Enjoy an Ads-Free ASFN - lighter and faster too! Become an ASFN-Contributor and help support the site.
Go Back   Arizona Sports Fans Network > Other Stuff > Politics and Religion > 2008 Presidential Election

Welcome to ASFN Fan Forums! We're glad to have you here. Please feel free to browse the forum. We'd like to invite you to join our community; doing so will enable you to view additional forums and post with our other members.


Registered Members don't see these ads. Register now it's free!
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old August 21st, 2008, 09:58 PM   #1
LoyaltyisaCurse
Answers Before Questions
 
LoyaltyisaCurse's Avatar
 

Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Chatsworth, CA
Posts: 12,411
A$FN: 4,800

Without Shame: McCain camp using POW as political tool.


http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/0..._n_120428.html

McCain Camp Plays POW Card On House Gaffe

August 21, 2008 02:34 PM





Facing a Democratic Party positively giddy over his recent admission that he didn't know how many houses he owned, John McCain quickly returned to a political trump card: his POW experience.


Speaking to the Washington Post, aide Brian Rogers, in full damage-control mode, acknowledged that his boss had "some investment properties and stuff," but added: "This is a guy who lived in one house for five and a half years -- in prison."

That the McCain campaign could incorporate his service in Vietnam into a campaign spat over his property portfolio is not so surprising. The Senator has, rightfully or not, used his history as a POW shrewdly and repeatedly throughout this campaign.

Earlier this week, for instance, amidst speculation that the Senator may have received in advance the questions to a values forum between him and Obama, spokeswoman Nicole Wallace declared: "The insinuation from the Obama campaign that John McCain, a former prisoner of war, cheated is outrageous."

When Elizabeth Edwards, the wife of former Senator John Edwards, ridiculed McCain's health care policy, his aides didn't respond with a substantive retort. Rather, they declared that their boss knew what it was like to get inadequate care "from another government." Even earlier, when the topic was about earmarks, McCain criticized Sen. Hillary Clinton for proposing funds for a museum celebrating Woodstock. He didn't know what there was to celebrate, he said, because he was "tied up" during the music festival.

The Senator has even brought his military record into discussion of his music tastes. Explaining that his favorite song was "Dancing Queen" by ABBA, he offered that his knowledge of music "stopped evolving when his plane intercepted a surface-to-air missile." Dancing Queen, however, was produced in 1975, eight years after McCain's plane was shot down.

Preceding this election, there was a fairly wide-ranging belief that McCain was hesitant to use his POW experience in a political context. The Senator himself, during the 2004 election, said he was "sick and tired of re-fighting" the Vietnam War.

"It's offensive to me, and it's angering to me that we're doing this," he said. "It's time to move on."

But during this campaign, it seems such reluctance is no longer an issue, with the POW line sneaking into many of the campaign's commercials and -- more subtly -- their foreign policy attacks. Much of this strategy has come at the urging of GOP operatives. Karl Rove, for example, wrote an April 2008 Wall Street Journal op-ed urging the presumptive Republican nominee to "open up more" on his Vietnam days or "many voters will never know the experiences of his life that show his character."

Democrats, meanwhile, have been torn over what is an appropriate response. While many attack-oriented strategists have been pleading a more head-on rebuttal (applauding, for instance, Gen Wesley Clark for declaring that one's time as a POW had no relevance to being commander in chief), the Obama campaign seems more willing to deflect any and all attention from this part of McCain's biography.

"The fact is, we respect Senator McCain's service and his courage in Vietnam, but we continue to believe that this election is about who is the best president to lead in the 21st Century," Philip Carter, Obama's veterans director, told the Huffington Post. "As you heard on the phone today with the veterans, the critical issue is who understands the threats facing this country and who will make the right decisions about war and peace. That person is Barack Obama, not Senator McCain."
Registered Members don't see these ads. Register now it's free!
__________________
Goin' "Double Maverick!"
LoyaltyisaCurse is offline   Reply With Quote
Old August 21st, 2008, 10:15 PM   #2
Gee!
What Up? Whats Happnin?
 
Gee!'s Avatar
 

Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Gee From The G
Posts: 18,971
A$FN: 3,616
Blog Entries: 2
Didnt Kerry attempt to use his military background ( or whatever there was of it) without shame?
__________________
I'm your favorite poster's, favorite poster

Defending the crown is harder than chasing it
Gee! is offline   Reply With Quote
Old August 21st, 2008, 10:23 PM   #3
Kolo
Registered User
 

Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 3,306
A$FN: 1,000
McCain's quote in 2004 was directed at the Swift Boat Veterans for Truth for their treatment of John Kerry. Touting yourself as a POW survivor isn't "re-fighting" the Vietnam War.

Even then, even if McCain is hypocritical for bringing it up, I haven't heard anybody explain how it's otherwise "shameful."
Kolo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old August 21st, 2008, 10:30 PM   #4
LoyaltyisaCurse
Answers Before Questions
 
LoyaltyisaCurse's Avatar
 

Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Chatsworth, CA
Posts: 12,411
A$FN: 4,800
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kolobotomy View Post
McCain's quote in 2004 was directed at the Swift Boat Veterans for Truth for their treatment of John Kerry. Touting yourself as a POW survivor isn't "re-fighting" the Vietnam War.

Even then, even if McCain is hypocritical for bringing it up, I haven't heard anybody explain how it's otherwise "shameful."
Its is shameful because his camp and many of his media supporters are using it as a weapon in reponse to topics that have nor relation to being a POW. It is a shameless act bent on droping that fact as a way to either get out of answering a question or excusing his lack of judgment in certain areas.

For example: Two weeks ago Sean Hannity was blathering about John Edwards infedelity by saying, "How can you ever trust anyone who has cheated on his wife..." and when Alan Colmes asked Hannity how can he then trust McCain since he cheated on his 1st wife, Hannity's response was: "He spent 5 years as a P.O.W."
__________________
Goin' "Double Maverick!"
LoyaltyisaCurse is offline   Reply With Quote
Old August 21st, 2008, 10:39 PM   #5
Brian in Mesa
ΒΙΜ™
 
Brian in Mesa's Avatar
 
Tetris Champion!
Join Date: May 2002
Location: The Dark Side
Posts: 23,479
A$FN: 0
Send a message via MSN to Brian in Mesa Send a message via Yahoo to Brian in Mesa
Quote:
Originally Posted by LoyaltyisaCurse View Post
For example: Two weeks ago Sean Hannity was blathering about John Edwards infedelity by saying, "How can you ever trust anyone who has cheated on his wife..." and when Alan Colmes asked Hannity how can he then trust McCain since he cheated on his 1st wife, Hannity's response was: "He spent 5 years as a P.O.W."
Lame.

5 years as a P.O.W. and you come home to a wife that is nothing like the woman you married (after a terrible and physically disfiguring car accident)...

Still no excuse for adultery.

If you want to go after someone else - get a freaking divorce first.
__________________
"If Chuck is Solo, Larkin is his Fett!" - Morgan
Brian in Mesa is offline   Reply With Quote
Old August 21st, 2008, 10:58 PM   #6
Gee!
What Up? Whats Happnin?
 
Gee!'s Avatar
 

Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Gee From The G
Posts: 18,971
A$FN: 3,616
Blog Entries: 2
I love how the left side says R's are too stupid to lead, and they cant bring up military service either.. Im neither a R or D but have always felt D's talk down on people instead of talking to people..

I get the feeling a good portion, oh hold up Im in the P&R forum and have to speak in generalizations, ALL liberals are control mongers..

Nothing gets resolved this way.. Your wrong, Im right.. Welcome to grade school in a scholars world..

All you piss me off in your stuck in the mud ways.. Both the hardcore D's and R's.. Grow up and quit trying to turn the world into something you want it to be.. Try and make it something good..
__________________
I'm your favorite poster's, favorite poster

Defending the crown is harder than chasing it
Gee! is offline   Reply With Quote
Old August 21st, 2008, 11:02 PM   #7
Gee!
What Up? Whats Happnin?
 
Gee!'s Avatar
 

Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: Gee From The G
Posts: 18,971
A$FN: 3,616
Blog Entries: 2
Im about this far away from suing someone that tells me I cant say "Thank God" in publc becuse it offends them.. It offends me you dont believe in God and wanna tell me what to believe.. Im real close to suing people for opposing my rights to saying "Merry Xmas" instead of Happy Holidays.. All this political correctness is driving me crazy.. Why is everyone catching feelings? Do yourself, quit worrying about me and mines..
__________________
I'm your favorite poster's, favorite poster

Defending the crown is harder than chasing it

Last edited by Gee!; August 22nd, 2008 at 12:22 AM.
Gee! is offline   Reply With Quote
Old August 21st, 2008, 11:15 PM   #8
LoyaltyisaCurse
Answers Before Questions
 
LoyaltyisaCurse's Avatar
 

Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Chatsworth, CA
Posts: 12,411
A$FN: 4,800
There is nothing wrong in bringing up military service when it is actually related to the topic at hand, not--for example--when discussing healthcare...
__________________
Goin' "Double Maverick!"
LoyaltyisaCurse is offline   Reply With Quote
Old August 21st, 2008, 11:24 PM   #9
Brian in Mesa
ΒΙΜ™
 
Brian in Mesa's Avatar
 
Tetris Champion!
Join Date: May 2002
Location: The Dark Side
Posts: 23,479
A$FN: 0
Send a message via MSN to Brian in Mesa Send a message via Yahoo to Brian in Mesa
I remember when McCain was up for reelection here in Arizona. He had taken some criticism for using his P.O.W. experience too much and he said he would run on the issues and he would not use his having been a P.O.W. in any ads.

Weeks later...in a commercial...John McCain (standing in front of the Grand Canyon): "I am John McCain. I was a P.O.W. ..."

__________________
"If Chuck is Solo, Larkin is his Fett!" - Morgan
Brian in Mesa is offline   Reply With Quote
Old August 21st, 2008, 11:33 PM   #10
Dback Jon
Random Encounter
 
Dback Jon's Avatar
 

Join Date: May 2002
Location: Chandler
Posts: 24,155
A$FN: 69,214
Just like Guiliani, who inserted 9/11 into every sentence...
__________________



R.I.P Tim Minnick

The KING of Cards
Dback Jon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old August 22nd, 2008, 12:13 AM   #11
Donald
NFC West Champs!
 
Donald's Avatar
 

Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Doused in Gatorade
Posts: 31,761
A$FN: 2,872
Send a message via MSN to Donald
Gee is on point here.
__________________
I'm the anti-TNT. I don't do drama.
Donald is offline   Reply With Quote
Old August 22nd, 2008, 05:53 AM   #12
DWKB
AKA Dust Chinstrap
 
DWKB's Avatar
 

Join Date: May 2002
Posts: 2,915
A$FN: 12,401
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gee! View Post
All you piss me off in your stuck in the mud ways.. Both the hardcore D's and R's.. Grow up and quit trying to turn the world into something you want it to be.. Try and make it something good..
So, if I want to make the world "something good" then I shouldn't do it because I'm trying to turn the world into something I want it to be or I should do it because we should try and make it something good?

I know it feels good to have a holier than thou attitude to people you think have the same attitude, but I personally don't see where circular logic pseudo feel good rhetoric gets anyone.
DWKB is offline   Reply With Quote
Old August 22nd, 2008, 08:10 AM   #13
Donald
NFC West Champs!
 
Donald's Avatar
 

Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: Doused in Gatorade
Posts: 31,761
A$FN: 2,872
Send a message via MSN to Donald
His basic point is action, not words. Bitching about the other side gets nothing at all done. Going out into your community and helping actually does. Arguing on a message board about why Americans are stupid, dems are elitist or republicans are religious whackos doesn't do jack squat about anything. Donating your time and treasure to causes YOU believe in does.

__________________
I'm the anti-TNT. I don't do drama.
Donald is offline   Reply With Quote
Old August 22nd, 2008, 08:16 AM   #14
abomb
Registered User
 

Join Date: Oct 2003
Posts: 20,753
A$FN: 1,000,000
Quote:
Originally Posted by Donald View Post
His basic point is action, not words. Bitching about the other side gets nothing at all done. Going out into your community and helping actually does. Arguing on a message board about why Americans are stupid, dems are elitist or republicans are religious whackos doesn't do jack squat about anything. Donating your time and treasure to causes YOU believe in does.

I heard a good matra this morning; if it doesnt make you money or make you happy, dont do it.
abomb is offline   Reply With Quote
Old August 22nd, 2008, 08:20 AM   #15
DWKB
AKA Dust Chinstrap
 
DWKB's Avatar
 

Join Date: May 2002
Posts: 2,915
A$FN: 12,401
Quote:
Originally Posted by Donald View Post
His basic point is action, not words. Bitching about the other side gets nothing at all done. Going out into your community and helping actually does. Arguing on a message board about why Americans are stupid, dems are elitist or republicans are religious whackos doesn't do jack squat about anything. Donating your time and treasure to causes YOU believe in does.

Well I didn't get that at all considering there was plenty of bitching about the Democrats talking down to him and like I said, the circular logic was baffling. Your words are much more succinct.
DWKB is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Sitemap:1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 31 32 33 34 35 36 37


All times are GMT -8. The time now is 07:40 PM.



Subscribe in a reader
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.0
Copyright ©2000 - 2009, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
vBCredits v1.4 Copyright ©2007 - 2008, PixelFX Studios
Copyright © 2002 - 2006 ArizonaSportsFans.com