Comparing Bell and JJ

King A · August 2nd, 2005, 06:56 AM

Allright, I don't know, if this was done before, but it's still worth mentioning

taken from ESPN Stats
http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/player...erId=49&avg=48 and
http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/player...Id=1007&avg=48

We all know Bell is 4 years older and 2-3 inches smaller.

Based on 'per 48 minutes'

Code:

NAME        YEAR       G   GS   MIN     FG       FG%    3P      3P%     FT      FT%    STL    BLK    TO    PF   OFF  DEF  TOT  AST  PTS
Raja Bell   2004-2005  63  32  28.4   8.1-17.9  .454  1.4-3.6  .403   3.0-4.0  .747   1.18    0.2    2.1   5.5  1.3  4.1  5.4  2.4  20.7 
Joe Johnson 2004-2005  82  82  39.5   8.1-17.5  .461  2.6-5.5  .478   2.0-2.7  .750   1.17    0.4    2.2   2.5  1.8  4.5  6.3  4.3  20.7

So, in short: they're almost identically effective.

It's not like Bell has to score as much, Amare's gonna make 'em.
And about the Assists: When Bell's passing to Amare his assist stats will go up
since JJ had only 3 players to pass the ball to.

scotsman13 · August 2nd, 2005, 07:16 AM

the problem here is that bell wasnt brought in to replace johnson but to replace Q.

Dustbuster · August 2nd, 2005, 07:18 AM

King A, I hope that you are 100% correct on this, but typically inflating stats out over 48 minutes to compare reserves and starters is misleading. Some people are productive in briefer minutes, but essentially do not improve their stats at all over an extended period. Some do. I do have high hopes for Bell, but it is doubtful that he will provide a similar impact to JJ on the floor, particularly at first. He is an unknown in our system, while JJ was a known. The only way to really know what his impact will be is to get him on the floor as a Sun in our system and see what he does.

But our reality is that we will have Bell in a few hours, and we won't have JJ. Comparing them from here on out will only be frustrating. I am quite sure that JJ will put up some big numbers on the Hawks, but what's important for the Suns is that they keep winning with Bell and whomever else we add. I seriously doubt that Bell's numbers will in any way compare to the JJ's numbers this year...but it won't really matter. What's done is done.

King A · August 2nd, 2005, 07:23 AM

I just wanted to point out with this, that Bell is a decent player and may be capable of doing fine. Based on stats. Sure, stats don't always tell the whole story.

King A · August 2nd, 2005, 07:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by scotsman13

the problem here is that bell wasnt brought in to replace johnson but to replace Q.

Since Q was our starting SF, Marion replaces him.
Marion was our starting PF, so Amare replaces him.
Amare was our starting C, so Kurt Thomas replaces him.
Nash needn't be replaced.
Just JJ. And who's our most potent G/F aquisition? Bell!

jlove · August 2nd, 2005, 07:42 AM

Nice posts King. You've hit the nail on the head with your analysis of our team. Then you look at the bench that we had last year, compared to the bench we've stacked up so far this summer, and we should have a better team in total. I don't see our scoring dropping a whole lot if any because of the defensive personnel we've collected. The offense, IMO, is still the same (complete team wise, not individually), so we will get more stops on defense, leading to more scoring opportunities for us. We'll be able to run off of rebounds more this year, instead of running from out of bounds.

King A · August 2nd, 2005, 07:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jlove

Nice posts King. You've hit the nail on the head with your analysis of our team. Then you look at the bench that we had last year, compared to the bench we've stacked up so far this summer, and we should have a better team in total. I don't see our scoring dropping a whole lot if any because of the defensive personnel we've collected. The offense, IMO, is still the same (complete team wise, not individually), so we will get more stops on defense, leading to more scoring opportunities for us. We'll be able to run off of rebounds more this year, instead of running from out of bounds.

very nice.
That's what I'm trying to say anyhow.
We didn't get big names in town, but somehow I don't see this year's team any worse than last year's.

And the defense. I'm looking forward to it.

HooverDam · August 2nd, 2005, 09:51 AM

Also consider Bells numbers will improve because people will be focusing on the big 3. Also, having the best PG in the league getting you the ball will help anyones numbers (loook at JJs numbers before and after Nash).

Even though I think Bell will do well in the Suns system, I still think we need to add another piece at the 2 gaurd as JJax and Bell aren't quite enough in my opinion (with Dijon and Barbosa there as well, but I hope to see them not play too much). So hopefully we can get Finley and play him when we need some scoring, and play Bell when we need to stop Manu.

fordronken · August 2nd, 2005, 09:57 AM

Gary Payton is looking better and better.

Yuma · August 2nd, 2005, 10:00 AM

I think we are OK at the two with Jimmy Jackson, Bell, Dijon, and Barbosa. What we really need is a GOOD back up PG, and another GOOD big man.

F-Dog · August 2nd, 2005, 10:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fordronken

Gary Payton is looking better and better.

No he isn't. With or without Payton, the Suns don't have anybody who can guard Tony Parker.

If the Suns aren't going to compete for a championship next season, they need to give PT to their young players. Right now, that means Barbosa and Diaw.

jlove · August 2nd, 2005, 10:05 AM

Honestly, I don't think we need Finley. I don't know if I'd go after GP either. We could trade for a shooter (Luke Jackson) and/or a big man (Gooden), or do a S&T with Boston for Walker ond one of their PG (Allen or Banks). Rumor has it they want to get rid of one of them. I know Boston is close to the cap and they want some extra money, so they could then use the Exemption to grab some more bodies.

Joe Mama · August 2nd, 2005, 10:38 AM

It should be noted that Bell averaged more than twice as many fouls per 48 minutes and half as many assists. I don't think Bell can replace JJ, but he will sure helps soften the blow.

Joe Mama

myrondizzo · August 2nd, 2005, 10:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Joe Mama

It should be noted that Bell averaged more than twice as many fouls per 48 minutes and half as many assists. I don't think Bell can replace JJ, but he will sure helps soften the blow.

Joe Mama

he played for sloan they are a much more physical team hence the fouls.not that a think he will fill JJ's shoes although im loving the "manu is mad at his agent for letting bell sign with PHX" story

JS22 · August 2nd, 2005, 10:54 AM

Bell is one of the leagues best 1 on 1 defenders, and has a very nice offensive game. His offense is not as polished as JJ's, but his defense will more than make up for it. He's used to playing on a "hard nosed" slow it down type of team, so he will be able to open his game up a bit more here. I'm banking on him flourishing in this offense.

Frankly, I think JJ is an overrated defender, and always got owned by the better offensive players in the league. Bell is 2x the defender that JJ is, or ever will be.