Seals-Jones, DJ Humphries, Robert Nkemdiche, Olson Pierre, Markus Golden, Deone Bucannon, Haason Reddick, and Budda Baker. These players are not part of that core group because we have nothing to go off of in terms of scheme fit, and how the position is valued by the coach. An example of this is Markus Golden. Golden could be a 9 sack guy in this scheme and not be retained because Wilks likes to rotate his DEs. You don't pay a guy 9 mil per year to play 39% of snaps. Budda Baker may play lights out and never get a second contract from Arizona because Wilks does value paying the S position. Haason Reddick mat stick around despite being average because Wilks puts more value in LBs who can run. We just don't know.

What we do know is this. Josh Rosen, Christian Kirk, Mason Cole, Chase Edmunds, and Chris Campbell will be given every chance to stick on this roster. What can we deduce from this? Timing and rhythm based passing game. Use of the RB in the passing game. Physical and durable offensive linemen, and possibly a value on position versatility. Length at CB on the outside.

 

[Krangodnzr]

Really? Who do we have who's better than Karlos Dansby, Tramon Williams, and Tyrann Mathieu?

We had healthy Palmer and David Johnson playing unconscious and still went 7-8-1 with San Francisco and St. Louis being terrible. I think we could be better this season and be 6-10 just based on improvement in the division and some regression from the defense. I also think that people aren't going to understand the value that Bruce Arians added as a head coach.

Getting Markus Golden back, another year of development for Reddick, Baker, and Pierre should keep the defense on track. I'm hoping that Wilks can get more out of Brandon Williams or another #2 CB. I'm excited about Chris Campbell too.

I think the offense should be better with a more stable offensive line and David Johnson back. Wilks from everyone who has been around him Carolina is a pretty good coach. I'm hoping that this staff will be better at player development, especially on defense and the offensive line.

That would be a criticism I have of the Arians staff: while Arians certainly called a good offensive game for the most part, players didn't seem to get a whole lot better under his tutelage. I remember him saying early in his stint that coaches can't do a whole lot of one on one coaching in the NFL. From what I've seen, that isn't quite true, so teams tend to better at developing talent. We saw a few olinemen leave the Cardinals and remark how much more technique they learned with their new team (Cole Toner definitely commented on that).

I think the Cardinals hover between 6-10 and 9-7 this year. The Seahawks have purged a lot of that talent that made that defense good, they should fall down a few notches. I would be surprised in the 9ers don't improve a whole lot more either, not too impressed with their moves outside of trading for Garrapolo.

So I'm not fully disagreeing with the notion that the team might be better but have a worse record, but I can also see a path to the team having a better record this year. I'm definitely excited about this teams future after this draft class, I think it's one of the better Keim classes on paper.