Wowsers! Guess what Obama Health Care will cost you!

Discussion in 'Politics and Religion' started by CaptTurbo, Jul 20, 2009.

  1. RugbyMuffin

    RugbyMuffin D-Fence & Go Cardinals!

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    I dunno.

    Maybe I should right a book. Because an extra 50k a year would allow for me to do so much more that it hurts my brain thinking about it.

    Heck, if I made 10k more a year, I really would have no fincial worry. Where is all this money that people have going towards ? New Jersey is ridiculously expensive beyond what many would deem exceptable taxation, yet even with that situation, and being paid (what seems to be) lower than normal. I am able to make it work.

    I couldn't imagine making 70k or more a year, and having financial problems of any sort.
     
  2. RugbyMuffin

    RugbyMuffin D-Fence & Go Cardinals!

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    Hmmm.

    Well, I am at quite the opposite. I graduated from a school with a lot of engineers. I have yet, to meet more than 4 or 5 out of the 25 I graduated with that make any where near 70k a year.

    I would jump at the oppourtunity to make that kind of money.

    Funny you should bring teaching into the equation. My wife who graduated with a biology degree is currently going to school to become a teacher so that she can make MORE money than she does now.

    Hence, why I deem oppourtunity to be such a key in success. Both my wife an I are educated, hard working people. Never miss work, never late on bills, and trying to be as frugal as possible. We keep our ears open for "THE" oppourtunity.

    Whether it comes or not is somewhat out of our hands. The country being in a recession more times than not since leaving school isn't helping either.

    Ah whatever. As I said I think this discussion is over my head.
     
  3. Russ Smith

    Russ Smith The Original Whizzinator Contributor

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    Well yes and no. That's why I never understand the complaints against Microsoft, do people not realize how many millionaires were made by Microsoft? Not just their employees, others who started businesses that depended on Microsoft got rich too.

    Lots of very rich people have created jobs for lots of less fortunate people, generally speaking it's the high wage people that create the most jobs.

    If you tax them to death there's no incentive to take the risks they take and the result would be less job creation.

    As it is now I stand to benefit from the Obama plan because it figures to be cheaper than Cobra which I'm on currently. That said I think taxing the rich at the rates he's proposing is wrong, it's a disincentive to achieve.

    It seems he's counting on signing up millions into his plan which will reduce the medical charges by economies of scale, but he's not really sure that will work or not. It's entirely possible lots of people that don't have coverage now will flood the market going to the doctor over and over now that they have coverage. It's very difficult to plan for expenses like that they have no idea how common that will be.
     
  4. 82CardsGrad

    82CardsGrad 7 x 70 Contributor

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    Hard to make these points Russ to those who see the solutions to problems sitting inside the beltway... (not saying you fit into that mindset Rugby - though I'm not sure...).
     
  5. RugbyMuffin

    RugbyMuffin D-Fence & Go Cardinals!

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    Agreed.

    But the arguement also can be made that if you tax the lower class to death you are trying to get blood from stone.

    Some will give once the consumers you rely upon can no longer consume. Not to mention a wage is no good if it cannot buy anything.

    What good is 30k if it takes 35k to keep the most bargin basement frugal lifestyle afloat in said society.
     
  6. Ryanwb

    Ryanwb Banned

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    I agree, how would I pay for my McMansion, my two SUVs, jet skis, my 3 kid's (under 12 years old) cell phone bills, my annual trips to the wine country and the Florida Keys. Not to mention supporting my wife's Ebay addiction and my fine wine collection that is getting pretty respectible.

    I wouldn't even begin to margianlize how someone could live on a paultry $120,000. This country has lost its priorities
     
  7. Duckjake

    Duckjake Registered

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    You don't have a wife and children? :D
     
  8. RugbyMuffin

    RugbyMuffin D-Fence & Go Cardinals!

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    Don't blame you for being unsure. I am a bit of a flip flopper, sometimes I come from the right, sometimes the left. Most of the times, I am useless :D

    There is a validity to the points Russ makes, 82. I have yet to say anything against that. There is a valid complaint to what is happening with this 58% tax. No doubt.

    Thanks for the new term but I do not believe the solutions to our problem are "sitting inside the beltway". Our government does a glorious job of screwing up everything they touch, and stealing a massive amount of money from our own pockets. (I can talk about corruption but that goes way OT).

    While I believe that every US CITIZEN, that pays taxes, and all of their taxes should be medically cared for, I certainly do not have faith that Washington knows what to do.

    Just to remind you, you are talking to a person who would LOVE for our federal government to downsize, for local (state) governments to have more power.


    But the topic of discussion on this thread is one of tax brackets, and who should be paying what.

    My debate is not FOR some ridiculously unfair, uncalled for tax increase that is completely screwing one tax bracket.

    My debate and arguements are for the fact that I feel the government has NO idea what the average person in this country earns, and what he can sustain with what he earns.

    As well as that a person who earns more, should give more back. That no matter what we all benefit from society. How ever you get to your current position, is not the point. The point is you are getting this much out, and should put this much in.

    And if I were running the show that would be the case, but it would be fairly distributed (as SWD showed, by way of a percentage or something logical like that).

    A balance must be made. You can't tax the hell out of the have's because it kills innovation, and grow. You can't tax the hell out of the have not's cause they already don't have anything. Your consumers cannot consume, and they cannot "live" either thus creating the dead wieght effect of "welfare for life" citizen who is constantly writing a check he can't cash. (and it ain't for a new TV 90% of the time, it is for medical expenses).

    Tomorrow, I will write up a thread, on how I think this all should be handled. Give it a read, tell me what you think.
     
  9. RugbyMuffin

    RugbyMuffin D-Fence & Go Cardinals!

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    Got a wife. Can't afford to have a kid. :sad:
     
  10. Russ Smith

    Russ Smith The Original Whizzinator Contributor

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    But our taxes have been reduced not increased until now. The "rich" already pay a higher percentage of total tax revenue. I have no problem with increasing taxes, but do it across the board fairly.

    But then I'm very much in the flat tax camp and I know everytime that comes up we're told it would cost too many jobs(no need for the IRS or tax preparers).
     
  11. DWKB

    DWKB Registered

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    Appreciate it, but I'm in Arkansas now.


    BTW, the surtax the house Democrats proposed, is for all intents, dead.
     
  12. 40yearfan

    40yearfan DEFENSE!!!! Contributor

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    He's just joshing you DW. Looks like you have yourself set up pretty well. Makes me feel good to know that the American dream is still being realized.
     
  13. Absolute Zero

    Absolute Zero Registered User

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    Looks like the scare tactics are out in force.
     
  14. MigratingOsprey

    MigratingOsprey Thank You Paul!

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    amazing how they can take hold when legitimate questions are left with no answers

    like, how is this getting paid for again?!
     
  15. conraddobler

    conraddobler I want my 2$

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    It seems to me in this whole debate I personally can see a pattern, IMO of course.

    The pattern is that people have come to rely on government to regulate their quality of life, jobs, health care, schooling, consumer laws, now banking and now autos.

    Folks, I'm the first to say that you can and should treat health care differently but see the problem is that we've ALREADY gone down the path of letting government into everything.

    In the 1800's when this nation really started getting built, the Federal government didn't give you squat but an army and some trade rules.

    Now it's morphing into your employer, your education, your economic guru, your nest egg provider, your watchdog, your doctor and soon it's going to mandate your carbon emissions.

    I'd like government to get out of a ton of things before it gets into healthcare, the path is unsustainable, it's a path to state control of your life.
     

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