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But my original point was, that Lance Armstrong is an American riding the Tour. So naturally that's what the American media focus on. There's MUCH more to cycling than the Tour de France and the Americans getting tested.
How much media exposure did any of the classics this spring get in the American media? Or the Vuelta? Or the Giro?
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5 wins - 11 losses
Record of The New England Patriots' before their first SuperBowl!
Have you read the stories lately how several of the Telekom/T-Mobiile riders have admitted doping, including 1996 Tour winner Riis?
Cycling is going to turn into what baseball has turned into. Riis admits, as does Dietz, Zabel, and Aldag. Further, two German doctors have admitted giving drugs to the T-Mobile team.
What i suspect is happening now is guys are coming out and admitting it before someone else "outs" them so they can control the spin on the story?
At least 3 former teammates of Lance's have now admitted it and that's just one team, it doesn't go back to his US postal team days when essentially the entire team has admitted doping except for Lance(and several teammates said he did).
What i suspect is happening now is guys are coming out and admitting it before someone else "outs" them so they can control the spin on the story?
At least 3 former teammates of Lance's have now admitted it and that's just one team, it doesn't go back to his US postal team days when essentially the entire team has admitted doping except for Lance(and several teammates said he did).
One of my best friend works for one of the premier TV-stations covering cycling.
He says that EVERY cycling journalist in the world knows that Lance Armstrong used doping. The problem with Lance was that in order to keep his testicular cancer in check, he had to get hormon/steriod treatment in the first couple of years after his cancer (otherwise the cancer could return).
Lance just kept taking them after he really had any reason to, and no journalist in the world ever had the guts to question that, because it could backfire bigtime.
And this is nothing against Lance, because he only did what EVERYONE else did.
But IMO believing that he's totally clean is very ignorant, if you just follow the sport a little bit.
And that's the problem now with Riis. Everyone saying that Riis should return his yellow jersey and the victory given to "the rightful winner" is nuts and taking a doublestand IMO. Because who is the rightful winner? No. 10? No. 20? No. 50?
__________________
5 wins - 11 losses
Record of The New England Patriots' before their first SuperBowl!
What i suspect is happening now is guys are coming out and admitting it before someone else "outs" them so they can control the spin on the story?
At least 3 former teammates of Lance's have now admitted it and that's just one team, it doesn't go back to his US postal team days when essentially the entire team has admitted doping except for Lance(and several teammates said he did).
One of my best friends was on US Postal team with Lance and was his best friend for quite a while before they had a falling out. While I can't say for sure, as I was not always around him, I would say he never doped and I believe him when he told me this. I have also had several conversations with him about Lance and other Postal Service team members and while he didn't outright say Lance doped he didn't deny it. He did tell me that not very many people on that team did, however he did give me a few names that were doping but it was far from essentially the entire team. I am not sure where you got that info.
One of my best friends was on US Postal team with Lance and was his best friend for quite a while before they had a falling out. While I can't say for sure, as I was not always around him, I would say he never doped and I believe him when he told me this. I have also had several conversations with him about Lance and other Postal Service team members and while he didn't outright say Lance doped he didn't deny it. He did tell me that not very many people on that team did, however he did give me a few names that were doping but it was far from essentially the entire team. I am not sure where you got that info.
I think Landis is guilty though.
But that the grey area I'm talking about. As a professional athlete, is it doping to take testotorone in connection with cancer treatment and continue taking it "to be on the safe side"?
__________________
5 wins - 11 losses
Record of The New England Patriots' before their first SuperBowl!
But that the grey area I'm talking about. As a professional athlete, is it doping to take testotorone in connection with cancer treatment and continue taking it "to be on the safe side"?
If the testosterone levels are within the limits of what is allowable than I don't see how it is doping in order to enhance performance. It is a grey area though and I don't know much about it. In Lance's case I believe he was taking testosterone to replace what his body was no longer able to take care of by itself. I know that when they test for certain banned substances they aren't just testing to see if they exist in your system but they are testing to see if they are over the allowable limit set forth. I don't follow the sport or Lance closely enough anymore to really comment much more. I pretty much go by what my friend has told me rather than journalists however.
One of my best friends was on US Postal team with Lance and was his best friend for quite a while before they had a falling out. While I can't say for sure, as I was not always around him, I would say he never doped and I believe him when he told me this. I have also had several conversations with him about Lance and other Postal Service team members and while he didn't outright say Lance doped he didn't deny it. He did tell me that not very many people on that team did, however he did give me a few names that were doping but it was far from essentially the entire team. I am not sure where you got that info.
I think Landis is guilty though.
It was years ago now but there was a Dateline NBC or similar show where they had a group of guys who had been on that team with Lance. They were talking about a specific doctor that injected them all with shots that they at the time were not sure what was in the shot. They of course assumed it was doping and they all said the whole team got the shots, including Lance.
it was weird because at the time several members of that team had suffered from very serious health problems at an abnormally young age. And this pre-dated Lance having cancer so at the time you watched this, you didn't know that LA would get something like that too. Could be coincidence of course but it sure sounded like whatever they were doing doping wise was somehow connected to the medical issues.
If anyone believed Armstrong was clean, that's ridiculous if you want to tell me a guy like Armstrong could win 7 straight Tour de France after having testicle cancer all that while competing against other top athletes that even admitted to doping?
People just don't want to believe it in Armstrongs case because they like this feel-good story.
If anyone believed Armstrong was clean, that's ridiculous if you want to tell me a guy like Armstrong could win 7 straight Tour de France after having testicle cancer all that while competing against other top athletes that even admitted to doping?
People just don't want to believe it in Armstrongs case because they like this feel-good story.
Or it could be the fact that he never tested positive in spite of being the most frequently tested athlete in the entire sports world.
__________________ "I carry a gun because a cop is too heavy".
Or it could be the fact that he never tested positive in spite of being the most frequently tested athlete in the entire sports world.
That's just it, most of those guys never tested positive. The tests have always been behind the technology used to cheat.
Remember the controversy was samples from years ago were tested and found to have EPO in them. That's because at the time those samples were given, there was no reliable test for EPO in urine, nobody knew then they'd be tripped up later. They saved the samples, years later they were used to test a procedure(they were literally trying to find out how far back that procedure could work) and surprise they found EPO in old samples that were completely anonymous to them when they ran the tests. Then they got access to the list to cross reference the samples, found out several were from Lance, and the whole thing wtih L' Equipe started.
Also, Lance did in fact test positive years ago, he said he had used a cream for saddle sores and that caused the result.
In July 1999, during the Tour de France that he was easily leading, Armstrong had a positive finding for steroid use. "I already knew about the steroid because Lance had told me," she is quoted as having said.
"He said he had used a steroid before or during the Route du Sud the month before, and he thought it would be OK for the Tour. He thought the drug would be completely eliminated from his body."
To resolve the looming scandal, she continues, Armstrong and two officials of his team decided to attribute the steroid to a cream used to treat saddle sores. Since Armstrong had not listed such a cream or treatment on his obligatory medical form, the team's doctor, according to this account, filled out a predated prescription.
At a news conference during the Tour, Armstrong explained the appearance of the steroid as a result of his treatment for a saddle sore.
Lance's excuse was that as a result of his recovery from testiclar cancer he was prone to saddle sores and had used a cream that caused the test. That cream was subseuqently banned, but Lance never had to prove it caused the result, and he didn't disclose in advance he was using it as was required.
Landis has a book coming out soon where he will tell the "real story" of how he won the TDF. He apparently notified the court since several chapters discuss his pending case which technically violates the court mandated gag order until his US hearing is over.
One of the more interesting things from his hearing is the case of Joe Papp. Papp is a middle of the pack rider who was suspended about a year before Landis' trial for synthetic testosterone in his system. He testified in the Landis case and said Landis and his team were being preposterous in claiming that doping with synthetic testosterone would be pointless, nobody would do it, and they're not even sure it was possible to do it. Papp said people do it all the time, he'd been doing it for years when he finally got caught, he was testifying because he thought Landis' claim was so outlandish it was embarassing.
Landis' team had a fascinating rebuttal, they claimed that Papp was testifying as part of a plea deal, that in exchange for his testimona, USADA gave Papp an extremely light suspension, one they called ridiculously low.
Now correct me if I'm wrong but doesn't that mean that Landis and his team are complaining that Papp's suspension was too short, even though they contend that what he was suspended for wouldn't work, nobody does it, and it's practically impossible to do? Why would they think he should get a longer suspension if they don't believe it's possible to do what he got suspended for?
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