Those who make peaceful protest impossible - Page 6

Folster · December 4th, 2011, 05:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by O

To think this has not been edted, and quite frankly a poor job of editing, is niave to say the least.

Youtube is full of videos that will contradict this.

It's all a matter of what you want to believe.

That's an odd thing to say considering you started this thread saying, "those who make peaceful protest impossible will make violent protests inevitable," based off a single picture depicting a mere fraction of a second of the entire event.

D-Dogg · December 4th, 2011, 05:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LVG

Here's a quick summary of the video.

The cops were there to clear out the occupy camp. There were other protesters off to the side. It appears that the cops made a number of arrests, and then the protesters outside of the camp decided to march to the detention area to demand the release of those arrested. When the march happened, either through accident or design, a group of cops found themselves surrounded by protesters. The protesters realized this and set themselves up around the cut off cops to prevent them from moving. After a period of time, the protesters offered to let the cops leave if they released those arrested. The cops refused. The cops then pepper strayed a section of protesters to "break out" from the encirclment of protesters. The cops then withdrew, ceding the grounds to the protesters.

There's more details, but that's the basic summary.
.

Except for in order to spray the protesters in the face, you see the cop step over their line, unimpeded. He stepped right over. No issues. He was outside the circle. They didn't tackle him, or trip him. He stepped right on over them.

The end. He had already broken out of the circle, and the rest could have done the same. It was a ludicrous case of excessive force on non-violent protesters.

D-Dogg · December 4th, 2011, 05:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RedStorm

So I was right. There was more to the story than was told by those initial pictures and videos.

On a second note, has anyone found anything to the accusation of Mr Brown that the police "forced" open people's mouths and sprayed pepper spray down their throats?

The same story was told in the article posted early on in this thread.

O · December 4th, 2011, 06:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Folster

That's an odd thing to say considering you started this thread saying, "those who make peaceful protest impossible will make violent protests inevitable," based off a single picture that depicting a mere fraction of a second of the entire event.

Well, I didn't say it JFK did.

Yet, you find one badly edited video, out of many that contardict said video, that supports what you think or want to think may have happened.

Neither of us were there but relying on Youtube videos for the truth is niave on both our parts.

I'm inclined to think that peaceful protest is a fundamental American right.
The only one's that used force here were the one's in body armor armed with lethal weaponery.

LVG · December 4th, 2011, 06:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Donald

Except for in order to spray the protesters in the face, you see the cop step over their line, unimpeded. He stepped right over. No issues. He was outside the circle. They didn't tackle him, or trip him. He stepped right on over them.

The end. He had already broken out of the circle, and the rest could have done the same. It was a ludicrous case of excessive force on non-violent protesters.

I don't dispute that at all. However, it seems to me that one of the priorities of the police, in that specific instance, would be to maintain group physical cohesion. This prohibited them from stepping over the protesters one at a time as it puts the cops in an even more vulnerable position.

Do not mistake my explanations for police officer justifications - they are not. The police put themselves in this position, and they were limited on their responses due to training and doctrine. The vast majority of fault I find in this situation lays with the police, not with the protesters. However, it is helpful to understand why both parties acted and responded the way they did.

Brian in Mesa · December 4th, 2011, 06:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by O

I'm inclined to think that peaceful protest is a fundamental American right.

It is a right, but it doesn't give anyone the right to be a jerk or break laws for trespassing, break curfews, block roadways and sidewalks, or ignore police requests, etc.

O · December 4th, 2011, 06:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brian in Mesa

It is a right, but it doesn't give anyone the right to be a jerk or break laws for trespassing, break curfews, block roadways and sidewalks, or ignore police requests, etc.

Dude, you're talking to me.
Don't make me get S.A.F.E involved!

Brian in Mesa · December 4th, 2011, 07:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by O

Dude, you're talking to me.
Don't make me get S.A.F.E involved!

conraddobler · December 4th, 2011, 08:29 PM

I'm sure both sides embelished their side of the story, the entire encircled thing I brought up very early on in the thread as their stated reason.

Fine it's their stated reason, it still does not give them the right to pepper spray seated people.

If you think it does, then enjoy the country you are building it's simply unfortuneate that we're all strapped to this ride with you.

RugbyMuffin · December 6th, 2011, 11:24 AM

cheesebeef · December 6th, 2011, 03:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RedStorm

So I was right. There was more to the story than was told by those initial pictures and videos.

lol... I was right. i love those who hold themselves up as Christians and then are advocates of violence on others, seemingly in most every instance... supporting war, death penalty, excessive use of force on non-violent protestors. seems like the attitude Jesus would have taken.

RedStorm · December 6th, 2011, 03:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cheesebeef

lol... I was right. i love those who hold themselves up as Christians and then are advocates of violence on others, seemingly in most every instance... supporting war, death penalty, excessive use of force on non-violent protestors. seems like the attitude Jesus would have taken.

My point was...way back in this thread... that there was MORE to the STORY besides the picture being posted. I NEVER said it was right. I only said lets wait until the WHOLE story gets out. Which I dont think it is...I think there is still an investigation going on.

I bet if Jesus was around you would have been one hammering the nails in his hands and feet the way you jump to accuse. Let me hear you say..."Crucify Him!!! Crucify Him!!!".... You would run well with that crowd.

Divide Et Impera · December 6th, 2011, 04:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RedStorm

I bet if Jesus was around you would have been one hammering the nails in his hands and feet the way you jump to accuse. Let me hear you say..."Crucify Him!!! Crucify Him!!!".... You would run well with that crowd.

This is insane because it makes no sense and it is highly inflamatory.

Brian in Mesa · December 6th, 2011, 05:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RedStorm

I bet if Jesus was around you would have been one hammering the nails in his hands and feet the way you jump to accuse. Let me hear you say..."Crucify Him!!! Crucify Him!!!".... You would run well with that crowd.

According to all the sermons/messages I've ever heard we all would have been in the crowd that day calling for Barabbas to go free in one breath and saying "Crucify Him!" (Him being Jesus) in the next.

RedStorm · December 6th, 2011, 06:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Divide Et Impera

This is insane because it makes no sense and it is highly inflamatory.

In light of his comments made because of my faith it makes perfect sense and it is no more inflammatory than his (as well as yours at times).