A question

Cbus cardsfan · March 26th, 2006, 04:50 PM

Back when he was draft eligible was there a clamoring for the Cards to take Charlie Ward? Because that's who the Cards would be drafting if they took Vince Young. They are very similar type players and played in a similar offense. FSU's offense was probably a bit more sophisticated but it was pretty much line Charlie up in the shotgun and have him make a play.FSU also won a National Championship doing this,so did Texas.Ward was the most athletic dual threat at QB in his day, so is Young.Ward was a late round pick that played in the NBA.Why is Young considered a top 10 pick?

People are defending Young left and right on this board. Somebody's even trying to claim he's an honor roll student.Well,if he's on the the honor roll at Texas, then Andy Katzenmoyer is valedictorian at Ohio State. Anyone who scores a 6,and i don't care if he was prepared or not, has some serious brainwave issues. People are saying Dan Marino had a 16.I'm sure, unlike Young, he came across as somewhat intelligent in interviews. Plus, he was a prototypical QB who ran a somewhat, for college, complex offense.

Lets's call Young what he is.He's a terrific athlete that has some serious issues at translating his game to the NFL level. He could be the next Randall Cunningham, who btw wasn't a top 10 pick, or the next Michael Bishop. Either way,i would hate to waste a top 10 pick on a guy with such collossal bust potential. I know all draft picks are potential busts but the Cards seem pretty close to contending for a playoff spot. Do we take a flyer on a guy who,at best,can play in 3 years and pass on a potential defensive rookie of the year candidate in Huff/Williams/Hawk who could help the Cards contend next year? I say that's an easy answer. NO.

Card Trader · March 26th, 2006, 04:53 PM

VERY well said. Great post.

BigDavis75 · March 26th, 2006, 04:59 PM

I love Vince but I am always going to take the defensive playmaker.

jefftheshark · March 26th, 2006, 05:34 PM

If Huff/Williams/Hawk are gone at 10, do the Cards have your permission to select Young?

The Shark

Cbus cardsfan · March 26th, 2006, 05:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jefftheshark

If Huff/Williams/Hawk are gone at 10, do the Cards have your permission to select Young?

The Shark

NO.

Shogun · March 26th, 2006, 05:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Card Trader

VERY well said. Great post.

...

Crimson Warrior · March 26th, 2006, 06:02 PM

either young or cutler, whoever is still there at 10.

Got to man up a take the chance. sorry. Time to get a backbone.

WildBB · March 26th, 2006, 06:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cbus cardsfan

Back when he was draft eligible was there a clamoring for the Cards to take Charlie Ward? Because that's who the Cards would be drafting if they took Vince Young. They are very similar type players and played in a similar offense. FSU's offense was probably a bit more sophisticated but it was pretty much line Charlie up in the shotgun and have him make a play.FSU also won a National Championship doing this,so did Texas.Ward was the most athletic dual threat at QB in his day, so is Young.Ward was a late round pick that played in the NBA.Why is Young considered a top 10 pick?

People are defending Young left and right on this board. Somebody's even trying to claim he's an honor roll student.Well,if he's on the the honor roll at Texas, then Andy Katzenmoyer is valedictorian at Ohio State. Anyone who scores a 6,and i don't care if he was prepared or not, has some serious brainwave issues. People are saying Dan Marino had a 16.I'm sure, unlike Young, he came across as somewhat intelligent in interviews. Plus, he was a prototypical QB who ran a somewhat, for college, complex offense.

Lets's call Young what he is.He's a terrific athlete that has some serious issues at translating his game to the NFL level. He could be the next Randall Cunningham, who btw wasn't a top 10 pick, or the next Michael Bishop. Either way,i would hate to waste a top 10 pick on a guy with such collossal bust potential. I know all draft picks are potential busts but the Cards seem pretty close to contending for a playoff spot. Do we take a flyer on a guy who,at best,can play in 3 years and pass on a potential defensive rookie of the year candidate in Huff/Williams/Hawk who could help the Cards contend next year? I say that's an easy answer. NO.

Eagles fans were also decrying taking McNabb at #2 overall instead of R. Williams.

Are any of them complining now? Who has the potential to have his kind of impact?

When is this team going to address the QB situation seriously? What about the fans?

We're ready for the risk, IMO. No Guts, No Glory!

Zeno · March 26th, 2006, 06:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cbus cardsfan

Back when he was draft eligible was there a clamoring for the Cards to take Charlie Ward?

2 things....1) Ward stated publicly he wanted to play in the NBA and made it known to NFL teams not to draft him.
2) The NFL today is different than it was 10+ yrs ago. Most black QBs were considered "athletes" and not viable QBs...Moon and Cunningham (and to a much lesser extent Peete) the exceptions.

You are comparing 2 players based on 2 things...race and college football position. Different offenses, different types of players, different NFL.

I'm surprised you didn't bring up Andre Ware.

I'm not sure what to think about Young...he is an intriguing prospect, he improved every year in college but its also obvious he played in an offense that doesn't translate well to the NFL. He is a talented player and like McNair will probably need to sit a season or 2 but I see no reason to think he wouldn't try to become a pro QB--unless in interviews he comes across as someone not willing to put in the time to learn and can set his ego aside long enough to accomplish that. I haven't heard any details about his team interviews and I doubt we will but there is a reason 31 teams showed up to the workouts...he has potential to be something special.

Duckjake · March 26th, 2006, 06:19 PM

Quote:

Ward was the most athletic dual threat at QB in his day, so is Young.Ward was a late round pick that played in the NBA.

Ward is 6'2" 190lbs. Young is 6'5" and 230. Huge difference so to speak.

sundevilscott · March 26th, 2006, 06:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zeno

2 things....1) Ward stated publicly he wanted to play in the NBA and made it known to NFL teams not to draft him.
2) The NFL today is different than it was 10+ yrs ago. Most black QBs were considered "athletes" and not viable QBs...Moon and Cunningham (and to a much lesser extent Peete) the exceptions.

You are comparing 2 players based on 2 things...race and college football position. Different offenses, different types of players, different NFL.

I'm surprised you didn't bring up Andre Ware.

VERY well said. Great post

Diamondback Jay · March 26th, 2006, 06:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Crimson Warrior

either young or cutler, whoever is still there at 10.

Got to man up a take the chance. sorry. Time to get a backbone.

Thank you very much.. My sediments exactly.

Zeno · March 26th, 2006, 06:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Cbus cardsfan

Ward was the most athletic dual threat at QB in his day, so is Young.Ward was a late round pick that played in the NBA.Why is Young considered a top 10 pick?

Ward was not drafted at all.

He was hardly the dual threat that Young is...Ward had 339 yds rushing under 6 yds a carry and 4 TDs. Young had 1050 yds at 6.8 yds a carry and 12 TDs.

Ward averaged 7.97 yds per attempt. Young 9.34 ypa.

Bad comparison...aside from the obvious :cough:race:cough

joeshmo · March 26th, 2006, 06:34 PM

Super Agetn Leigh Steinberg was on ESPN radio on the Dan Patrick show about the same time Youngs score came out.

He stated that 75% of the scores that we here for a player are not their first scores but rather the second go around for them. Its just that we dont here about those scores becuase they are private and for some reason Youngs score got released by an insider who should have never released it of which has not been verified yet by the way. Even the scores that are released may or may not be the correct scores in the first place as all Wonderlic scores are confidential only given to the teams. He went on to say really low scores were not that uncommon and after a day of prep raised their scores by a lot the next day. There is also no statistical correlation between the Wonderlic and a succesful QB, none what so ever.

Alex Smith had a 40 and took forever and is still trying to learn his team offense and playbook.
Joey Harrington got a 32.
And we all know the low scores tht did well.

I guess the only fault which is a pretty big one for Young is that he didnt prepare for it like 99% of the prospects, and the leadership surrounding him sucks. They didnt even want him nor prepare him for the 40 at his own pro day. It took proding from the stands for him to do it and with out the prep or stretching like most other guys. Becuase of it he had a lower then expected time when he could have had a under 4.5 easily. That i will fault him for but not the Wonderlic.

ajcardfan · March 26th, 2006, 06:35 PM

Draft him if he's there at #10.

Every once in a while, a player comes along who is "outside the box". Sometimes they don't make it, but sometimes they do. Picks 1 to 3 is too much risk maybe, but he is a very acceptable risk at #10. I also don't agree that it will take 3 years for him to make an impact.