Arizona Sports Fans Network  

Go Back   Arizona Sports Fans Network > Other Stuff > Politics and Religion


Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old November 7th, 2004, 07:03 AM   #1
Chris_Sanders
Super Moderator
 
Chris_Sanders's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Scottsdale, Az
Age: 42
Posts: 19,332
Send a message via ICQ to Chris_Sanders Send a message via AIM to Chris_Sanders

The Problem We Democrats Face


I think the biggest problem we Democrats face in the next four years is a lack of national figures.

John Kerry personified this issue.

Most people had no idea who he was when he won the Democratic primary. Since he had no national identity, it was exceedingly easy for Republicans to paint him into whatever they wished.

I believe this is why we have the Barack Obama phenomenon because Democrats are desperate for anyone that is truely charismatic to step into the forefront of the party.




__________________
Oh, I am sorry. I don't know how this machine works.
Chris_Sanders is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 7th, 2004, 07:17 AM   #2
Chris_Sanders
Super Moderator
 
Chris_Sanders's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Scottsdale, Az
Age: 42
Posts: 19,332
Send a message via ICQ to Chris_Sanders Send a message via AIM to Chris_Sanders
Further along this lines, while the last election proved to be a veritible liberal renassiance, meaning that it became "cool" to be a liberal again...

Yet we cannot claim to be the party of middle America and yet try to exclude middle America from our policies. Liberals are often assosciated with having elitist tendencies, a perception that they think they are better than you...

Nothing exemplified this further than Kerouac's "Jesusland" avatar. We pay lip service to President Bush's "You are with us or against us" line...but then we foster the same exact thing by denigrating the opinion of the majority of America.

Democrats are supposed to be the Populist Party. A party of the people and for the people. This simply will not happen until we find a way to recapture the minds and ideals of America.
__________________
Oh, I am sorry. I don't know how this machine works.
Chris_Sanders is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 7th, 2004, 07:29 AM   #3
40yearfan
DEFENSE!!!!
 
40yearfan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Phoenix, AZ.
Posts: 32,215
Chris, it goes deeper than that. I've been trying to find the column from Doug MacEachern in the Republic today in the Viewpoints section to post on here. Democrats have been so vocally angry and vicious over this election that they have turned off a large portion of the swing voter population that they used to count on for support. Having Michael Moore as one of your leading proponents has hurt this party more than you can imagine.

I am a lifelong Republican, but I know that this country cannot stand to have only the conservative point of view. We need free thinkers, people who worry about the poor, women's rights advocates, environmental worrywarts, etc. and these people all come from the liberal side of the equation. It's what gives us balance and makes this country the greatest this world has ever known.

The Demos have got to get over this anger and start to pull together. Finger pointing and name calling is not going to work. If they can't figure out that the American public will no longer just blindly follow an ideaology, they will disintegrate and fall apart. They need to learn to give the American public credit, that they are not "fools" because they voted for Bush. Maybe some of the vote was even backlash against anyone in the Demo party because of the nasty rhetoric during the campaign. Look at Gore, T. Kennedy, Dean, Moore and you can see how some people would find their rantings to be very uncomfortable. People don't like to be threatened and warned, especially by politicians/Hollywood types who consider the vast majority of Americans to be beneath them.
__________________
Old age isn't so bad when you consider the alternative.
40yearfan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 7th, 2004, 07:43 AM   #4
Chris_Sanders
Super Moderator
 
Chris_Sanders's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Scottsdale, Az
Age: 42
Posts: 19,332
Send a message via ICQ to Chris_Sanders Send a message via AIM to Chris_Sanders
I agree completely.

The time for crying over spilled milk is over. It is time to examine how to make gains in governors, the house, and the senate in 2 years. The key to this is to understand WHY this last election went against you, not act like you were entitled to win.

I personally have a realistic view and I think that the Presidential election held a lot of positives for Democrats. It is nearly impossible to remove an incumbent president during wartime...especially one who is as likable as President Bush is. And before I hear from my fellow Democrats on this about Bush's intelligence, policies, or whatever...

The simple fact is that he is a likable and charismatic man. He connects well with people. This is half of any political battle.
__________________
Oh, I am sorry. I don't know how this machine works.
Chris_Sanders is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 7th, 2004, 07:47 AM   #5
Chris_Sanders
Super Moderator
 
Chris_Sanders's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Scottsdale, Az
Age: 42
Posts: 19,332
Send a message via ICQ to Chris_Sanders Send a message via AIM to Chris_Sanders
Quote:
Originally Posted by 40yearfan
Look at Gore, T. Kennedy, Dean, Moore and you can see how some people would find their rantings to be very uncomfortable. People don't like to be threatened and warned, especially by politicians/Hollywood types who consider the vast majority of Americans to be beneath them.
If Bush is as some say he is, then patience is all you need. If your conviction is that Bush is going to ruin America...then just be quiet and let the focus be on him.
__________________
Oh, I am sorry. I don't know how this machine works.
Chris_Sanders is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 7th, 2004, 07:53 AM   #6
ajcardfan
I see you.
 
ajcardfan's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2002
Posts: 20,779
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris_Sanders
The simple fact is that he is a likable and charismatic man. He connects well with people. This is half of any political battle.
And that is really how Clinton defeated Bush Sr. Everyone remembers "It's the economy stupid!" from that election. But, more people just liked Clinton better.

The economy was in even worse shape this time, and I thought that would be just enough to sink Bush in a state like Ohio and Kerry would squeak out a win. I mean, we've been paying more for health care, and filling up our cars for over 2$ a gallon. And, in the end, it didn't really matter.
__________________
We live in a world which is full of misery and ignorance, and the plain duty of each and all of us is to try to make the little corner he can influence somewhat less miserable and somewhat less ignorant than it was before he entered it.

T.H. Huxley
ajcardfan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 7th, 2004, 01:57 PM   #7
vince56
Registered
 
vince56's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Arizona
Posts: 7,285
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris_Sanders
I believe this is why we have the Barack Obama phenomenon because Democrats are desperate for anyone that is truely charismatic to step into the forefront of the party.
Obama is really bright too, but I fear this country is not ready for a president of color or one whose name is so close to Osama. Call me kooky, but both of those moronic ideas will be what stops him.

His speech at the DNC was moving.
vince56 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 7th, 2004, 03:36 PM   #8
Shane
I'm Coming for YOU!
 
Shane's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Las Vegas
Age: 41
Posts: 48,076
Quote:
Originally Posted by vince56
Obama is really bright too, but I fear this country is not ready for a president of color or one whose name is so close to Osama. Call me kooky, but both of those moronic ideas will be what stops him.

His speech at the DNC was moving.
He will never be President of this country.
Shane is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 7th, 2004, 04:37 PM   #9
Ryanwb
Banned
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Mesa
Posts: 35,579
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris_Sanders
I believe this is why we have the Barack Obama phenomenon because Democrats are desperate for anyone that is truely charismatic to step into the forefront of the party.
I think you are wrong on the Barack Obama front. Alan Keys was thrown into the mix by the Republicans. He had never even lived in Illinois prior (I think he was a resident of Virginia???) and flip flopped on a lot of issues.... He wanted to give a tax break that would exempt the descendants of slaves from income taxes for at least a generation after saying reperations were an issult to the slave ancesotors

Obama was elected becuase the people of Illinois are not stupid, they realized the bait and switch that was occuring by the Republicans.
Ryanwb is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 7th, 2004, 05:05 PM   #10
cheesebeef
Registered User
 
cheesebeef's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Age: 38
Posts: 35,273
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shane H
He will never be President of this country.
are you saying that because he's black? If so - I agree with you. This country's not evolved enough for a black or female President yet - although an Austrian one might be up their alley!
__________________
Rubarb is what makes my feet look cheese!

Mulli is smarter than the Cheese!
cheesebeef is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 7th, 2004, 05:13 PM   #11
Brian in Mesa
BIMô
 
Brian in Mesa's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: The Dark Side
Age: 43
Posts: 43,834
Send a message via MSN to Brian in Mesa Send a message via Yahoo to Brian in Mesa
Quote:
Originally Posted by cheesebeef
This country's not evolved enough for a black or female President yet...
I totally disagree.

If Colin Powell ran against Hillary Clinton...are you suggesting Ralph Nader would be elected?

__________________
"If you dug Adrian Wilson's nachos, you're gonna be all hot dogs and apple pie about safety Deone Bucannon." - Elliot Harrison, @HarrisonNFL
Brian in Mesa is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 7th, 2004, 05:16 PM   #12
Assface
Like a boss
 
Assface's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Tempe
Age: 36
Posts: 15,088
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian in Mesa
I totally disagree.

If Colin Powell ran against Hillary Clinton...are you suggesting Ralph Nader would be elected?

Good luck getting any voter turnout in the southeast with that kind of election.
__________________
RIP King of Cards
Tim Minnick 9/12/1972-3/4/2007
You'll be missed.
Assface is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 7th, 2004, 05:18 PM   #13
40yearfan
DEFENSE!!!!
 
40yearfan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: Phoenix, AZ.
Posts: 32,215
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian in Mesa
I totally disagree.

If Colin Powell ran against Hillary Clinton...are you suggesting Ralph Nader would be elected?

__________________
Old age isn't so bad when you consider the alternative.
40yearfan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 7th, 2004, 05:36 PM   #14
Chris_Sanders
Super Moderator
 
Chris_Sanders's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Scottsdale, Az
Age: 42
Posts: 19,332
Send a message via ICQ to Chris_Sanders Send a message via AIM to Chris_Sanders
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ryanwb
I think you are wrong on the Barack Obama front. Alan Keys was thrown into the mix by the Republicans. He had never even lived in Illinois prior (I think he was a resident of Virginia???) and flip flopped on a lot of issues.... He wanted to give a tax break that would exempt the descendants of slaves from income taxes for at least a generation after saying reperations were an issult to the slave ancesotors

Obama was elected becuase the people of Illinois are not stupid, they realized the bait and switch that was occuring by the Republicans.
I am not saying that Barack shouldn't have been elected. I think he is a bright and fine politician.

I believe though that he is a bit "green" to be launched into the party forefront. It is indicitive of how little personality the party has right now.
__________________
Oh, I am sorry. I don't know how this machine works.
Chris_Sanders is offline   Reply With Quote
Old November 7th, 2004, 06:01 PM   #15
krepitch
Moderator
 
krepitch's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Phoenix
Age: 36
Posts: 13,881
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shane H
He will never be President of this country.
krepitch is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Tags
howard dean, john kerry, ray lewis



Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off


Sitemap:1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 31 32 33 34 35 36 37 38
 



Latest Threads
- by Zeno
- by Shane
- by DarenG
 




All times are GMT -8. The time now is 09:55 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Copyright © 2002 - 2014 ArizonaSportsFans.com
Inactive Reminders By Icora Web Design