Nash is not the same, its the ball

nowagimp · November 21st, 2006, 08:56 AM

I have been watching steve Nash pretty closely early this season and I have some observations that may mean the suns are in trouble. I am not looking at the win last night as much as much as the teams function. Everyones passes are sloppy on the perimeter, players are reaching to haul in an off target pass and by the time they get control the defender is already there. Some of this is expected, but when Nashs passes are off target this often, something is wrong, he's the best in the game.

Steves handles are not what they were last year. When Nash dribbles in traffic, he struggles to change the height of the dribble rapidly to evade swipes at the ball. He goes from a high to a low dribble and loses control of the ball at times. This was very rare last year. This he did 2-3 times last night vs the warriors. Why is this important you ask? Because Nash uses this to maintain his dribble as he moves through traffic in the lane, always looking for the pass. Nashs ability to keep the dribble in traffic is critical to his impact as a player.

Where is the famous Steve Nash wrap around pass? Its gone, thats where, he cant do it anymore because the tactile feel of the ball has changed. A grippy ball is good for guys who palm the ball to dunk, or pass, or shoot off the dribble. Nash is a tactile ball handler using subtle spins and touch on the ball, he never palms the ball to control it. He spins it in his hands to enhance his touch. He says "the NBA took away his best weapon, the leather ball". Some of you will say "he's a complainer, just get used to it". You obviously do not know steve Nash the player, a guy who doesnt use excuses, takes the blame for his teams performance, deflects it from others. This is a guy who had such great touch on the leather ball that he could dribble it 6" off the ground or 3 feet off in a moments notice, now he uncharacteristically loses control with the unpredictable bounce and overly grippy touch of the new ball. This plastic composite ball is horrible for tactile dribblers. Curly Neal of globe trotters fame could never do his low dribble with this ball. Guys who pound the dribble like AI, Baron Davis, Arenas, Lebron will be fine with the new ball, as will speed athletes like Tony Parker, Monta Ellis and Leo Barbosa. The finesse ball handlers will not be able to adjust to this ball. Nash can still shoot lights out, he's still the smartest PG in the game, but the ball change has profoundly changed the way Nash plays basketball. By the way, after 200+ games, 11 teams are still shooting lower 3pt percentage than the worst team in the NBA last year(nuggets) from 3pt range. The suns are at last years NBA average, 36%. Steve Nash, the 2 time MVP running the games most exciting offense has been hamstrung with the new ball. Sly fly you may be right that Nash, at times, is less effective this year(than last), and now I think I know why. Others will have to adjust to take up the slack on the suns, but the thing that pisses me off is that one of the games great PG's has been impacted in this way by a David Stern marketing stunt.

HooverDam · November 21st, 2006, 09:12 AM

God I hope they Suns go on a 10 game win streak so all this sillyness goes away.

mribnik · November 21st, 2006, 09:21 AM

I'm sure the players are over the ball by now. The ball is fine. Nash had 19 points and 15 assists yesterday. Nope, he's not the same. He's shooting about the same percentage, scoring the same and getting just as many assists. We have a lot of new players and are playing somewhat of a different style than last year (more like two years ago).

Chaz · November 21st, 2006, 09:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mribnik

I'm sure the players are over the ball by now. The ball is fine. Nash had 19 points and 15 assists yesterday. Nope, he's not the same. He's shooting about the same percentage, scoring the same and getting just as many assists. We have a lot of new players and are playing somewhat of a different style than last year (more like two years ago).

Seems like more turnovers though.

I wonder if that is the case. I don't have the inclination to look it up.

I think nowagimp is correct in his premise but judging from his stat line Nash seems to be adjusting OK.

In any event I am not sure what we can do about it now except complain some more.

mribnik · November 21st, 2006, 09:36 AM

There are more turnovers, but we've got a bunch of new players too. I don't think 10 games is enough to be able to say that the ball is causing them.

cheesebeef · November 21st, 2006, 09:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SirChaz

Seems like more turnovers though.

I wonder if that is the case. I don't have the inclination to look it up.

I think nowagimp is correct in his premise but judging from his stat line Nash seems to be adjusting OK.

In any event I am not sure what we can do about it now except complain some more.

he does have more turnovers... .1 per game... and his shooting percentage is higher both in 2s and 3s, as are his assts.

I really think all the complaining about the bal is much ado about nothing. We're still scoring 108 ppg, our three best three point shooters are still shooting the hell out of the ball, but our overall 3 point shooting is down because they are the ONLY 3 point shooters on the team, as opposed to last year when we had another shooter in either House or TT, or JR at the beginning of the season. And this doesn't even take into account Marion's been shooting 6 per/game which is dumbing down the percentage.

az1965 · November 21st, 2006, 10:08 AM

The entire ball change thing was a plan to not give Nash a crack at the MVP 3rd straight year...

dreamcastrocks · November 21st, 2006, 10:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by az1965

The entire ball change thing was a plan to not give Nash a crack at the MVP 3rd straight year...

No matter what happens this year, (unless Nash averaged a triple double) he would not get the award anyway.

az1965 · November 21st, 2006, 10:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dreamcastrocks

No matter what happens this year, (unless Nash averaged a triple double) he would not get the award anyway.

I was just kidding...

dreamcastrocks · November 21st, 2006, 10:33 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by az1965

I was just kidding...

I know, but I didn't at the same time. Nash is having an even better year than last year, but there is no way that he gets more than a few votes.

msdundee · November 21st, 2006, 10:38 AM

It was hard not to notice Nash wasn't quite Nash last night early on. In the first half there were several times he just looked to be running and moving differently and I wondered if he was really over the back spasm problems, especially since up until yesterday a.m. he was listed as 'questionable' to play. But it did seem that he loosened up a lot during the course of the game so maybe it was just the long layoff, 8-9 days or whatever it was.

nowagimp · November 21st, 2006, 10:53 AM

I find it interesting how fans look at stats with such confidence to determined that nothing has changed. The 3 point shooting stats are still too new, and I dont expect that to be the biggest problem anyway. The suns passes to each other are way off target, and I'm not talking about the new guys, I'm talking Diaw, Bell, Leo, Nash, Marion, KT who played very well with each other last year. Effective passing on the perimeter is crisp and allows for a quick shot, not struggling to haul in an off target pass allowing the defense to recover in time to contest the shot. The suns offense is about open shots and there do seem to be fewer open shots this year, in spite of the post presence of Amare, go figure. I just look at the way Nash handles the ball, and have for the last 3 years. Did you ever take the ball from a high(3' to 1') to a low dribble in one bounce? Ever try that with an outdoor ball? Did you ever notice in the past how Nash did this with ease in traffic to weave his way through the D? Interesting that no-one so far has actually recognized that change, just a retort of stats.

How does the pick in roll in traffic look this year? If other teams have adjusted to the pick and roll, why havent perimeter shots opened up? The suns have gone from 12.8 TO/game last year to 15.9 this year. Thats not one turnover a game cheese, its 3, but at least you noticed TO's were up. I'll bet TO's are up all across the NBA, but I guess no one is compiling that stat. Yeah, there are new pieces, but the suns opponents went also from 14.2 to 16.2 TO's this year. Does that means the suns defense is forcing more turnovers(ha ha thats funny). Yeah its still early, but I'll bet that when all is said and done turnovers in the NBA will be recognized as a problem this year and then will be brought down by just being more conservative with the ball. So, if TO's are stabilized does that mean nothing has changed if the suns become more conservative with the ball to limit TO's? Of course the suns will lose out by being forced to be more conservative with the ball to counter the high turnover rate, as they thrive on rapid ball movement and many passes. Frankly, if the NBA turns toward a more plodding game to adjust, I wont be watching the return of "uglyball".