Analyzing Peyton Manning's Options - Page 3

az jam · February 24th, 2012, 05:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Arizona's Finest

I live in Miami. The vibe you are throwing out about this team is not the reality. They have a rookie HC. They play in the AFC East and you throw the Pats to the side like the are last nights trash. LOL they just went to the Super Bowl. You think he is going to take the team with less weapons and go up against Belechik and the Jets defense just to win the division?

Players have houses everywhere. Especially a guy like Peyton. They play half their games in rainy conditions in a absolute atrocious venue.

Fitzgerald is the most important non QB in NFL. Brandon Marshall is schizophrenic.

But most importantly? Stephen Ross is a joke and everyone here and in the know, know this. Is why he offered Fisher and Harbaugh more money and they both went elsewhere. This is the guy who opened a club at the stadium, brought in JLO to be owner, and has a red carpet before games. he doesn't get it and it's why they have a apathetic fan base. Plus this is the Heats town now.

Miami looks ALOT more desirable from the outside then it really is.

Thanks you bring up some good points that those of us living outside of Miami don't realize. The media however does seem to favor them, not sure why.

cardpa · February 24th, 2012, 05:59 AM

I don't see Manning coming to AZ. I would be surprised if he landed anywhere else but Miami. To me its a no brainer. The Mannings call Miami home in the off season. He settles right in as the starter. He gets to have major input on the offense.

I can see Miami going out to get him some WRs. Do not be surprised if they also sign Wayne. Make it a package deal Manning and Wayne to Miami. Despite a new head coach that could very well work in Manning's favor. The Dolphins are not that far from being a serious contender in the AFC East.

Buffalo is still struggling, AS many others have said NYJ are a mess. The Patriots are showing signs of age. Brady is not getting any younger and one hit could take him out for the season. Yes the same can be said for Manning. I can see both the Patriots and the Steelers dipping a bit over the next two or three seasons. They both have a large core group aging at the same time and I am not saying they drop to 4-12 or 5-11. I see it more as 8-8 or 9-7 as they re-tool, not re-build a bit.

Miami probably gets more home games later in the season since their weather is nicer (similar to AZ during the SDS days) so Mannings' trips to cold, wet conditions are probably minimal.

The reality is he will play probably 2 or 3 more years. That allows the Dolphins to find and groom a QB to replace Manning down the road. He is in many ways like Warner was a competent veteran QB who can carry your team while you find his replacement while aspiring for a SB appearance. The only difference here was the team didn't find nor groom that replacement.

chickenhead · February 24th, 2012, 06:11 AM

I don't pretend to have any idea what matters most to Peyton or where he will go--but my suspicion is that Miami's football legacy isn't part of it. They have not remotely shown they can put it together since Shula/Marino, and even then they had an HoF quarterback who ultimately didn't have the necessary weapons to win it all. (No offense to Shula/Marino: I was always a great fan of both.)

Of course, aside from 2008, it's not like the Cardinals don't have a much worse overall legacy...

But I'm just not sure much of that matters to today's player--at least not any more than weather and facilities do. And of course the personnel. I do think Fitz makes a huge difference.

lorenzotexan · February 24th, 2012, 06:15 AM

If I were peyton I would leave indy and want to come to a place like AZ or SF. you have probably the best WR in the league, a great place to live, great fans, and along with larry you would probably be the greatest player in the history of their franchise(no disrespect to anyone else). but most importantly of all I think it is a winning situation in AZ. unlike washington or somewhere else. 49ers is another option, but I question whether peyton would want to play for that franchise.

chickenhead · February 24th, 2012, 06:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lorenzotexan

If I were peyton I would leave indy and want to come to a place like AZ or SF. you have probably the best WR in the league, a great place to live, great fans, and along with larry you would probably be the greatest player in the history of their franchise(no disrespect to anyone else). but most importantly of all I think it is a winning situation in AZ. unlike washington or somewhere else. 49ers is another option, but I question whether peyton would want to play for that franchise.

Interesting point, actually. If Peyton comes to AZ and wins a Super Bowl, he leap-frogs Warner, who wasn't a career Cardinal. If he wins in SF, he's still behind Montana and possibly Young (in the franchise). In NY he wouldn't jump over Namath, but he'd be up there because it's been so long. Miami is a little more complicated, since he'd have the championship that Marino doesn't, but one less than Griese.

If he cares about any of this, of course. I'm sure he's been just fine as 1A with Unitas in the Colts' tradition. Certainly #1 in the Indy era.

DoTheDew · February 25th, 2012, 08:40 PM

Very good analysis Mitch. I would like to point out that I'm not sure the "splashy" thing matters to Peyton. He has happily stayed in Indianapolis which is probably less splashy then Arizona, or at least it would be if not for Peyton being there.

I've said this it seems a thousand times already. His choice is going to come down to where he thinks he's most likely to win another SB. You'd think that would favor the Jets, however they have some difficulties as you pointed out.

I really do think we are the team in the best position to get him here though, but only if we *want* to. Graves and the Bidwill's have it within their power to be proactive and get him here, but I don't expect them to. I expect them to spend too much time mulling over all scenarios while Peyton ultimately signs somewhere else. They will then tell us that they never really wanted him and feed us some nonsense about how they think they have 2 QBOFs in Kolb and Skelton. However, maybe they will end up being right. Maybe Peyton's health problems last until he retires and he is never the same player. Maybe Skelton improves as much from year 2 to 3 that he did from year 1 to 2 and we end up with our QBOF afterall.

That's the beauty of the NFL. There's always hope.

Bodha · February 26th, 2012, 12:05 AM

PM has his choice, money isnt an issue because I feel he'll go for a deal that works for wherever he wants to go. Like he wouldnt go to freezing Baltimore because they could pay him another 100 million. Hed take half that to go to sunny Miami, etc.

So with that in mind, I think The Cards have the edge because of the stadium. Statistically we have a very good defense, although sometime it wouldnt seem like it. And we have Larry.

IMO, if we get PM, the Oline will be completely redone. Move to take a better LT in the draft, or DeCastro. Big moves in FA, etc. so OL shouldnt be a big worry.

I think Miami is very appealing. Beautiful weather, Brandon Marshall, good D, good running game. This will be dog fight.

Duckjake · February 26th, 2012, 08:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Buckybird

All I'm saying is the Cards should have the conversation. I guarantee you those picks would get them to listen & think. We haven't really had anything more than short-term stability at the position except for Lomax, Hart & Charley Johnson...in nearly 100 years.

Bucky you are onto something:

Jake Plummer 6 years
Kurt Warner 5 years

Both led the Cards to playoff victories!

In between Lomax and Plummer the Cards had 7 different QBs as their leading passer. Their record over those 8 seasons 44-84.

Almost 5-11 average!

Buckybird · February 26th, 2012, 09:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Duckjake

Bucky you are onto something:

Jake Plummer 6 years
Kurt Warner 5 years

Both led the Cards to playoff victories!

In between Lomax and Plummer the Cards had 7 different QBs as their leading passer. Their record over those 8 seasons 44-84.

Almost 5-11 average!

And now we're back to the same Duck!

We basically can't draft a franchise QB because we never draft high enough & that's exactly why I would offer the Colts those three #1's & three #2's. By also alternating those picks each year, we can still add some talent...the window with Fitz, DD, AW, CC is closing faster than we think.

Cards get Luck

Colts get:
Kolb & #13 pick
#1 & #2 in 2013
#2 in 2014
#1 in 2015
#2 in 2016

I would do it without blinking an eye

Pariah · February 26th, 2012, 10:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Buckybird

Cards get Luck

Colts get:
Kolb & #13 pick
#1 & #2 in 2013
#2 in 2014
#1 in 2015
#2 in 2016

I would do it without blinking an eye

There is no reason to give up that much to get the #1 pick. None.

I'd applaud the Cardinals for committing to getting better, but I'd be disgusted with their ability to negotiate. Where do negotiations start if that's where we end up? It's the equivalent of going into a car dealership and paying 2x the sticker price on a car.

Not to mention that Luck is still an unknown quantity as an NFLer. I LOVE the kid's chances, but no one knows for sure if he'll make the leap and be a top-flight professional QB.

Buckybird · February 26th, 2012, 10:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pariah

There is no reason to give up that much to get the #1 pick. None.

I'd applaud the Cardinals for committing to getting better, but I'd be disgusted with their ability to negotiate. Where do negotiations start if that's where we end up? It's the equivalent of going into a car dealership and paying 2x the sticker price on a car.

Not to mention that Luck is still an unknown quantity as an NFLer. I LOVE the kid's chances, but no one knows for sure if he'll make the leap and be a top-flight professional QB.

Given they will soon lose 1 of the greatest QB's ever & most are calling Luck the best and most NFL ready QB in decades, it would almost certainly cost that if not more & the Colts might even turn that offer down.

You wouldn't basically give up just 2 more #1's & 2 #2's than we did for Kolb to, for the first time in 25 years have "the guy" for 10+ seasons? It's really only two #1's when you take into account your giving up a 1 for a 1. We would be crazy NOT to do that...but I know we never will.

Pariah · February 26th, 2012, 11:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Buckybird

We would be crazy NOT to do that...but I know we never will.

Three first, three seconds and a starting QB to move up 12 spots? yuk.

I guess we just wildly disagree.

cardsfanmd · February 27th, 2012, 02:50 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mitch

Another thought just occurred to me---let's hope Peyton doesn't give fellow Miami resident and ex-teammate Edgerrin James a call! Seriously!

Let's be real Mitch, do we really think anyone could understand what Edge is saying over the phone lol?

cardsfanmd · February 27th, 2012, 02:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pariah

Three first, three seconds and a starting QB to move up 12 spots? yuk.

I guess we just wildly disagree.

this. I would puke.

john h · February 27th, 2012, 09:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mitch

Washington---

Plusses:

1. Owner who is willing to spend big money.
2. A veteran HC who has won Super Bowls.
3. Autonomy to run his own offense?
4. Good, aggressive defense.

Minuses:

1. Shaky offensive line.
2. Tough Division.
3. Playing versus brother twice a year (some insist PM would like this? Sure he's ultra competitive, but one could imagine he would just as soon avoid the twice a year thing).
4. Outdoor stadium.

Seattle---

Plusses:

1. Plenty O' Cap Space---to sign him and others in tow.
2. Autonomy to run the offense his way.
3. A good running game.
4. Rabid fan base.

Minuses:

1. Cold, rainy, windy weather.
2. Young WR unit.
3. A suspect offensive line.
4. A HC who could get on anyone's nerves.

Miami---

Plusses:

1. Manning and his wife own a house there.
2. Autonomy.
3. Solid defense.
4. LT Jake Long and WR Brandon Marshall

Minuses:

1. Heat and humidity.
2. New HC and staff.
3. Very tough division.
4. Young RBs.

New York Jets---

Plusses:

1. Talented roster with Super Bowl potential.
2. Good running game.
3. Very good defense.
4. Aggressive ownership and rabid fan base.

Minuses:

1. Cold weather last two months and in playoffs.
2. Maniacal HC...and not much cap room.
3. Taking some of the NY spotlight away from his brother.
4. Tough division.

Arizona---

Plusses:

1. Indoor stadium.
2. Autonomy? With a little help from WR Coach Frank Reich?
3. Larry Fitzgerald.
4. Precedent of going to Super Bowl with past Super Bowl MVP QB.

Minuses:

1. Offensive line.
2. Front office dynamics.
3. Little cap space.
4. Not as splashy a place to be as Miami, Washington or New York.

The fact that Arizona is the only team that has an indoor stadium---might weigh heavily in PM's favor---and that he would get to play on natural grass as well. And, in Larry Fitzgerald, PM would have a football soul mate.

The only thing I wonder---is what Kurt Warner would tell him. Warner recently was critical of how the Cardinals have let go of key players---and Warner said he "lost the fun of the game" in his last year...and there may be well more to that than just his injury concerns. I think Warner would paint both sides---and that he would talk up Fitz big-time to Peyton---but I wonder if he would offer Peyton enough of a positive and persuasive endorsement.

Some might say---who cares about what Warner might have to say---but, there is no doubt in my mind that if PM was ever seriously considering signing with the Cardinals, that Kurt Warner would be one of the first calls he would make.

The closest team in the running here to being a Super Bowl champion?

The New York Jets.

The decision might be a simple as that...regardless of geography and other logistics.

The Cardinals once lost another Super Bowl MVP QB to the New York Jets.

Can you name him?

Mitch you forgot to add which team has the best medical staff? This is sort of lousy post but I really have Peyton's health foremost in my mind. He has been the best of the best both on and off the field. Regardless of what the Doctors say there will be a weak point in Peyton's neck. Your neck does not get stronger after a fusion or fusions. I remain very concerned about his health if he should return. Even more so than the money it would take to get him. At some point he he going to be hit high by a big strong defender over the season if he returns. Clearly he will not come back for the money but for the love of the game. He likely has the genes to keep him standing until the last moment to get off a throw and open himself up for a big hit.